[Crash11]

I'm new to the modern-day avr's, and I'm curious about something. When I watch movies, I'm usually putting the volume around -5db to 0 db. Is 0 db the perfect point for a receiver/speakers? Or is it better to be as low as possible?


In other words, if I'm at 0 db normally and happy, should I be upgrading my receiver to a higher power output with bigger speakers?

 

[Easyaspie]

The guys from Spinal Tap think that 11 is the ideal volume position.

Seriously though, the position of your volume knob is relative to how you have your system calibrated. Do you have a SPL meter? Did you calibrate to 75db at "0" on the knob? What is your actual volume in db at "0"?

 

[Lhasa-lover]

The ideal volume position is the position where the sound is loud enough for your personal taste but not so loud as to cause hearing damage. Regardless of where on the dial that is.

 

[bluesky636]

Set the volume control to just below the point where your ears start to bleed.

 

[Crash11]

Wow, I was expecting a more theoretical approach on these boards. I guess around here it's more of a crude approach. Anyway, I guess I'll take these answers to mean that I'm fine.

 

[Lhasa-lover]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash11 /forum/post/18190616


Wow, I was expecting a more theoretical approach on these boards. I guess around here it's more of a crude approach. Anyway, I guess I'll take these answers to mean that I'm fine.

Some things just aint' rocket science, much as we'd like them to be. Assuming your system is calibrated, turn it up to where you like it. Pretty simple.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover /forum/post/18190667


.... turn it up to where you like it. Pretty simple.

Or until your wife tells you to turn it down!

 

[Crash11]

Yeah that's what I do. The main reason for asking this question is that someday I'll move my theater downstairs into a bigger room (probably about twice the cubic volume), and I'm curious how much more power I might need.


Funny you mentioned the wife thing: the other day I was trying to show her how great the opening to Top Gun sounded by cranking up the volume. She just sat there holding her hands over her ears.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash11 /forum/post/18190616


Wow, I was expecting a more theoretical approach on these boards. I guess around here it's more of a crude approach. Anyway, I guess I'll take these answers to mean that I'm fine.

In all seriousness, if you enjoy the level that you play things at and there is no distortion present in the sound, it really isn't rocket science.

 

[penngray]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash11 /forum/post/18190695


Yeah that's what I do. The main reason for asking this question is that someday I'll move my theater downstairs into a bigger room (probably about twice the cubic volume), and I'm curious how much more power I might need.


Funny you mentioned the wife thing: the other day I was trying to show her how great the opening to Top Gun sounded by cranking up the volume. She just sat there holding her hands over her ears.

You will require measuring tools, like a SPL meter.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash11 /forum/post/18190695


Yeah that's what I do. The main reason for asking this question is that someday I'll move my theater downstairs into a bigger room (probably about twice the cubic volume), and I'm curious how much more power I might need.

Now that is a different question. Keep in mind that in order to double the apparent loudness of a sound, you have to increase the sound pressure level (SPL) in the room by 10 dB. However, doubling the power output of an amplifier only results in an increase in SPL of 3 dB which is audible but not significantly so. You would have to double the amp power a little over 3 times to double the loudness in the room:


Starting with a 100 watt amp


100 x 2 = 200 watts (3 dB)


200 x 2 = 400 watts (6 dB)


400 x 2 = 800 watts (9 dB)


800 x 1.5 = 1000 watts (about 1 dB)


So, if you have a 100 watt/channel amp and normally listen at an average SPL of 110 dB (way to loud, but chosen for simplicity), doubling the loudness level (increase by 10 dB) to 120 dB would require about 1000 watts/channel. Note that this is a very simplified explanation of what is going on.

 

[penngray]



Quote:
So, if you have a 100 watt/channel amp and normally listen at an average SPL of 75 dB, doubling the loudness level (increase by 10 dB) to 85 dB would require about 800 watts/channel. Note that this is a very simplified explanation of what is going on.

That is sounding way to confusing and very inaccurate.


First 75dB is generally much less then 1 Watt since speakers with 90dB sensitivity only need 1 Watt to product 90 dBs

100W is about +20dB of gain so 100W into a 90dB speaker is 110dBs.


Lets just not assume that the "0" setting on the AVR = 75dB because its never that simple.


Room gain, speaker sensitivity and so on will matter in terms of what "0" means. Most people set their "0" to a high SPL reference level and NOT 75dB.


Conclusion "0" = some high SPL level that does not really matter.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray /forum/post/18190829


That is sounding way to confusing and very inaccurate.


First 75dB is generally much less then 1 Watt since speakers with 90dB sensitivity only need 1 Watt to product 90 dBs

100W is about +20dB of gain so 100W into a 90dB speaker is 110dBs.


Lets just not assume that the "0" setting on the AVR = 75dB because its never that simple.


Room gain, speaker sensitivity and so on will matter in terms of what "0" means. Most people set their "0" to a high SPL reference level and NOT 75dB.


Conclusion "0" = some high SPL level that does not really matter.

Note my disclaimer. I never said my numbers were real. All I was doing was showing a mathematical relationship. I have changed my numbers from "75 dB" and "85 dB" to "110 dB and "120 dB".

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesky636 /forum/post/18190776


Note that this is a very simplified explanation of what is going on.

 

[Lhasa-lover]

How did I know that we would take something simple and turn it into something complicated?

If/When you move to your new setup area, recalibrate your speakers and turn up the volume until it's loud enough for you. If it clips, buy more power.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Lhasa-lover /forum/post/18191331


How did I know that we would take something simple and turn it into something complicated?

We're AVS. Its what we do!

 

[RoboRay]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash11 /forum/post/18190616


Wow, I was expecting a more theoretical approach on these boards. I guess around here it's more of a crude approach. Anyway, I guess I'll take these answers to mean that I'm fine.

One problem is that the numbers on the display don't really mean anything. Well, they do have a meaning, but there are so many variables in play that you can't use them for comparison to anyone else's numbers, even if they have the exact same model receiver.


Whenever you do move your receiver to a bigger space, if you feel that it doesn't have enough power, you may be able to add an external amp to help it out (assuming your receiver has pre-out jacks on the back). But you'd probably want to look at speaker efficiency, too. It's usually cheaper to get more usable power by buying more efficient speakers than to buy a bigger amp.

 

[Lhasa-lover]



Quote:
Originally Posted by RoboRay /forum/post/18193302


...It's usually cheaper to get more usable power by buying more efficient speakers than to buy a bigger amp.

I don't know what speakers you buy but for many of us, this is very far from the truth. You can buy a power amp anywhere from $1,000-$1,500. Hell, many of us have more than that invested in just the front mains alone, not even counting the center channel and rear speakers. My center channel alone exceeds the cost of a power amp.

 

[MichaelJHuman]

There is no standard volume setting because program material differs in average and peak level!


For movies which use the THX standard of being mixed for an average level of -20 dB from full scale, you might find that a certain setting works well for those movies. But you still might find you adjust volume during movies if it gets too loud on peaks.


But for music, TV and video gaming, you would likely be all over the place.

 

[penngray]



Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesky636 /forum/post/18191181


Note my disclaimer. I never said my numbers were real. All I was doing was showing a mathematical relationship. I have changed my numbers from "75 dB" and "85 dB" to "110 dB and "120 dB".

ah,