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Discussion Starter #1
Hi - first time poster, long time lurker. I have a problem with my XBR4 that I hope someone can give me some direction on.

Background info:

I've owned a Sony XBR4 for a little under 2 years now it's performed flawlessly - that is until recently. About month or two ago, it began exhibiting similar issue as described in these two threads:

avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16243477&postcount=11085

avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=16203884&postcount=11077
(i woudl make these actual links, but becuse this is my first post, the system won;t let me post URLS
)

Problem 1

Basically the left half of the screen looks darkened with a reddish tint, and the pixels in the dark area seem to refresh really-really slowly, creating an ultra smearing effect.

(See attached photo)

At first when this problem began, it could quickly be fixed by simply holding on to the upper left and right corners of the TV and lightly flexing the bezel. This would cause the picture to come back and would only need to be done maybe once a day.


Now - the TV is not longer responding this is and the picture is permanently darkened on the left side.

Problem 2

the second issue is that (obviously) it's out of warranty, so I need to get it fixed. I've had a tech out to look at it, and all he could tell me (after looking at for less than 5 minutes) is that he needed to take it back to his shop and then he could tell me how much and how long it would take to fix it. I decided to not send it with the tech, since, according to him, the fix would likely be a new panel. The cost of replacing the Panel is not worth fixing

Solutions???

Well, I'm going to just get a new TV later today (we needed a slightly larger one anyway
), but I want to try and salvage this one myself - if possible. I just need a little direction. After ready a tone of stuff on these boards, I think my best bet might be to just replace each of boards one at a time in hopes the issue lies within of o these.

My questions are:


1 - Should I even attempt this, or would it be an exercise in fruition?


2 - if you thinks it's possible it is one of the boards, in which order I should start?

The second photo attached is the TV with the back housing pulled off and the various boards are listed A-B-C-D-E-F-G


I know what some of the boards are, but some I don't:


A- DF2

B - GF1

C - ??

D - DF3

E - ??

F - ??

G - ??



Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

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Discussion Starter #2
Also - I forgot to mention that with the back panel off and the TV turned on, all the baclklights seem to be on, so i don't thnk it's a back light specific issue.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnlyTono /forum/post/17045064




I know what some of the boards are, but some I don't:


A- DF2

B - GF1

C - ??

D - DF3

E - ??

F - ??

G - ??



Any help would be greatly appreciated.

A & D seem to be power supplies for the inverters probably located inside those 2 black plastic panels on each side of the TV

B - power supply for the rest of the PCB's

C - pixel driver PCB (LCD panel driver PCB)

G - inputs / outputs & tuner

E & F are AV processing PCB's


tricky fault... I can not see how the pixel driver board feeds matrix signals to LCD panel. I would clean the contacts here first... and at the LCD panel end as well.


next...???? not an easy one... could be the AV processing boards... or pixel driver PCB.... or panel...



Boky
 

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Discussion Starter #4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_Boky /forum/post/17045478


A & D seem to be power supplies for the


tricky fault... I can not see how the pixel driver board feeds matrix signals to LCD panel. I would clean the contacts here first... and at the LCD panel end as well.

Ya i don't see anythhing like that either. I don't know alot about it, but i would guess it would look like a ribbon cable of some sort.


I'll dig a little deeper while I have it on the work bench. I'll also try cleaning any contact I can see - just for good measure


any thoughts on which board I should start with in terms of replacement?
 

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Post the full model number.


Start with replacing Tcon board (C) (about $100).

Then FBx board (E) (about $400).

Note that on some models you cannot just replace the Tcon or FBx by itself, they must be replaced as a pair.


If neither of those boards fix, then the panel is bad. Note that on some models when replacing the panel you have to also replace the Tcon and FBx boards together.


My gut feeling is that you have a bad panel.
 

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Discussion Starter #6

Quote:
Originally Posted by hammerdwn /forum/post/17048271


Post the full model number.


Start with replacing Tcon board (C) (about $100).

Then FBx board (E) (about $400).

Note that on some models you cannot just replace the Tcon or FBx by itself, they must be replaced as a pair.


If neither of those boards fix, then the panel is bad. Note that on some models when replacing the panel you have to also replace the Tcon and FBx boards together.

Here's the model info from the back of the TV:


Model: KDL-46xBR4

MFG: December 2007


once I get the covers off of the TCon and FBx boards, is it possible there may be some visual evidence that the board are have gone bad that i can look for? Or, is there some sort of test I can run on them? I know generally with PCB boards, there usually is not any visual evidence, but i figures Id ask just in case.


Also - what are the factors than can contribute to these PCB boards going bad? is it just bad luck, or is there something else that can be done to help protect against this sort of failure other than a good AV rated surge protector (which this TV was connected to)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hammerdwn /forum/post/17048271


My gut feeling is that you have a bad panel.

That's kind of what I'm thinking as well, but for a TV that looked as good as this one did, it may be worth a try to salvage it.


Thanks for the info!
 

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Discussion Starter #7

Quote:
Originally Posted by hammerdwn /forum/post/17048271


Post the full model number.

Start with replacing Tcon board (C) (about $100).

Then FBx board (E) (about $400).

Note that on some models you cannot just replace the Tcon or FBx by itself, they must be replaced as a pair.

I was able to find a site that seems to have the parts for this tv AND actually has photos of each of the parts.

http://www.discount-merchant.com/Sea...rch=KDL-46XBR4


THe only thing i dont see is the FBx board (E). Maybe it's there and I just don't know what it looks like
 

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They are calling it DIGITAL VIDEO board, it's the one with the hdmi ports...
 

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Discussion Starter #9
found it...


I'm going to give this a try in the next week or two and cross my fingers that it works. I'll post up the results.


Thanks for your help....
 

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Hey, dont want to hijack your post, but it seems I am having the exact same issues as you. Wondering if you've gotten lucky with replacing any parts?


The tv will work for about 30- 45 minutes or so, when its first turned on, but then the left side of the screen becomes dark reddish (always has the slow pixel response). I noticed that If I turn the tv off, and then turn it back on, it will be fine, but this time only for about 5 minutes. Guess has something to do with the heating up of the components making it go out like this.

Just wondering if you solved your issue yet because it seems we are in the same boat lol.

Thanks in advance
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I haven't solve it yet - i have the tv mostly pulled apart and will be ordering the parts next week. I'm going with hammerdwn's advise on the parts to start with.


On a side note - my issue started the exact same way yours did. It took about 2 to 3 months before it completely deteriorated.
 

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my advise to both is - get the can of freeze spray. Remove the back cover and wait for the problem to start happening. Then, spray the freeze spray over one board at the time - even if it has metal "mash" on top of it. If the picture snaps-in normal...you know which PCB to replace !!!


The problem is related to one or more parts suffering thermal-run out..... component(s) overheat and start working outside of their normal operating range. If you cool the component down, it will start operating normally for a while.. until it overheats again. This is why the TV works okay for longer if it was completely cooled down.


It would be good to remove metal mesh covers and then use freeze spray, however, if that is too difficult (or if that means the whole PCB will fall-off), spray thru the wholes... just make sure some of that stuff reaches the PCB components.


Only one PCB at the time, and be patient… give it 10 sec for change in temp to take effect, and skip to next PCB slowly – don’t rush. If you notice even slight improvement – you found the faulty PCB / module.

If you decide that this is something you can do yourself…..


…….you will be working with LIVE components / PCB’s. This voltage can KILL YOU!!!!


You’ve been WARNED….!!!!!!



Boky
 

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Discussion Starter #13

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_Boky /forum/post/17086781


my advise to both is - get the can of freeze spray. Remove the back cover and wait for the problem to start happening. Then, spray the freeze spray over one board at the time - even if it has metal "mash" on top of it. If the picture snaps-in normal...you know which PCB to replace !!!


The problem is related to one or more parts suffering thermal-run out..... component(s) overheat and start working outside of their normal operating range. If you cool the component down, it will start operating normally for a while.. until it overheats again. This is why the TV works okay for longer if it was completely cooled down.


It would be good to remove metal mesh covers and then use freeze spray, however, if that is too difficult (or if that means the whole PCB will fall-off), spray thru the wholes... just make sure some of that stuff reaches the PCB components.


Only one PCB at the time, and be patient… give it 10 sec for change in temp to take effect, and skip to next PCB slowly – don’t rush. If you notice even slight improvement – you found the faulty PCB / module.

Great advise. I have not ordered the parts yet, so I think I'll try this first.


When sprying the Freeze spray on the PCBs, should I be trying to cover the entire board i've targeted, or just hiiting the tops of of the various chips on the board?


Also, would you comfirm this is the type of product I'm looking for?
FREEZE SPRAY, 10 OZ CAN

Quote:
Originally Posted by Extreme_Boky /forum/post/17086781

If you decide that this is something you can do yourself…..


…….you will be working with LIVE components / PCB’s. This voltage can KILL YOU!!!!


You’ve been WARNED….!!!!!!

I appreciate the warning - It can sometimes be easy to forget that these things are pushing some serious power.


Thanks...
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnlyTono /forum/post/17089702


Great advise. I have not ordered the parts yet, so I think I'll try this first.


When sprying the Freeze spray on the PCBs, should I be trying to cover the entire board i've targeted, or just hiiting the tops of of the various chips on the board?


Also, would you comfirm this is the type of product I'm looking for?
FREEZE SPRAY, 10 OZ CAN




I appreciate the warning - It can sometimes be easy to forget that these things are pushing some serious power.


Thanks...

That spray will do just fine.


Area you should spar ONE AT THE TIME:


1. Voltage regulators' area (if you can tell voltage regulators from other IC's)


2. Large surface mount IC's


If this does not produce any result, try to spray on top of a whole board to locate the board that is faulty.


If you choose to spray one component (or functional group of components) one at the time, you may be able to find regulator or capacitor / resistor that is faulty, which can cut the cost of repair to couple of dollars (if you know how to replace these components)


Otherwise, just spray on top of one PCB at the time... and replace the whole faulty PCB...



Good luck


Boky
 

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Just a quick update on my issue.


Somehow, the issue kind of fixed it self sort-of. lol Atleast for now, it will by me time until I can get it properly fixed.


When you first turn the tv on, it works good for about 10minutes besides the slow pixel response on the left side. After that, it starts turning dark, and then back to normal every couple of second for a second. Then, after about 5 minutes of that, its back to normal picture with just the slow pixel response on the left side.


The pixel response is not that bad, can get bad on fast action sports (I have a 57" for that anyway lol)
 

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Discussion Starter #16

Quote:
Originally Posted by CecilDiesel /forum/post/17138028


Just a quick update on my issue.


Somehow, the issue kind of fixed it self sort-of. lol Atleast for now, it will by me time until I can get it properly fixed.


When you first turn the tv on, it works good for about 10minutes besides the slow pixel response on the left side. After that, it starts turning dark, and then back to normal every couple of second for a second. Then, after about 5 minutes of that, its back to normal picture with just the slow pixel response on the left side.


The pixel response is not that bad, can get bad on fast action sports (I have a 57" for that anyway lol)

Hopefully it will maintain like that - but I have to warn you - this is exactly how mine went.


I've tried the freeze spray and so far no luck. Although, there's one board I can't full get to and one that I can only partially get to without basically taking the entire TV apart.


Luckily I was able to get my hands on a Service manual for this TV, so I have all the diagrams, part numbers, and exploded views which should make this much easier.


The PCB boards I'm talking about are labeled E (pixel driver PCB or FB1) and the PCB board JUST ABOVE what I have labeled as C (the service manual calls it UB1) on the image I original posted which I believe is the T-Con.


So to try and keep costs down, I'm going to attempt to replace just one board at a time - my only problem is trying to decide which board to start with.


My guess would be that it would probably be a good idea to start with either E, C or the T-CON board since those boards all deal with the actual video source that gets sent to the panel while the rest of the boards in general, deal with either gathering input, or providing power


I'll try and remember to take some more photos as I go, since some of this is pretty tricky - especially getting to the T-CON board.
 

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Problems with right side of screen as described in earlier post (right side looking at screen) TV out of warranty by 3 months. Repair tech said needed a new flat panel and board. cost was about 1700 for parts. Called Sony!(239-768-7646) told them of the problems they have sent a replacement xbr9 (not as good as the xbr4) for a cost of 400 dollars What do you think?

Thanks

David
 

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Discussion Starter #18

Quote:
Originally Posted by conar2 /forum/post/17152540


Problems with right side of screen as described in earlier post (right side looking at screen) TV out of warranty by 3 months. Repair tech said needed a new flat panel and board. cost was about 1700 for parts. Called Sony!(239-768-7646) told them of the problems they have sent a replacement xbr9 (not as good as the xbr4) for a cost of 400 dollars What do you think?

Thanks

David

The parts cost you where quoted seems inline with what i was originaly quoted to fix the TV. Add in labor, and I was right around 2200 bucks - which is about what paid for the TV brand new



if sony offered to send a new TV for 400 bucks, then i would say that's a good deal. I haven't seen the XBR9s so i can't draw any comparisons between the XBR4 and XBR9s.


Ive since replaced my TV with a new one, so I'm just taking my time to attempt a DYI fix on my XBR4. if it works (or doesn't work) I'll post up the results. Right now the TV is mostly in peices sitting on my work bench :)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Just an update for anyone following this thread - I was able to fix the TV



It's a pretty involved process but certainly doable. The best part is, if done right - it should literally only cost you a few bucks and some of you time.


I took a bunch of photos of the process and will post it here in the next few days.


Stay tuned!
 
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