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What was the AR and was it DD5.1?
 

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I watched some of mine last night, and didn't get any problems in that part I watched. But it was so grotequely macroblocked during any high action scenes that it was pathetic, on top of the usual hack job of DirecTV.
 

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Dish network version (Via 5000+mod) looked great (except for the transfer not being OAR).
 

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I had a perfect recording! Changed my mind last night after previewing the first 5 minutes at the 6PM airing of DishNetwork. The quality was quite good compared to the DVD. So, I set up my Panny system for the record at 11PM. I didn't watch the movie then but at 2:30 AM watched the tape and it was perfect! But that's why I chose the Panny system rather than the DirecTV / AVX route. Now I have a tape that plays back in either DVHS and there are no glitches and the PQ seems superior to what Dean reported on DirecTV. I have yet to look at the DirecTV preview and compare.


The OAR issue did bother me because I could tell early on that it was not just an opened matte super35 transfer. They had to be zooming and cropping the sides because otherwise the 2.35 AR would have chopped off some of the actor's eyes. I suppose what bothered me most is knowing that what I was watching had been censored from the original and parts of scenes had been removed. I cannot say that the PQ had suffered in this DishNetwork pan and chopped version!


Compared to the DVD, the color was warmer in the non-blue sfx scenes. The DVD just lacked the color luster and overall had a gray dirty cast to it. One thing I noticed was the scenes where the ring was shown, I could tell on the HDTV version that it was a real 18K gold ring while the ring in the DVD looked almost like a plastic prop or at best a 10K gold cheap piece of costume jewelry.


I'm happy I spent the $5.99 for the recording now so I have the tww good HDTV tapes in the set. I used a Maxell ST180 for the stock as it just fit!
 

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"""The OAR issue did bother me because I could tell early on that it was not just an opened matte super35 transfer. They had to be zooming and cropping the sides because otherwise the 2.35 AR would have chopped off some of the actor's eyes.""


i can't visualize what you are saying.. how would the oar presentation of the film cut off actors eyes. sorry for the dumb question; good to hear it looked good tho.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by tonyb100

[Bi can't visualize what you are saying.. how would the oar presentation of the film cut off actors eyes. sorry for the dumb question; good to hear it looked good tho. [/b]
He's saying that *if* the PPV version were in fact the original "open-matte" source, then the scoped version on DVD and in theaters would have 'cut off actors ears and eyes.'


In any case, an A/B compare of the PPV to the DVD will immediately show that the PPV version is cropped.


HDC
 

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Quote:
The OAR issue did bother me because I could tell early on that it was not just an opened matte super35 transfer. They had to be zooming and cropping the sides because otherwise the 2.35 AR would have chopped off some of the actor's eyes.
Someone else said that, because of time constraints, most of the f/x in TTT was all done at the OAR, so they couldn't just open the matte as in FOTR, which would 'splain the cropping. The framing was often badly claustrophobic, and unlike with FOTR, I don't think that the added detail (and it was substantially more detailed in low action scenes) makes up for the butchery of this transfer, so I'd probably just watch the DVD instead.


The thing about DTV, if you watched it again, you might not see any problems, as with the SW:ATOC presentation a while back, where the first one was a joke of macroblocking, but then subsequently it looked a lot better. The problem here though is that it's PPV, so you have to pay $5 a pop to find out if they are having dynamic bandwidth constraints on that particular night.


But, overall, I believe that people should let them know in no uncertain terms that you want your money back because they are not providing either a high def experience (in DTV's case) or presenting the film that you paid for, as it was presented in the theater (in both cases.) If they don't have some economic pressures on them about this, they'll continue to ignore the issue. Also tell them that you are considering other options in your area, if they exist. Comcast is starting to become a viable option here, and is picking up more and more HD channels it looks like, and they can provide me with a faster internet connection than my current DSL arrangement.
 

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I really hope the people at D* understand that the people on this forum are not happy with what they are doing to HD. I know D* spent a lot of money on equipment to stat mux, but the PQ compromise is very noticeable. I really hope that they find the bandwidth to pass the full 19 megabits for each HD channel, because if they don't I will drop them immediately after football season. They have a little over 3 months to get it right.
 

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I doubt DirecTV will have the option of going fill bandwidth on the HDTV channels. It was a decision to offer lower quality and more channels or just a few channels at full inbound quality. They made that choice. I use mostly DirecTV now for general HDTV viewing but as soon as the E* 921 is here, I will be moving over to their package. Currently they have more channels by a count of 1 that I watch so DirecTV held the king of the hill for just a couple months so for me it makes sense. I tried NFL ST this year but I have been thoroughly disappointed in the benefit to me. Other than examination of a couple of parts of the HD games, I have not yet used NFL ST because of blackout rules. Consequently, NFL ST has not been the lure I though it would be to hold me to DirecTV when Dish began to add many more new channels and have the DVR for HDTV. I probably will be reducing my package on DirecTV to bare minimum or even less!


As far at LOTR- I may buy the DVD set anyway because when I rented it I found some great reference stuff in the commentary that I would like to have but if I plan to sit and watch the movie, the HDTV tape from Dish will be my choice due to the superior picture quality of HDTV and the fact that I found the lack of 2.35 AR not an extreme detriment to the story. It is just a bother to know it is not "How it was intended to be seen"
 

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I didn't buy the standard edition TTT, as I did with FOTR, because my income is non-existant these days. But I'll definitely get the EE version, because I've gotten way more than my money's worth out of the EE version of FOTR.
 

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It seems to me that if they would show the 2.35:1 films letterboxed instead of cropped, it would end up compressing a lot better.


Also, are the HD masters anamorphic? If not, then they would actually be having to crop the image from 1920x1080 to 1440x810 to remove the black bars from the top and keep the aspect ratio. This 1440x810 image would then be scaled to 1920x1080i and encoded. We are still having scaling going on in that case.
 

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I doubt the HD masters are anamorphic since HD is a square pixel format. They should be able to get better compression with the letterboxed version, though of course if they'd give it full bandwidth that letterboxed version would look better also.
 

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For what it's worth, I recorded the Dish version of TTT with my Dish 5000/mod/Hipix card. Now that I am backing up the recording, I can only get compression of about 2% to tape, whereas I usually get at least 20% compression on typical HBO and Showtime recordings. This indicates to me that very few null packets were sent with this broadcast.


It would be interesting to compare what kind of compression people can get if they archive their DirecTV 169time recordings of TTT on HTPC's. At PPV prices, I don't think I want to try this just to satisfy my curiosity.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Dean Roddey
The thing about DTV, if you watched it again, you might not see any problems, as with the SW:ATOC presentation a while back, where the first one was a joke of macroblocking, but then subsequently it looked a lot better. The problem here though is that it's PPV, so you have to pay $5 a pop to find out if they are having dynamic bandwidth constraints on that particular night.
Dean,


I watched the first 5 minutes again ... and the picture broke up in the same exact place, with the same severity. So either the broadcast tape/disk is damaged or the bit stream is hitting the same speed limit.


HDC
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Dean Roddey
Probably the latter.
The troubling part of this is that I think the D* PPV channel is the only HD channel on that transponder. The other two (ED) NFL channels appear to be on 101. I don't know what else could be on 119/23 unless it is SD material.


HDC
 

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Quote:
For what it's worth, I recorded the Dish version of TTT with my Dish 5000/mod/Hipix card. Now that I am backing up the recording, I can only get compression of about 2% to tape, whereas I usually get at least 20% compression on typical HBO and Showtime recordings. This indicates to me that very few null packets were sent with this broadcast.
Dish's feed of LOTR:TTT is reportedly in the 16.5-17.0Mbps range, at least on 105. I haven't yet heard anyone report a bit rate for the DirecTV version, but it will probably vary depending on what else is showing on the same transponder.


If anyone plans to record LOTR:TTT again from DirecTV, please post the bit rate reported by your 169time.
 
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