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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
For music only (of any kind but pipe organs), what is the lowest note created by a instrument?
 

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somewhere around 25hz... give or take a few...


there's a good diagram somewhere that i can't find right now that will show you...


edit: shady posted the diagram...
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Wow! Thanks Shadyj!

The reason I asked is that, looking at tower speakers, it is very hard to find ones (in my price range) that go below 35 Hz or so.

Thanks!
 

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^^^


that's why the audio gods gave us subwoofers...
 

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Quote:
The reason I asked is that, looking at tower speakers, it is very hard to find ones (in my price range) that go below 35 Hz or so.

Very true and a lot of them don't measure much below 50 Hz. It's my understanding that other factors can play a role here, however:


1) Room boundaries can give a boost to low notes, so you may get deeper bass in-room than what's measured anechoically. (Deep and smooth are not the same thing, however.)


2) Much of what you hear in those low notes is harmonics. Your speakers may not reproduce a 30 Hz fundamental very well, but they'll handle the second harmonic at 60 Hz just fine, so you'll still "hear" that bass note pretty well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnarus /forum/post/18204707


Very true and a lot of them don't measure much below 50 Hz. It's my understanding that other factors can play a role here, however:


1) Room boundaries can give a boost to low notes, so you may get deeper bass in-room than what's measured anechoically. (Deep and smooth are not the same thing, however.)


2) Much of what you hear in those low notes is harmonics. Your speakers may not reproduce a 30 Hz fundamental very well, but they'll handle the second harmonic at 60 Hz just fine, so you'll still "hear" that bass note pretty well.

True. Another reason you should not go by "specs" alone when choosing a speaker. It just gives you a idea.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
What exactly do "fundamentals" and "harmonics" mean on the graph?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by karlsaudio /forum/post/18208218


What exactly do "fundamentals" and "harmonics" mean on the graph?

Fundamentals are quite literally the fundamental tones of the instrument, or what notes they can play. The Harmonics are the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc, order harmonics that are reproduced by the instrument when they play their notes. This is different from the timbre of the instrument, which gives it its unique sound, and overtones, which are frequencies reproduced above the fundamental which are not harmonically related to the fundamental. Maybe that's what they mean by "overblow"?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by karlsaudio /forum/post/18204648


Wow! Thanks Shadyj!

The reason I asked is that, looking at tower speakers, it is very hard to find ones (in my price range) that go below 35 Hz or so.

Thanks!

Also keep in mind that in music, there is very little content below the 50-60hz range. You might never notice the difference between and 50hz and 30hz capable speakers in most of the music you listen too.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lmacmil /forum/post/18209065


Also keep in mind that in music, there is very little content below the 50-60hz range. You might never notice the difference between and 50hz and 30hz capable speakers in most of the music you listen too.


Wow thats pretty inaccurate.


There is tons of content down to 30Hz out there. Lets not assume the OP listens to what anyone else listens too.


A drum beat easily goes down that low, Bass guiter of course.


Not that any of this matters, a better setup has a sub involved anyways.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by karlsaudio /forum/post/18204648


Wow! Thanks Shadyj!

The reason I asked is that, looking at tower speakers, it is very hard to find ones (in my price range) that go below 35 Hz or so.

Thanks!

You honestly do not want main speakers that go extremely low because they will not give you the best low frequency response in room. You want mains and properly integrated sub.
 

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but how low can your hear (feel)



the fundamental is the primary note, think of harmonics as 'echos' or refelctions of those, in interger intervals


although there is less content
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArthurPE /forum/post/18209117


but how low can your hear (feel)



the fundamental is the primary note, think of harmonics as 'echos' or refelctions of those, in interger intervals


although there is less content
 

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Quote:
There is tons of content down to 30Hz out there. Lets not assume the OP listens to what anyone else listens too.


A drum beat easily goes down that low, Bass guiter of course.

The chart reproduced above lists several varieties of drum, none of which go anywhere near 30 Hz. An electric bass goes to about 42 Hz. (Some concert basses go lower.)


Yes, there's musical content below 50 Hz. But not a whole lot.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray /forum/post/18209157


You can hear much lower then this disucussion



Also, those interger intervals are simply each octave above the fundamental note correct?


I'm no musician, but I think it works like this


harmonics are interger multiples of the freq if f =100 then:

200, 300, 400, 500....

Hn = f x n, n = 2, 3, 4, 5....


octaves are doubles (or halves) if f = 100 then:

50, 25...or 200, 400, 800

OCTn = 1/n x f AND n x f where n = 2^i, i = 1, 2, 3...
 

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A kick drum produces frequencies significantly lower than 50 Hz as the chart suggests. A standard four-string bass goes down to 42 Hz and a five-string goes to 31.5 Hz. However, these frequencies in the first two audible octaves (20-80 Hz) by themselves are tough to hear and differentiate. It's the overtones produced by the instrument that give the "notes" their character.


Harmonics and overtones are the same thing. Instruments sound different, in large part, because each stresses different overtones in the series for any given note played.
 

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The fundamental is the basic "lowest" frequency contained when an instrument is playing a note. E.g. concert A = 440Hz.


The overtones are all frequencies produced which are higher than the fundamental; these are a big part of determining an instrument's sound.


The harmonics are a subset of the overtones; harmonics are those overtones which are "harmonically related" to the fundamental. That is, harmonics are integer multiples of the fundamental. So if fundamental = F Hz, then 1st harmonic = fundamental = 1*F, second harmonic = 2*F, third harmonic = 3*F, etc. The overtones of most, but not all, instruments tend to be harmonic, so the terms are often confused.


An octave is an interval of frequencies of the form [F, 2F]; i.e. the highest frequency is twice the lowest. So the frequency n octaves above F is 2^n * F, the frequency n octaves below F is 2^-n * F.


Even if an instrument's lowest possible fundamental is, say, 40 Hz, it may still produce frequencies near zero Hz when a string/hammer/whatever is struck. These are sometimes called attack transients; the math tells you that an impulse sound (like a hand clap, drumstick strike, etc) will in fact contain all frequencies, including those extending down to zero Hz. Whether or not these appear on any given recording depends on a lot of things, such as how closely the instrument was miked, use of EQ/filtering, etc. However, if you mike an instrument closely enough, you will see that you definitely capture transients which are well below the fundamental.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by penngray /forum/post/18209093


You honestly do not want main speakers that go extremely low because they will not give you the best low frequency response in room. You want mains and properly integrated sub.

This is the best advice so far.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ArthurPE /forum/post/18209117


but how low can your hear (feel)

You can hypothetically hear down to 20Hz and feel a lot lower.
 
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