[ebrill]

Hi all, I have a Klipsch RC-25 for a center and RF-5's as front speakers, driven by a Pioneer 519 AVR (110w x ch). All using the same newly cut, thick, short wires.


When setting channel levels through the AVR, the test tone (static fuzz) sounds different in the center channel vs. the fronts. It sounds like it is lower in frequency, softer, and more cone-like.


Also, it is quieter. I need to set the gain on the center up +4, possibly higher, to understand dialogue in movies.


Just curious what everyone else's experience with centers is like. Thanks.

 

[fireman325]

Just from looking at the specs, it seems to me the RC-25 is not a good match for the RF-5s. As such, I'm not surprised it's struggling to keep up with them. It can't handle as much power, is not as efficient, and there's a pretty significant difference in the size of the horns and woofers.

 

[vantagesc]

Different midrange/bass drivers, different efficiencies, and way different speaker placement can cause this. My first HT setup had two 4.5" drivers in the mains, whereas the center had a 4.5" midrange + two 6.5" bass drivers, and they were not a perfect tonal match despite having the same midrange driver. The center also sounded a bit chesty when placed in the TV stand, but that was the only placement option...

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by ebrill /forum/post/16862696


Hi all, I have a Klipsch RC-25 for a center and RF-5's as front speakers, driven by a Pioneer 519 AVR (110w x ch). Also, it is quieter. I need to set the gain on the center up +4, possibly higher, to understand dialogue in movies.

I agree with fireman325 that you don't have the best center paired with your RF-5s. Those are nice speakers.


The RC-52 is rated 3 dB less sensitive than your RF-5s and is why you have to boost the gain/level. I would be on the lookout for a RC-7 if you are lucky enough to find one. If you are on a budget, a RC-3 could work given it has 2 6.5" woofers and a larger horn than the RC-52. Good Luck.

 

[glaufman]

Most important aspect when choosing a center channel is getting the one the MFR of the main speakers says has the best match to the front LR speakers.

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16867802


Most important aspect when choosing a center channel is getting the one the MFR of the main speakers says has the best match to the front LR speakers.

I can't argue with your logic and the RC-7 is what Klipsch recommends with the RF-5s, but imo, the similar 1" compression driver that the RC-3 shares with the RF-5s could make it a suitable match...That being said, RC-7s are an endangered species because owners aren't getting rid of theirs and Klipsch hasn't reintroduced it as it has the RF-7s. My 2 cents.


{EDIT: I would also consider the RC-64 if you find a tremendous deal on it and the RC-62 has been a reported a notable upgrade to the RC-52, both in the current Reference series}

 

[fireman325]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16867892


I can't argue with your logic and the RC-7 is what Klipsch recommends with the RF-5s, but imo, the similar 1" compression driver that the RC-3 shares with the RF-5s could make it a suitable match...That being said, RC-7s are an endangered species because owners aren't getting rid of theirs and Klipsch hasn't reintroduced it as it has the RF-7s. My 2 cents.


{EDIT: I would also consider the RC-64 if you find a tremendous deal on it and the RC-62 has been a reported a notable upgrade to the RC-52, both in the current Reference series}

I sent Klipsch an e-mail regarding this about a week ago and the response I got back basically said they didn't know if other matching speakers were coming or not. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[glaufman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16867892


I can't argue with your logic and the RC-7 is what Klipsch recommends with the RF-5s, but imo, the similar 1" compression driver that the RC-3 shares with the RF-5s could make it a suitable match...That being said, RC-7s are an endangered species because owners aren't getting rid of theirs and Klipsch hasn't reintroduced it as it has the RF-7s. My 2 cents.


{EDIT: I would also consider the RC-64 if you find a tremendous deal on it and the RC-62 has been a reported a notable upgrade to the RC-52, both in the current Reference series}

Troubles with this are, having a similar tweeter doesn't equal having the same sound... there are many factors that affect the sound, what's the crossover doing, what's the cabinet doing, is it sealed/ported, what about the woofer(s), what kind of separation is there, is it the same horn, ...?


That's WHY it's important to consider what the MFR recommends as the "ideal" match...


Now, is that the only choice? No. Whether something else is "suitable" depends on your ears, the source material, the rest of the system, the room, etc...


For instance the best match for my RF-3s is the RC-3... the RC3 II is close enough to be considered identical, and that's what I'm running... would the RC-52 be "suitable"... I dunno, never heard it, but it's different enough that Klipsch emphatically told me over and over again to go find a used RC3 or RC3 II when I wanted to add it to the RF-3s I had been running without a center...

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16868125


Troubles with this are, having a similar tweeter doesn't equal having the same sound... there are many factors that affect the sound, what's the crossover doing, what's the cabinet doing, is it sealed/ported, what about the woofer(s), what kind of separation is there, is it the same horn, ...?


That's WHY it's important to consider what the MFR recommends as the "ideal" match...


Now, is that the only choice? No. ...

I understand what you are saying, but considering that the RC-7 is the recommended center channel for both the RF-5s and RF-7s, I contend there is more of similarity in the RC-3 with the RF-5s than comparing the two tower speakers to each other...I would NOT run RF-7s with the RC-3 and would definitely recommend to the OP to get a RC-7 if one becomes available.


Fwiw, I prefer RF-3 towers to both RB-75s and RS-7s and is what I use 100% of the time even though I have all three speakers. YMMV depending on Setup/Environment.

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16868125



...For instance the best match for my RF-3s is the RC-3... the RC3 II is close enough to be considered identical, and that's what I'm running... would the RC-52 be "suitable"... I dunno, never heard it, but it's different enough that Klipsch emphatically told me over and over again to go find a used RC3 or RC3 II when I wanted to add it to the RF-3s I had been running without a center...

The RC-3 is an excellent center channel and the closest current replacement would be the RC-62; I wouldn't consider the RC-52, as Klipsch recommended....Insofar as the differences in the RC-3 and RC-3II, it is entirely in the Monster cable used in the newer version and nothing else (except that some of the early ones were made in Hope, from what I remember).

 

[glaufman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16868415


I understand what you are saying, but considering that the RC-7 is the recommended center channel for both the RF-5s and RF-7s, I contend there is more of similarity in the RC-3 with the RF-5s than comparing the two tower speakers to each other...

I don't think I understand what you're saying here... If Klipsch recommends the RC-7 for both the RF5 and RF7, then the sound that comes out of the RC7, within it's range, will be more similar to the RF5 and the RF7 than the RC3 would be. But we should differentiate between a) the best match, and b) the best match choosing from current production models...

Quote:
I would NOT run RF-7s with the RC-3 and would definitely recommend to the OP to get a RC-7 if one becomes available.

If the RC7 is recommended, then that's what he should pair, if it's available, new, or from a good used source. If not, he should go back to Klipsch and ask for the next best thing. Is that the RC3? Might be. I dunno. You just simply can't look at the specs they publish and know for sure. It seems you concur with my reasoning, but not the conclusion I make from it?

Quote:
Fwiw, I prefer RF-3 towers to both RB-75s and RS-7s and is what I use 100% of the time even though I have all three speakers. YMMV depending on Setup/Environment.

I've almost unfailingly adored my RF3s since the day they were delivered... and any issue I've had with them is probably room/setup related, and I'm just too lazy to fight with SWMBO and find the time to fix that... glad you feel the same way about yours...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16868488


The RC-3 is an excellent center channel and the closest current replacement would be the RC-62; I wouldn't consider the RC-52, as Klipsch recommended....

Why not?

Quote:
Insofar as the differences in the RC-3 and RC-3II, it is entirely in the Monster cable used in the newer version and nothing else (except that some of the early ones were made in Hope, from what I remember).

Like I said, close enough to be considered identical

At some point someone's gonna tell us to move this to the Klipsch thread...

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16869734


...I've almost unfailingly adored my RF3s since the day they were delivered...

So have I.

Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16869734



Originally Posted by Zen Traveler

The RC-3 is an excellent center channel and the closest current replacement would be the RC-62; I wouldn't consider the RC-52, as Klipsch recommended....


...Why not?

Of course go with what Klipsch recommends, but there are a lot of reasons that the RC-62 is closer to the specs of the RC-3 than the RC-52. The latter has smaller woofers, weighs considerably less and has different components than either of these two speakers:

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/product...pecifications/

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/product...pecifications/


Which have the same size horn/driver and 6.5" woofers and I imagine similar crossover networks.

 

[glaufman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16869981


So have I.

Of course go with what Klipsch recommends, but there are a lot of reasons that the RC-62 is closer to the specs of the RC-3 than the RC-52. The latter has smaller woofers, weighs considerably less and has different components than either of these two speakers:

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/product...pecifications/

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/product...pecifications/


Which have the same size horn/driver and 6.5" woofers and I imagine similar crossover networks.

Hold on a second.. BOTH the 62 and 52 are ported designs, as opposed to the RC3 which is sealed... Other than that, the RC3 does appear to be "between" the 52 and 62 in terms of most published specs... I'm just not sure that the published specs are necessary or sufficient to determine the best sonic match...

Other than current availability, why would Klipsch suggest the 52 ove rthe 3 if it wasn't a better match (with this I'm granting already the possibility that they can make a profit on the 52 as opposed to buying the 3 used, which a few years ago when business wasn't so hard, they suggested I find the 3 used...)

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16870512


...Other than current availability, why would Klipsch suggest the 52 ove rthe 3 if it wasn't a better match..

I don't think they would, however I can't imagine them not suggesting the RC-62 for the reasons you mentioned (along with my outsider observations;-). Fwiw, I agree that the RC-3 would be the best match for the RF-3s (or RF-3II) and that the RC-7 would be the preferable center channel to the OP's RF-5s.

 

[glaufman]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16872807


I don't think they would, however I can't imagine them not suggesting the RC-62 for the reasons you mentioned (along with my outsider observations;-). Fwiw, I agree that the RC-3 would be the best match for the RF-3s (or RF-3II) and that the RC-7 would be the preferable center channel to the OP's RF-5s.

Well, FWIW, the OP said he had the RC-25, not the RC-52... which I think we can agree is even poorer...


I just don't think published specs alone are enough to sya what matches what...


I think the horse is dead.

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by glaufman /forum/post/16874083


Well, FWIW, the OP said he had the RC-25, not the RC-52... which I think we can agree is even poorer...


I just don't think published specs alone are enough to sya what matches what...


I think the horse is dead.

I was using specs to back up my real world experience dealing with Klipsch speakers and talking with Klipsch personnel at the various functions I have been fortunate to have gone in the last 10 years, but I agree that the OP has enough info to make a decision, or he can make the free call to Klipsch Customer Service.

My last comment on this topic. ;-)

 

[glaufman]

On another note, how can I get invites to these functions?


Need an escort?

 

[ebrill]

Thanks all for your posts. I'll keep the RC-7 in mind. A beast of a center channel and the woofers, horn, and efficiency match well with the RF-5's. Although its out of my budget at this point, for what its worth there's one in the "for sale" thread here and a NEW one on ebay.

 

[Zen Traveler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by ebrill /forum/post/16874928


Thanks all for your posts. I'll keep the RC-7 in mind. A beast of a center channel and the woofers, horn, and efficiency match well with the RF-5's. Although its out of my budget at this point, for what its worth there's one in the "for sale" thread here and a NEW one on ebay.

I admit I would be nervous having one shipped by an unknown entity (report is, if they are not double boxed sufficiently there will be problems) but if you could find one locally you would never need to upgrade your front array if you are now happy with the RF-5s.


Insofar as your center channel dilemma...I posted my thoughts about "size matters," when it comes to Center channels and completely understand where you are coming from. Right now I have a large RPTV where all of my gear including my center channel sit on, but when I upgrade my monitor at the end of the year I really am going to have to think strategically on how to make the RC-7 fit (and look nice) because sonically there is no comparison between it and a smaller one. My front soundstage is seamless and the only way to describe it is sublime.

Good luck.

 

[fireman325]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zen Traveler /forum/post/16875156


I admit I would be nervous having one shipped by an unknown entity (report is, if they are not double boxed sufficiently there will be problems) but if you could find one locally you would never need to upgrade your front array if you are now happy with the RF-5s.


Insofar as your center channel dilemma...I posted my thoughts about "size matters," when it comes to Center channels and completely understand where you are coming from. Right now I have a large RPTV where all of my gear including my center channel sit on, but when I upgrade my monitor at the end of the year I really am going to have to think strategically on how to make the RC-7 fit (and look nice) because sonically there is no comparison between it and a smaller one. My front soundstage is seamless and the only way to describe it is sublime.

Good luck.

I was in a somewhat similar situation when I upgraded my RPTV to a plasma. Ended up having to buy at ET stand. Then when I upgraded speakers, I had to put the plasma on the wall so the center speaker could sit under it on top of the ET stand.