LG's Firewire strategy.. I don't get it....
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Firewire in general is very frustrating. I just don't understand why it sin't on every single piece of HD equipment with an mpeg decoder. I understand why a manufacturer wouldn't want to add to the cost of an MPEG decoder.
We have just over 2 months till April 1st and hopefully all the new cable STB's will have firewire as they agreed to.
I really belive that this will excelerate the use of firwire on devices.
With any luck this will be the last year of HD equipment that does not have a firewire port. I know that I don't plan to buy another piece of equipment without one.
We have just over 2 months till April 1st and hopefully all the new cable STB's will have firewire as they agreed to.
I really belive that this will excelerate the use of firwire on devices.
With any luck this will be the last year of HD equipment that does not have a firewire port. I know that I don't plan to buy another piece of equipment without one.
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The "next" 3510 (LST-4510A I guess) will have Firewire.
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Source on that info???
LG 55" C9 OLED, Yamaha RX-A660, Monoprice 5.1.2 Speakers, WMC HTPC, TiVo Bolt, X1
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LG, or any of the other DirecTV STB makers have nothing to do with this issue.
DirecTV is the sole reason why none of their receivers have Firewire. The widely circulated rumor is that the MPAA has applied significant pressure to DirecTV not to allow HD recording, which Firewire enables.
DirecTV is the sole reason why none of their receivers have Firewire. The widely circulated rumor is that the MPAA has applied significant pressure to DirecTV not to allow HD recording, which Firewire enables.
I lost you there. Neither the 3410a or the 3510a are DirectTV receivers. As far as I can tell, they are OTA only... So what's DirectTV got to do with it?
And 3410a DOES have firewire, BTW, so it's not true that none of LG's receivers have it...
And 3410a DOES have firewire, BTW, so it's not true that none of LG's receivers have it...
"The widely circulated rumor is that the MPAA has applied significant pressure to DirecTV not to allow HD recording, which Firewire enables."
Give the cable agreement and its provisions regarding making Firewire available, doesn't this make no sense anymore (even if it ever did)?
Mark
Give the cable agreement and its provisions regarding making Firewire available, doesn't this make no sense anymore (even if it ever did)?
Mark
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Supposedly they signed some agreement with MPAA. Dish Network did also but to less extent. Why do you think they are challenging Plug and Play agreement. They claim some other stuff but they know (especially D*) that it will bite them when in April cable boxes will allow recording thru firewire.
As far as 3410 having firewire it is for archiving purposes. I agree that all OTA tuners should have firewire on them.
| Originally posted by Ken H LG, or any of the other DirecTV STB makers have nothing to do with this issue. DirecTV is the sole reason why none of their receivers have Firewire. The widely circulated rumor is that the MPAA has applied significant pressure to DirecTV not to allow HD recording, which Firewire enables. |
As far as 3410 having firewire it is for archiving purposes. I agree that all OTA tuners should have firewire on them.
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The reason why Sat companies objected to the Plug and Play agreement was because it gives cable an advantage. No additional equipment to buy or rent.
For a customer with a "Digital Cable Ready" tv to watch cable just requires them to pay for the service.
For the same customer with the same tv to watch Satellite they have to buy a receiver, dish etc.
Yes this is the way it has always been, but D* and E* had hoped to change that, and they got snubbed by the FCC.
As for the real reason why D* and E* don't have firewire it is anyone's guess. Personally I wouldn't be surprised if there was an agreement between them and the MPAA. I understand the MPAA's standpoint, how could they trust D* or E* to enforce the copy never flag when they can't even prevent a kid with a smart card reader from stealing their service.
| Originally posted by CKNA Supposedly they signed some agreement with MPAA. Dish Network did also but to less extent. Why do you think they are challenging Plug and Play agreement. They claim some other stuff but they know (especially D*) that it will bite them when in April cable boxes will allow recording thru firewire. |
For a customer with a "Digital Cable Ready" tv to watch cable just requires them to pay for the service.
For the same customer with the same tv to watch Satellite they have to buy a receiver, dish etc.
Yes this is the way it has always been, but D* and E* had hoped to change that, and they got snubbed by the FCC.
As for the real reason why D* and E* don't have firewire it is anyone's guess. Personally I wouldn't be surprised if there was an agreement between them and the MPAA. I understand the MPAA's standpoint, how could they trust D* or E* to enforce the copy never flag when they can't even prevent a kid with a smart card reader from stealing their service.
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I predict the sat companies will eventually match what cable is going to be offering in terms of firewire functionality.
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He never said when it would happen ... I agree that the dbs companies are eventually going to feel the pressure to add Firewire functionality ... but only as when we see more availability of the types of products that Firewire allows (an HD-DVD burner for example ... or some really cool home A/V networking capabilities). Like Kipp said ... 'eventually'.
The sats might have been hoping (and maybe the will still get) certain content because of their closed systems ... for example ppv movies available shortly after release, and before they are available on DVD or other sources. With the ban on selectable output control though ... that might not happen either.
| Originally posted by bdraw That is funny Kipp, I could of sworn you have said that before.  |
The sats might have been hoping (and maybe the will still get) certain content because of their closed systems ... for example ppv movies available shortly after release, and before they are available on DVD or other sources. With the ban on selectable output control though ... that might not happen either.
Oh ... and personally I'd love to see:
- an ATSC only stb (like the LG3100A) + Firewire
- a Firewire-only DVR (like the RCA DVR10)
- assurances the two devices would work together
- some reasonable assurances the DVR would be able to work with cable stbs via Firewire
Give me the above and I'm sold. Give me ATSC + encrypted QAM via CableCARD and I'm even more sold.
Give me the above in a single all-in-one device ... I'm less sold. Give me the above in a single all-in-one device w/o Firewire ... I'm definately not going to buy.
Note: Yes, I know the 3100A also includes unscrambled QAM ... not really interested in QAM unless it includes CableCARD capabilities.
- an ATSC only stb (like the LG3100A) + Firewire
- a Firewire-only DVR (like the RCA DVR10)
- assurances the two devices would work together
- some reasonable assurances the DVR would be able to work with cable stbs via Firewire
Give me the above and I'm sold. Give me ATSC + encrypted QAM via CableCARD and I'm even more sold.
Give me the above in a single all-in-one device ... I'm less sold. Give me the above in a single all-in-one device w/o Firewire ... I'm definately not going to buy.
Note: Yes, I know the 3100A also includes unscrambled QAM ... not really interested in QAM unless it includes CableCARD capabilities.
dt_dc,
I'm with you. I don't understand why all OTA only devices don't have firewire. Still waiting for that perfect one. The Sammy and the MIT came close. Maybe next generation.
I'm at the point where I'm starting to be an OTA-only guy. DirecTV's stb position has me seriously rethinking whether I want to be a subscriber anymore (I've been one since 1997).
-Reagan
I'm with you. I don't understand why all OTA only devices don't have firewire. Still waiting for that perfect one. The Sammy and the MIT came close. Maybe next generation.
I'm at the point where I'm starting to be an OTA-only guy. DirecTV's stb position has me seriously rethinking whether I want to be a subscriber anymore (I've been one since 1997).
-Reagan
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I would have to guess with in the next 3-5 years.
| Originally posted by dt_dc He never said when it would happen ... |
What's exasperating about firewire, from this DishNetwork subscriber, is to look back to a year ago and see how E* was moving forward on its firewire strategy. The 811 originally was going to have 1394 ports, there was going to be a new STB called the 211 that was exclusively firewire (for use mostly with Mitsu sets), the 921's firewire ports were promised to work out of the box (last spring!), and they were going to deploy some of Vividlogic's software with their hardware (see Vividlogic's website for press releases).
Since then . . . nothing from E*. 1394 was eliminated from the 811. It still doesn't work on the 921. The 211 was s**tcanned, and Vividlogic's Firebus software only works on OTA.
And E* was our best hope, D* has never shown any desire for 1394 capability.
Except for OTA, the AVHDD is dead. The MPAA has won.
Since then . . . nothing from E*. 1394 was eliminated from the 811. It still doesn't work on the 921. The 211 was s**tcanned, and Vividlogic's Firebus software only works on OTA.
And E* was our best hope, D* has never shown any desire for 1394 capability.
Except for OTA, the AVHDD is dead. The MPAA has won.
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Hi Airblair
I would not rule out the AVHDD or any other Firewire/HAVi technology. The MPAA has not won. There has been no word on the 211. we all know how long it took them to come out with the 921! Dish has put there foot in there mouth for annoucing all of these products before they are ready. So I bet we shall see the 211, 811 with Firewire, and the Firewire port on the 921 enabled.
I would not rule out the AVHDD or any other Firewire/HAVi technology. The MPAA has not won. There has been no word on the 211. we all know how long it took them to come out with the 921! Dish has put there foot in there mouth for annoucing all of these products before they are ready. So I bet we shall see the 211, 811 with Firewire, and the Firewire port on the 921 enabled.
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I agree this is a bit frustrating.
I don't think the MPAA has one. I don't even know what there is to win, and if there was if they would want to win.
Don't give up hope, at least not till after the cable companies have let us down too. Just because D* and E* have not wanted to bring a great firewire source to market does not mean that Cable won't do it. If cable didn't want to, they would have never agreed to supply a functional firewire upon request as of April 1st 04.
Now if we have not made any progress in the next year then I will be right there with you.
I think that the reason you don't see any firewire on Satellite is because the MPAA has no faith in their security. I don't blame the MPAA for not trusting their security anyone kid with a smart card reader can steal service and never be caught.
Cable on the other hand, people are less likely to steal the service because they think that since there is a two way connection it is easier to get caught. I think one day in the future the cable companies will be able to see who is stealing from a terminal at their office.
The reason why cable companies have not implemented firewire is the same reason why they waited so long to roll out HD and there are so many un-activated DVI ports on cable STB's. They just move slow.
| Originally posted by Airblair Except for OTA, the AVHDD is dead. The MPAA has won. |
I don't think the MPAA has one. I don't even know what there is to win, and if there was if they would want to win.
Don't give up hope, at least not till after the cable companies have let us down too. Just because D* and E* have not wanted to bring a great firewire source to market does not mean that Cable won't do it. If cable didn't want to, they would have never agreed to supply a functional firewire upon request as of April 1st 04.
Now if we have not made any progress in the next year then I will be right there with you.
I think that the reason you don't see any firewire on Satellite is because the MPAA has no faith in their security. I don't blame the MPAA for not trusting their security anyone kid with a smart card reader can steal service and never be caught.
Cable on the other hand, people are less likely to steal the service because they think that since there is a two way connection it is easier to get caught. I think one day in the future the cable companies will be able to see who is stealing from a terminal at their office.
The reason why cable companies have not implemented firewire is the same reason why they waited so long to roll out HD and there are so many un-activated DVI ports on cable STB's. They just move slow.
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