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Discussion Starter #1
Hey folks!


Well, ive just finished making another DIY screen and thought i would take some Caps and show them.

I am not that handy with a digital camera and its only a cheapy digital so pictures dont do it justice, and its not straight on, but will give you some idea.


Projector is optoma hd70 using a 2.37:1 diy screen 100".

Dvd's are all SD using the upconverting sony 76h(aussie model).


The board is bought from a hardware store(bunnings here) and is:

Particle board/white melamine 16mm

V 040406

F/L 0570132

09314576089279

(in case any aussie's would like to buy it), comes in 2400x1200mm.

AU$39

This board has a shine/hotspotting to it, if using as is... so it is highly recommended to do one coat with (i used robertson brand name) matt clear acrylic, water based.


Now some pics


















 

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Discussion Starter #3
Ok, those were pics of the diy screen, now...

I got some samples from a well known manufacturer here in australia, just some small A4 samples, and ive put them on against my diy screen.

The first 2 pics have 2x samples






Then i left the one sample wich is the premium quality(read, highest quality they sell), see if you can tell the difference, if there is any, its bugger all













well, there you have it, my home DIY screen... screen $39 + poly $20 + borders+velvet $100(i bought quality stuff velvet and boarders) total AU$159
 

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Looks great, what material did you use for wrapping the velvet borders. Also where did you get the velvet, sounds like a very good price if you only have $41 bucks in the velvet and border frame, I'd like to know how you did it cause I am getting ready to do same with Wilsonart laminate. Thanks for sharing.


Golffnutt
 

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I got the velvet from ebay, i bought a few different ones, and his was teh best ive seen.

It is a 3" self adhesive border, very nice and black.

I had a look, but seems he doesnt have any listed atm, but try contacting him, i had no problems with him or the sale.

EDIT: ok, seems it wont let me paste his ebay link, i remember reading here you cant advertise someone, so that may be why it wont work.. but go ebay, and do a search on : 217007 (thats his nic) then click his ebay world/home.


The velvet is US$40 wich is AU$47, the rest was the frame from a hardware shop.


Then, i just found some borders with 30mmx30mm by 3mm thick 90 degree and just lined it up to the screen, and screwed the boards on the sides, the velvets adhesive so no problems there, no need to glue/screws or anything, and it sticks awsome.


I didnt take any pics of my frame, as this thread was about picture quality, but i can try and take some pics tomorrow of it, tho will be harder to see now that its all hooked up and on the wall.


thanks for the comments btw, appreciated.
 

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Very nice. A great example of how by using a material than many would discount as being acceptable AS IS, can be come quite acceptable with the use of known adjustments. In this case, a simple dulling of the reflective properties of Gloss White Melamine results in a White surface that's more than adequate for the task at hand.


From the accuracy of the colors shown, it's obviously not shifting anything bad enough to be concerned about. A real "Laminate Killer" that one.

(Oh yeah, the Melamine IS laminated to the Particle Board, isn't it?
)


Crikey! Waddya Wombats down there gonna do to top that!




(Hey Mate, how'd ya get past the limit on the number of images allowed on one post? I counted 9 on your first post.
)
 

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Thanks for that reply MM808. What is the material of the 3mm borders made of? You say you screwed the borders into the side of the frame, is that correct?


Golffnutt
 

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Very impressive MAZMAN...

The blacks look very good (an absolute must for me) with a nice colour balance...You've certainly got me thinking again on the Melamine board..

I looked at that board some time ago, but discounted it because of the sheen..

Did you get that Roberts matte acrylic from Bunnings also?

I have to make a new screen shortly, and it can only be 8' wide this time..(moving to a new house with a narrower theatre room ) so this might be a good alternative to my present Nulon cloth screen, which is difficult to clean..


Your screen performs very well against that screen material sample...Who's was that by the way?

Thanks for the heads up..
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Mississippiman,

thanks
i am stoked with it and it was only a fluke that i thought of trying this board..

Like Prof mentioned, it had a shine to it, but by looking at the texture and colour, and the fact i was aware that if i was to apply a known substance that kills the shine, it can possably become a very good choise for a diy screen, so i gave it a shot, nothing to lose but $40, and boy am i glad i did try it


Oh yeah, the melamine IS laminated to this particle board, thats whats so good about it, no flex/waves to worry about



I started posting all the pics in one post, but that didnt work so i started moving some pics into the next posts until it let me post, wich was 9 pics to me per page/post, you may have to delete your smilies as they also count as posting pics i think.


Golfnutt,

yes, the border's are screwed with small screw's onto the side of the screen board(not to the front), so they are very hard to see, and if using black screw's even better or counter sunk screw's for ultimate.

The screen board is 16mm thick, so pick the middle of the board(8mm) and there's your screw point.

Make sure you drill the frame board first(where you want to screw it), before you screw anything, as if you dont drill the frame board first, you will CRACK it, there's a tip for ya


The boarder material is PINE.


Prof.

The matt clear is bought from a paint shop around the corner from me, so im not sure where they distribute it, but im sure lots of places carry it, if not you can give them a call and see if they carry it in Adelaide.

robertson & company pty ltd,

Cnr christie and power st.

St. Marys, NSW.

(02) 96234022.


As long as the clear coat is matt and acrylic water based, you should pretty much get the same result.

You can also buy a small sheet of this board to test it first, only $10 and try different clear coats and to practise on.


I thought you would of guessed at the screen material since i mentioned an aussie supplier, post's on DTV forum as well
and the material samples were the diamond and evo3d, with the diamond sample removed and the last 5 pics were with the evo3d, im sure now you know



Thank you to everyone for the nice comments, it was afterall a joint effort
me willing to try out some of our products and you guys for all the informative and helpfull post's/threads on all the diy screens.
 

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MAZMAN....Thanks very much for that contact number, I'll give them a call and see if they have a distributor over here...If not, I guess a Dulux Matte Clear Acrylic will be just as good.


After reading your post yesterday, I had a rummage through my timber stock-pile and found a piece of 16mm. double faced Melamine board..

I put it up against my Nulon screen, fixing it to the left side of the screen so as not to get any hot-spotting, and was quite amazed at what I saw..

The overall colour balance was almost identical to the Nulon, with just a few colours exhibiting a very slight dulling..Probably not even noticeable with a full screen..

The blacks looked just a shade better, but the whites were not quite as good..The Nulon has exceptional whites, better than any screen material I've ever seen..But they were quite acceptable..


MACCA recently sent me a sample of Dazians Matte White screen material, which is very popular in the US, and I would have to say that the Melamine board is IDENTICAL to this material, in every aspect of the colour range, including blacks and whites...

I'm not surprised that this Melamine stands up very well against the evo3d, which is a very good screen material and very popular in Australia..


I did see your post on DTV, but not until after I had read this one on AVS..

Overall, I'm very impressed with this Melamine board and it's definitely going to be my next screen..

I will be building a dedicated Theatre in the new house with total light control, and using a DLP projector, so I think this Melamine board will give me the closest alternative to my current Nulon screen..and at a comparative cost..


BTW...Did you notice any change in the colour balance, gain or depth perception after applying the matte clear acrylic?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Prof.

Seems that nulon material you speak of is pretty good too, and if your liking the whites better on that, you should stick with it?

Im sure there are whiter materials or screens you could use, but i was only able to go of from the sample i had(evo3d) wich i thought was plenty white(ive most likely never seen a whiter screen).

When i got the sample of the evo3d, i was going to buy a screen with that material, as i was pretty impressed with it, but i was short on money and didnt really want to spend that much, so i ended up looking for something that would come close to it for much less $$$.


So, when i found this melamine to be almost identical to the evo3d, i was satisfied and now stopped searching for perfection


The past month ive been searching for a screen thats acceptable, ive been going crazy, the more you compare, paint, compare, try, test... the worst your off! it becomes like a never ending cycle and you just want to keep going at it.

I think it is time to sit down, relax, and enjoy the movies for once
i only just got my projector too lol.


Regarding your questions,

The shine on the melamine is too great in the centre, and due to that shine, its very hard to judge the colours properly or the gain, and it gives you that impression that the whites are whiter when looking at the shine and even the contrast looks better (im guessing the shine/glare of it is giving out that impression), but once you move from that centre even 30deg, the shine dissapears and the colours basically become as it would with the matt clear top coat, all the same/same colour/balance/gain.

So, if you take that piece of melamine you have, and look at it on an angle until you cant see the glare/shine anymore, thats pretty much how your screen will look like after you apply the clear coat on it.


I had the whole board without doing the top coat at first, just to see what it would be like as a whole screen, and i could not handle it.


Buy some matt/flat clear(all you'd need is 100ml), paint that piece you have and line it up to your nulon material, it would be the cheapest and safest way to see if its to your liking without spending too much dollars.


How much are these nulon and dazian materials you speak of?

If i could find this nulon stuff, id certanly try a sample(but id need to know name/part no#).

Maybe clark rubber?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAZMAN808 /forum/post/0


I had the whole board without doing the top coat at first, just to see what it would be like as a whole screen, and i could not handle it.

Yes I know what you mean...I did move the test piece to the centre of the screen and it was like a torch was shining on it...

This however does suggest that the material has a higher gain than 1.0, and with a light coat of matt acrylic on top, should still give a nice little gain to the screen..

I will try some of the matt clear on the sample board, just to see for myself if there is any change to the image performance...


The Nulon material is avilable from Clark Rubber but I don't have a part number for it..

It comes in 1500mm. wide rolls and costs about $25.00/M. If you just ask for Nulon, they should know what you're after..It's a thin white PVC material..


The reason I'm abandoning it is that when there is any moisture in the air, the material start to crinkle, even though it is stretched tight on the frame..If a put a blower heater on it for a few minutes, it stretches tight again!!..Really strange stuff..

I'm having to do this constantly during the wet weather, and it's getting to be a pain..

The Dazian material is also a PVC but much thicker, and importing it from the US gets quite expensive...I think from memory, it costs about $400.00 AUD to do a 100" screen..plus transportation costs..
 

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Discussion Starter #13
ok, on teh weekend ill have some spare time and will pop in to clark rubber and see if they have this material, nulon... if so ill get a sample.

Yea, here its been raining now for a while, and id hate to have that problem you speak of, would annoy me.

I use to have just a BOC on a frame, and never had that issue, wonder if you sewed a backing to that nulon material and making it thicker, if it would solve the problem! or if using a soft spunge kinda material for a backing to this nulon, im sure there would be a way to do it, just gotta come up with something.


Sounds like a good price tho, under $70.

The only thing i hate about the melamine board, is its too heavy


The dazian sounds rich, need to find something similar here in oz



Ill let ya know what i find on the weekend with this nulon, theres a few clark rubbers here near me.


cheers,

Danny
 

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One thing I forgot to mention...The Nulon does need a backing material..it's semi translucent..

I fitted it over the 3mm. white vinyl faced MDF panel. from Bunnings..

It might help the crinkling if the backing panel had an overlay like a thin foam, like the type Clark Rubber would have..

For testing purposes though, I would just put the Nulon over a piece of MDF board..


I'll be interested to here your findings..

Good luck with it..
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAZMAN808 /forum/post/0


The only thing i hate about the melamine board, is its too heavy

I remember seeing a 4mm masonite board with that same kind of melamine coating. A board like that would be much lighter whilst still being good and flat.
 

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That is a beautiful screen MAZMAN808. I like your scientific approach of showing the commerical samples one your DIY screen for comparison. If I couldn't see the reflection of the scotch tape you used to hold them on, I am not sure I would know they were on there.


I will definitely add melamine to my try out list.


Matt
 

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MAZMAN...Were you able to find the Nulon material?


I've been looking around for a suitable clear matte acrylic, (Robertson's don't have a distributor here) and Dulux did not recommend using their clear matte acrylic on Melamine..

I eventually found an Arts and Crafts product made by Chatsworth called Clear Matte Acrylic Sealer..They say that it can be applied to just about any surface including Ceramic tiles..


I applied a single coat to half of my Melamine test panel, and it sems to have bonded to it very well..

To look at the panel in the vertical position in sunlight, you can't see ANY difference between the two halves..It's only when you angle the panel that you can see that the sheen has gone..


I put the panel up against the screen and colours are identical on both halves..with NO hot-spotting on the coated section..

The blacks are just as good as before, but the whites seem to have improved to the point of being identical to the Nulon!!...

This indeed is going to make a great screen, and I would highly recommend it to anyone who has a totally light controlled theatre...
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Prof.

I sure have tried to find this nylon you speak of, but it doesnt look like ive had any luck!

Last weekend, i went around rubber clark stores near me and i have been guided to of total 3 types of nylons that are white, all three of them dont seem suitable to me, so i did not bother getting samples.


I have taken pictures of the ones i was shown with my phone, so dont expect much of quality, but might give you an idea and see if any of these are what you have, and ill try to explain it as best as i can



First one is a hospital film pvc white.

It is a nice material to the touch, fairly white and sturdy, pretty thin but didnt seem transperant like you mentioned of the one you speak of.

The problem with this material is, it has lines throughout it, more so like zig zag lines, imagine someone with a sewing machine did some artwork on it every 3" alone the way going zig zags and sideways... so i dont see it being this.

Sorry the picture didnt capture the zigzag lines as they were very fine and same colour as material and i dont think my mobile was able to capture these lines.

You wouldnt see these zig zags from say the seating position, or even 2 meters away most likely, and i dont think teh picture would be so badly afected, but just the thought of having these zig zag lines would make me stare at the screen trying to look for them, plus its just not right to have these lines for a screen!

If it wasnt for this zig zag pattern, this would be a very good candidate.

Its also the cheapest of all.



-------------------------------------------


Next is this material called ripstop nylon.

Defenatly not my liking, was very see through material, meaning very thin, if you put your hand behind this material, you could see your hand through it!

Also, it had squares on it. imagine a pattern of a VGA pixels that seemed like printed on.



----------------------------------------------


And finally, another pvc reinforced backing nylon.

Nice and white, one side had a shine, teh other a matt finish look to it, teh problem! well, it also has a pattern on it(why cant they just have a plain white nylon with no surface pattern???).

Just the same as the previous one, but this pattern looked more like pixels of say a svga, but not printed on or anything, just like made as such when processing the material, like a part of the material, where it was specifically stretched as such.

It felt like a rubberised material too, and not cheap, $35/m.

As with teh first one, very good candidate if it wasnt for the pixel surface, and its very think, no backing would be required for this one as it already has a backed material.

It also comes over 2m wide, shame really.



---------------------------------------------


So yeah, this is what i have found so far, and will still have a look every now and again when i come across some stores on my ways, but even then, looking at the materials, it seems it would be much harder to stretch them perfectly, would be harder to clean(the ones in teh stores were heaps dirty from finger marks/handling etc), as you cant press to hard without leaving dents/stretch marks and weather affected as you mentioned.. so for now, this melamine board is looking very promising as you have just experianced.


Glad you could have tried it out yourself and thanks for your feedback on it, yes it does seem to me that its one of the easiest/cheapest and a very good performer if this is the kinda way people want to go about it.


cheers,

Danny
 

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Danny,


None of those materials are "Nulon"...I didn't realize that Clark Rubber had so many variations..

The Nulon definitely doesn't have any pattern on it as you can see from this photo that was taken from 12" away.



From what I was told by Clarks, this material is used for waterproof jackets, flags and lightweight tent material..


It probably isn't worth pursuing any further since the crinkling problem in damp weather conditions is a real pain, and the material would probably need to be re-tensioned from time to time which is not practical when you have it stapled to a frame..


When I move to my new place, I'll be making up a new screen using the Melamine board with the matte acrylic top coat..Even though it's going to be quite a heavy

screen, the screenwall frame will be a solid construction and I'll be using a French cleat to hang it, so it shouldn't be a problem..

When it's all setup, I'll post some screenshots..
 

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Hey MAZMAN...


I recently moved into my new place and started setting up the theatre..

.

First thing on the agenda was a new screen..

I had previously decided to go with the Melamine and bought a sheet of it before I left the City..

The Clear Matte Acrylic top coat material that I had previously bought was the Chatsworth product I had previously mentioned..

This acrylic is like water, and even when it's rolled out on the tray it still had a few drips..

I had to be very careful in applying it, not to get any unevenness in the finished coat..

But with the help of Tiddlers instructions on roller painting, I managed to get a very even coating over the whole screen..


I fitted the borders and hung the screen...

At this stage of the theatre build, I had only just finished wiring everything up temporarily, but couldn't wait to try the screen, so I turned on the projector...

I had the receiver set for TV viewing at that time, so that was the first image I saw...


I was totally blown away at the image on the screen....It was BRILLIANT!!

The first thing I noticed was just how much better skin tones looked...very natural looking...much more realistic than my previous screen...

The whites were EXCELLENT..just as bright as the Nulon...This is what I had seen on the test panel..But the real surprise was the blacks...Deep rich velvety blacks...


The image also had that real "pop" to it, that came right off the screen...

I then noticed just how much more depth there was to the overall image...It really took you into the picture..


Overall I'm very impressed with this screen....It also stood up very well with a 100W. ceiling light on, which is about 7' away from the screen...

With the theatre door open, which opens into the kitchen, and the kitchen light on, the image on the screen was still very watchable..It handled ambient light situation very well..

It's still only a white screen, but I would estimate it's gain at about 1.3 by other screens I've had, and I think that's why it handled ambient light conditions very well..


Thanks very much for the heads up on this screen, and if anyone has ever considered using Melamine as a screen, then this is the way to get a very cheap, good quality white screen..


Prof..


BTW....I've just bought a new camera and I'm still learning how to use it..

I'll be taking some pics a bit later..
 
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