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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Lyngdorf Audio TDAI-2170

This is supposed to be an outstanding two channel

- http://www.lyngdorf.com/products//tdai-2170

- http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/inte...al-integrated-amplifier-review/all-pages.html

The Absolute Sound Calls TDAI-2170 “The Way of the Future”:
The
Lyngdorf Audio TDAI-2170 is covered in the May/June 2015 issue of the widely-read magazine The Absolute Sound with a comprehensive, four-page review. Robert E. Greene states that the glories of the TDAI-2170 are two-fold, crediting its digital amplification an…

https://slaudio.app.box.com/lyngdorfaudio/1/2327475601/19989041501/1

http://www.lyngdorf.com/technologies/

https://slaudio.app.box.com/lyngdorfaudio/1/2327474335/27919030026/1

 

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TAS have been regurgitating the same drivel for decades.
 
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Discussion Starter #3
I heard it today with 802Diamonds

Very nice but I could not compare it with anything else also the 802D were stuck against the wall!!
 

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It is absolutely outstanding.
This is not an ordinary amplifier, it is a full digital amplifier, using the concept that was develloped for the Millennium amplifier, the first full digital one, back in 9 but that few people uses.
Basically it takes a PCM or DSD signal, a processor converts it (in a lossless process) to a PWM signal and this signal is used to open/close the transistors. Volume control is not done atenuating the signal, but using an elaborated power supply and controlling the voltage applied to the transistors. So, no losses at low volumes.
You end up with the supposed analogue signal modulated in a high frequency digital wave. There is no real analogue conversion until the speakers.

Regarding the fact that the 802s were against the wall, this amplifier is equiped with their room correction system. With this, you have correction in the frequency domain of any horn distortion caused by the walls/floor. And if you have the speakers agains the wall, you have phase response optimised, since the reflections will be quite in phase with the speakers sound. So it makes sense to optimize the speakers' position to optimal phase response and let the room correction optimize frequency response. This will give you a much tighter bass response than with speakers 4 ft away from wall...

I've heard the old TDAI2200 with BWs 802, and it performed great. This week I just heard the new 2170 with a pair of huge top of the range Ushers (BE20 Diamond) and the result was amazing.

You should definetly hear it. You'll find out that you never heard such a silent amplifier (cranck the volume to the max - with the source stopped, and try to listen to any hum or hiss on the tweeter, and you'll hear nothing at all), and no one so detailed and transparent. At least with digital sources...
 

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There is no real analogue conversion until the speakers.
Type: Two-channel digital integrated amplifier with RoomPerfect roomcorrection system;
pulse width modulation output; 390kHz switching rate; level adjusted by control of power supply voltage
Power output: 85Wpc, 8 ohms; 170Wpc, 4 ohms
Output filter: Second order, 50kHz
Inputs: Two analog, singleended, two coaxial digital (up to 192kHz/24-bit) four optical digital (up to 96kHz/24-bit)
Outputs: One coaxial digital (96kHz/24-bit), one single ended analog
Optional modules: HDMI modules with four inputs (up to 19 kHz/24-bit plus DSD64/DSD128) and one output /CEC & ARC compatible;
streaming USB input module (up to 384kHz/32-bit and DXD/
DSD64/DSD128); highend analog input module (three single-ended, one balanced)
Dimensions: 17 3/4 " x 4" x 14 1/4" Weight: 17.6 lbs.
Price: approx. $3999 depending on choice of optional modules
LYNGDORF AUDIO Ulvevej 28 DK-7800 Skive, Denmark
[email protected]
lyngdorf.com

A low pass filter - on the 390kHz switching output, even at 50khz, sounds suspiciously like a touch of digital to analog conversion to me

Here is some pseudo PWM filtered at the same relative frequency rate:

 

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D/A is done at the end of the signal chain in these "true digital" aka power DAC amps.



This appears to depict TI's Equibit technology (acquired via Toccata ca. 2000) vs. typical Class D.

Lyngdorf/Tact used Toccata around the same 2000 timeframe. Dunno if Lyndorf still does, or if they've since developed their own solution. NAD makes amps with similar topology.

Edited to add: At CEDIA last week, I asked the Steinway/Lyngdorf gents if they're still using Equibit in their current "digital" amps and they verified that yes, they are.
 

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I can't believe this unit isn't more popular given every review I read is a gushing rave. I have planar speakers, and after reading about how Room Perfect prefers the speakers up close to the front wall unlike how my planars want to be placed, I wonder if RP is as effective on planars with the bi-polar radiations? I hope to be able to get an in home trial of the 2170 after the first of the year.
Has anyone gone from separates with all the needed cabling, to the 2170? Glad you did? I would appreciate any owners chiming in on their experiences, or even anyone who auditioned one.
Thanks.
 

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Since the 2170 doesn't decode Dolby or DTS, when using the HDMI board, can it optimally use a Blu Ray's Hi Rez digital information?
 

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I'm having a hard time understanding the differences between this and the NAD C390DD.

Not knocking the product at all, in fact I found this page in researching it as an upgrade mostly for the room correction benefits. But it seems to me the topology is the same.

It would make an easy drop in replacement.
 

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TDAI-2170 in a Surround System?

Hi guys,


use anyone of the TDAI-2170 owners the amp in a surround system and will report about his experiences?


I wanna use the TDAI-2170 for the fronts L/R and the subwoofers in a 9.2 Auro-3D setup in combination with Audyssey MultEQ 32XT. I read already the instructions in the manual and so far quite everything is clear for me, but I'm not sure how the the acoustic result will be, if RoomPerfect is use for the fronts L/R & the subwoofers and Audyssey for the rest of the channels (center, surround and front- & back-height)? Should I use Audyssey for the effect channels only for the speaker level adjustment, means no EQ?


Best thanks in advance!
Cheers!
Markus
 

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I've always wanted one of these. Not being able to do much acoustic treatments because of the WAF (only room treatment is a wool rug over the hardwood), I've always used room correction with an AVR and if you've been on the 2 channel forum enough you've heard me say that. I'd love to have on of these and that could make me ditch the avr. Since the HK990 is no longer around it looks like this is about the only thing our there in the two channel world for integrated amps. I've read good things about Room Perfect. McIntosh uses it in the MEN220 pre. The nice thing about Room Perfect is it doesn't just adjust for the sitting position as Audyssey, but it adjusts for the room. Measurements are taken at various places in the room including near walls. It tells you when it has enough measurements and then does its thing.

Maybe one day. At 3999 to 4999 depending upon the optional inputs ordered, it may be a long wait.
 

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Hi guys,


use anyone of the TDAI-2170 owners the amp in a surround system and will report about his experiences?
I have a DPA 1 that I use in that manner but I don't have Audyssey. Another Lyngdorf forum has some suggestions for setting up the system.

I find the results to be stellar. Then again RoomPerfect says it's only applying 4%.

My AVR feeds the L/R of the DPA1 into the home theater passthrough. I have the AVR set to full range on L/R. For the subwoofer, I actually use a Xilica to mix the low-pass signal from the DPA1 and the subwoofer output from the AVR. I think if your crossover is set low enough then this mixing would be unnecessary.
 

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I've always wanted one of these. Not being able to do much acoustic treatments because of the WAF (only room treatment is a wool rug over the hardwood), I've always used room correction with an AVR and if you've been on the 2 channel forum enough you've heard me say that. I'd love to have on of these and that could make me ditch the avr. Since the HK990 is no longer around it looks like this is about the only thing our there in the two channel world for integrated amps. I've read good things about Room Perfect. McIntosh uses it in the MEN220 pre. The nice thing about Room Perfect is it doesn't just adjust for the sitting position as Audyssey, but it adjusts for the room. Measurements are taken at various places in the room including near walls. It tells you when it has enough measurements and then does its thing.

Maybe one day. At 3999 to 4999 depending upon the optional inputs ordered, it may be a long wait.

Thanks for your feedback and your hint to the McIntosh RoomPerfect processor. I checked the MEN220, but alone the pro blows my budget. :)
 

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I have a DPA 1 that I use in that manner but I don't have Audyssey. Another Lyngdorf forum has some suggestions for setting up the system.

I find the results to be stellar. Then again RoomPerfect says it's only applying 4%.

My AVR feeds the L/R of the DPA1 into the home theater passthrough. I have the AVR set to full range on L/R. For the subwoofer, I actually use a Xilica to mix the low-pass signal from the DPA1 and the subwoofer output from the AVR. I think if your crossover is set low enough then this mixing would be unnecessary.

Best thanks! Your impressions sounds good and makes me feel very confident to try/buy the TDAI-2170. I will read the other discussion thread.


Yes, my crossover will be low, maximum 80-90 Hz.
 

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I can't believe this unit isn't more popular given every review I read is a gushing rave. I have planar speakers, and after reading about how Room Perfect prefers the speakers up close to the front wall unlike how my planars want to be placed, I wonder if RP is as effective on planars with the bi-polar radiations? I hope to be able to get an in home trial of the 2170 after the first of the year.
Has anyone gone from separates with all the needed cabling, to the 2170? Glad you did? I would appreciate any owners chiming in on their experiences, or even anyone who auditioned one.
Thanks.
I have a pair of the older TDAI 2200 amplifiers in an active tri-amp setup with big planars (Apogee Studio Grands). The TDAI 2200 is almost identical; a bit more power and a linear power supply but the roomperfect module and equibit architecture are the same. Roomperfect is superb with planars. Handles them with aplomb.
 

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I am interested in this amplifier. Has anyone heard it with CM10 S2 speakers? Does it have enough power to drive them adequately? I can't find a dealer anywhere near me that sells both of these units.
 

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How do these compare to miniDSP Dirac Live units? Or how does RoomPerfect compare to Dirac Live in general?

I've been using a miniDSP DDRC-22D Dirac Live processor (digital in/digital out) but I recently sold it because I want something with full crossover functionality for my Rythmik FM-8 stereo subs.

I was going to go with a new miniDSP SHD, but I notice there's a local TDAI 2200 that's available on the used market. I would be selling my re-capped Krell KAV-250a/3 power amp and Wyred4Sound STP-SE preamp (and I guess also my Esoteric SA-50 CD/SACD Player/DAC) to switch over to the Lyngdorf.

Would you go for it?
 

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I am interested in the Lyngdorf TDAI-2170. I really only want it for the amplifiers and RoomPerfect room correction, but I want to use a separate Streamer and DAC.

So with all of Lyngdorf's talk about "digital amplification", will I be losing something in the D-to-A then A-to-D conversion? If I use analog inputs on the Lyngdorf to output to the speakers, will it bypass the devices internal DAC? Thanks!
 

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I am interested in the Lyngdorf TDAI-2170. I really only want it for the amplifiers and RoomPerfect room correction, but I want to use a separate Streamer and DAC.

So with all of Lyngdorf's talk about "digital amplification", will I be losing something in the D-to-A then A-to-D conversion? If I use analog inputs on the Lyngdorf to output to the speakers, will it bypass the devices internal DAC? Thanks!
Go for the 3400 and you'll have the streamer and dac built in. I wanted a TDAI-2170. My speaker manufacturer thought it was a bit underpowered for my speakers to give them adequate headroom. His line in the sand has always been 100 wpc at 8 ohms.

The 3400 is about 2500 more,which is a bummer as that would do the job and then some and have the streaming and usb playback I desire.

As the TDAI series of integrated amps works digitally, I wouldn't think it would need to do d/a conversion if you feed it a digital signal. It would work with the digital signal it has. If you feed it analog it will have to do a/d conversion. Great concept for feeding an integrated a digital signal. The nice think is it is available with HDMI inputs. So a lot of us who use universal players like Oppo for everything, have hdmi capability.
 
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