[hob]

Blu-ray is *on* , JVC on group member D-Vhs has 2 years or less before the format will be taken on by(405 mm Blue-violet laser) HD-DVD 27 gigabyte single layer discs using MPEG 2 as transport stream which makes the Blu-ray datastream compatible with DTV.


Page 24 & 26 Hitachi, Panasonic, Philips,

Pioneer, Samsung, Sharp, Sony, and Thomson are all behind the initiative. No format war is expected. They all feel that a HD-DVD is just what is needed for HDTV to take off! They are concentrating on getting the 27 gig disc out, before working on the 50 Gig dual layer which will be released shortly after 27 gig has taken a foot hold.



Guys/Gals AVS this looks like a positive signal, It's my opinion JVC ingnited this because of their D-Vhs scheme to become the first on the block. I know myself that I don't want to go back to rewinding tapes again, I don't believe many of you do either. If you want to throw money out the window for 2 years be my guest, besides the stupid rewinding time. I am glad to give you this news, that's what is the joy or thrill of being a subscriber to 5 Home Theatre magazines is like. Some since 1992 and 3 Computer magazines. I like to stay on 'top' of things in this ever changing world of ours!



The question is of this forum what company of the above listed, do you *think* will be the first out, with the long awaited HD-DVD we really do want?


I'll be the first and say Sony, because of their pioneering efforts that pay off!

 

[uncle eric]

Hob,

My opinion is that the quicker the failure of the taped HD format, the quicker HD-DVD will be brought into play, Blu-ray or not.

If these money grabers are making enough bucks from tape, (which I doubt very much), I expect them to string us all out regarding HD-DVD.


Eric

 

[WanMan]

Don't forget about two other companies developing 12-centimeter high-capacity (i.e. 100GB) solutions. Constellation 3D and their FMD and InPhase and their Holographic DVDs are destined to be potential usefuls in the prerecorded marketplace.


It is amusing, though, that one rag writes '2 years' and another '3-5 years', but I feel that until certain manufacturing conditions are overcome none of them will be worth waiting on. Not advocating D-VHS (magnetic tape is about as evil as it gets), but creative solutions can probably be made ready now.

 

[hob]

I am gearing up for a two year countdown on getting HD-DVD. WanMan is saying that recording tape is evil. You sound like some of the residents, that tell me Rock and Roll is evil. I am sure glad I am in a reality world. I live each day as it comes

not part of it but realizing it exists.

 

[Per Johnny]

I would love to see this scenario happen, but I am skeptical and will bet that it will go at least 4 years before we see any software. Of course I would be happy to have it tomorrow.


I live outside the US, and the only way to see HD is thru DVHS, so I will not look at it as throwing away money. I will enjoy DVHS until a disc-based HD appears. I thank JVC for making that happen!


Per Johnny Ødegaard

 

[Hank527]

DVHS still has merit if only in recording of HD only. Blue Ray recording is probably 5-7 years off. + DVHS titles will be superior to a 27 gig HD-DVD. The inclusion of DTS 96/24 will be awesome. DVHS well we all know it is a temporary solution its a good one. That will us to archive now!

 

[WanMan]

Quote:

Originally posted by hob I am gearing up for a two year countdown on getting HD-DVD. WanMan is saying that recording tape is evil. You sound like some of the residents, that tell me Rock and Roll is evil. I am sure glad I am in a reality world. I live each day as it comes not part of it but realizing it exists.

Hey! I'm only looking out for all of us! Why should we settle for magnetic tape with a VERY limited shelf-life and high-wear condition upon multiple playback?


I could have sworn that the whole reason why we moved away from audio cassette tapes and VHS tapes (to CDs and DVDs) was because we wanted a high-wear, long shelf-life for our libraries. If this is not the case then why bother with any libraries in your home and simply go the Video-On-Demand route! Hehe


BTW, if someone were to introduce a re-writable 10" HD-DVD/MPEG-2 product and at least some of the studios were going to support this with a LD-style (i.e. thick-disc that's warp-free) prerecorded movies, would anyone be interested if it hit the market by mid-Summer?

 

[hob]

Will our present HDTV at minimum 1080 X 1080 be enogh to see our HD-DVD discs? I own a RCA 1280 X 1080 or 1,382,400 pixel

can we use our present DVD players with blu ray discs. I believe future DVP will have both a blu and a red laser and 2nd or 3rd generation will have only a blue laser

 

[mrmurdstone]

I think everyone is forgetting about the DVI/Firewire connection debacle that is killing all high resolution playback formats right now.


Until we get that straightened out (and by that I mean, defeated since they want to put so many copy protection schemes into the playback that we will all have to buy new equipment...weeeee!) I think this is just a pipe dream.

 

[WanMan]

Hob, I'm not sure I understand the question. First, depending on your display and the source the amount of pixel-equivalent information will vary and the loss of some of that information do to rescaling of the display must be recognized.


I am not an HD authority by any means. Also, be a little more detailed regarding your 'RCA' because 1280 x 1080 isn't 4:3, 16:9, or any other the other typical formats. Utilizing the maximum width (1280) for a 16:9 HD source would only use 720 lines and leave blanks on the top & bottom of your screen. And running 1080i source material will undoubtedly require scaling as your RCA is not one of the standard HD formats--call me on this if I'm wrong.

 

[WanMan]

Quote:

Originally posted by mrmurdstone I think everyone is forgetting about the DVI/Firewire connection debacle that is killing all high resolution playback formats right now. Until we get that straightened out (and by that I mean, defeated since they want to put so many copy protection schemes into the playback that we will all have to buy new equipment...weeeee!) I think this is just a pipe dream.

The need for a [pure] digital interface from source to display is easily recognized as it would eliminate unwanted condition in the DA-AD and AD-DA conversions.


With DVi being limited to 6-feet of cable length it would be poorly suited to a lot of home theaters. What is worse is that there are three format of DVi and most manufacture reps can't tell you squat about the technical nature of their own implementation of DVI!


If I sound like an advocate of IEEE1394 then you 'probably' wouldn't be far off base, but I would accept anything that allows enough bandwidth for uncompressed HD (that's 1200 Megabits per second!) across a data conduit capable of greater than 2 meters and with allowances for two-way communications between devices (a la HAVi).


We can call this the Smurf connection for all I care as long as it provides a set standard for all manufacturers, gives the consumer unbridled data transport, protects studios interests (copyright protection on prerecorded materials), and interfaces seemlessly with components from various manufacturers.


Sony may have embraced DVI, but find me ONE Sony rep that can explain their DVI in technical detail so the market can judge for itself if its good or bad. Unfortunately, I see a lot of proprietary behavior in the manufacturer's market as that don't give a squat's concern about you or I, but to protect their interests exclusively.


Boy, am I a hard ash or what?

 

[Dean Roddey]

Firewire to the device is going to end up being a stone around our neck in the long term, because its going to put an MPEG decoder in every device. Now, what if you have some non-MPEG based video that you'd like to send to that display device? Or what if you have some MPEG-4 (or upcoming MPEG-X) Are you going to have to have a real time MPEG encoder and/or transcoder in the system? And what happens when some completely new format comes along? If we'd have gone this route with DVD, you'd probably have to replace your set even though it was already digital to the set, unless the manufacturer just happened to have thought far enough ahead to make it capable of handling HD level signals.


We need something halfway between the two, so that it sends lightly compressed, generic video over a decent distance. But given that no one seems to be talking about anything but the two (bad) choices, I don't think its likely to happen.

 

[Kevin Snyder]

I also would not be surprised if hd-DVD was a reality in approximately 2 years. What I also believe, though, is that PRERECORDED hd-DVD titles will still not be available for 1-2 years after that. What I'm saying is that although the medium may exist technologically in such a short time period, I do believe we'll all be waiting longer for the prerecorded content.


Also, I am hopeful that an hd-dvd format will exist to provide us with the same bandwidth of d-VHS. If an hd-dvd format cannot even equal the picture quality of new d-vhs, then I'm afraid we're lost.


Kevin

 

[hob]

27 gigs of information on a single layer disc, man this a lot more than some of the CPU that have only a 20 Gig Hard Drive! Yes is the answer to your question they were saying in Stereophile Guide To Home Theatre there would be pre-recorded discs for sale!



This group of 9 want to do something that JVC did to Sony, remember even though Beta was clearly superior. Small designed cassette opening, wouldn't give the people what they wanted. JVC filled the void by giving them up to 6 hours of recording, I always used SP on the best tape I could buy. There are lot of uneducated Joe six packs that want a he*l of load of content for their large appetite. Joe Six pack is uneducated to what *we* know for we are 'educated' in the A/V field IMHO!

 

[Victor Dakak]

Quote:

Originally posted by WanMan Hey! I'm only looking out for all of us! Why should we settle for magnetic tape with a VERY limited shelf-life and high-wear condition upon multiple playback? I could have sworn that the whole reason why we moved away from audio cassette tapes and VHS tapes (to CDs and DVDs) was because we wanted a high-wear, long shelf-life for our libraries.

Wan, remember this is digital, not analog. The HD-VHS tape will not suffer the same problems as analog VHS. It's been stated that no deterioriation will appear for at least 100 plays. Going by various reports, that is more than some DVDs can handle! There's no reason why an HD-VHS tape can't last as long as a DVD. And in some cases, maybe longer!

 

[Sean Max]

It's still a linear playback format. Try skipping around to your favorite scenes on that. And forget special features as well. Maybe a commentary track.

 

[hob]

I aggree with you for all the 718 plus 12 I picked up at a walmart today on my day "Out", man that fresh air put me to sleep for 2 hours when returning.



I have only seen 3 of te discs extras, Dirty Dancing, The Sixth Sense and the Directors cut of ST 1 from 1979. All the rest I just have never read if available.

I am a movie magic watcher, I don't want to bug the magician for *how* it was done!

 

[Dan Hitchman]

If Blue-Ray is a go then they need to at least wait to be able to do dual-layered Blue-Ray discs at 50+ Gigabytes from the very start. Don't make the same mistakes as with the intro. of DVD where single layered discs forced the lack of quality compression.


If the DVD Forum had any brains between them what-so-ever they would see the benefit of using two dual layered Blue-Ray discs for one movie to allow for 7.1 discrete channels, MLP compression of 24 bit/192 kHz LPCM tracks. Talk about a D-VHS buster!!


I'd much rather have MLP at 7.1 discrete channels than a re-hash of the DD and DTS debates, and we get so much better sound.


Dan

 

[hob]

I want to see DVD or HD-DVD rather than JVC D-Vhs, I had my fill on rewinding since 1982. 27 gigs or 50 gigs whatever will give us what we need, to keep up the no rewinding discs IMHO.