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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17159256


I have California Comcast and the unit is getting a direct cable from the main house splitter. I had Comcast measure out every outlet and they were all within spec.


My first hook up:

Coax into 2160A ant in. HDMI out to A/V receiver. Coax pass through to Samsung LN52A750 LCD.

Results:
The TV picks up over 400 digital, 90 analog, and about 30 over the air channels. This is more channels then what I get when using the HD Cable box I'm using for ON DEMAND.

That's quite incredible. Do they not encrypt anything in Ca. I'm not familiar with that TV, by any chance do you have a cable-card installed in it?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17159256


My 2160A came in today and I have it hooked up to cable. From reading most of these threads it mentioned the "A" model has a known digital tuner problem. Didn't realize how bad it was until I tried it myself.


I have California Comcast and the unit is getting a direct cable from the main house splitter. I had Comcast measure out every outlet and they were all within spec.


My first hook up:

Coax into 2160A ant in. HDMI out to A/V receiver. Coax pass through to Samsung LN52A750 LCD.

Results:

The TV picks up over 400 digital, 90 analog, and about 30 over the air channels. This is more channels then what I get when using the HD Cable box I'm using for ON DEMAND. The 2160A, not a single digital channel. I read up a bit more and figured that I might have a "Digital Cliff" effect because I do have a signal amplifier installed by Comcast. This leads to a change in hook up.

Only a question on this: how do you get the antenna signal for those OTA channels, a 2nd coax connection on the TV?

Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17159256


Second hook up:

Coax into a DB-6 splitter. Coax to 2160A with -6db. Coax to TV from splitter pass through. HDMI out to A/V receiver.

Results:

I get digital signals this time on the 2160A!!! Well at least a fraction of what I should get. I'm happy I got the digital channels to my 2160A but it really is about a tiny fraction. This is an insane difference between the LCD tuner vs the 2160A tuner. Also the TV looks much better with its own signal. I do understand that the 2160A has to convert to HDMI out, but its a huge difference between viewing digital channels from the TV versus the 2160A. Is there any hook up or setting to improve the 2160A digital tuner picture quality?


Will dropping the db a bit more help? Also on my TV, the analog and digital channels are on one tuner. So when flipping through channels I get 2, 2.1,2.2 with the .x being digital but on the 2160A I have to use the DTV/TV button to access my digital channels. If its in TV mode I only get standard, and in DTV mode I only get digital. This is kind of a pain in the arse to switch. Is there a method to combine them like my TV?

The TV/DTV switch is reqd for the 2160A's hybrid tuner. Your TV has an integrated analog/digital tuner so no switching reqd. Nothing you can do about that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17159256


Wajo: What would you recommend for video settings on my 2160A with the components I'm using? I have listed my full A/V hook up below.


A/V hook up:

Coax from main splitter to Motorola DCH3200 Digital Cable Box

HDMI out from DCH3200 to Samsung LCD LN52A750

Optic out from DCH3200 to Yamaha AVR RX-V663


PS3 HDMI out to AVR. This is my main source for movies and network streaming.


Coax from main splitter to DB-6 splitter. Coax -6db to 2160A. Coax pass through to LCD. HDMI out to AVR.


Logitech Harmony 880

6.1 Speaker Set.


I'm looking into upgrading the HDD on the 2160A but I want to make sure this is the unit to keep. If there isn't much more I can do about the tuner issue then I'll proceed to the upgrade and pray Funai comes out with a FW fix. If it is a unit issue tuner problems then I might swap for another from Walmart and pray I get one with a better digital tuner. I'm getting about 50-70 digital channels right now and mostly the useless ones.

To check for a bad tuner, I'd connect directly from 2160A to TV using BOTH HDMI and Composite Y/W/R (with Progressive Scan OFF)... I know, yuk! is the first reaction, but I get a better pic from my 3575 for straight TV stuff with my cable feed, which is Composite. I'm preserving the Composite signal all the way to the TV and letting the TV upscale to its native 1080p.


Also, I get a better pic thru HDMI by sending 480p and YCbCr Format.


You could try these plus play with HDMI settings as described in this help file ?


These would let you know if the tuner is defective in some way or not?


On the lower number of digital channels, 50-70 is actually good compared to my 13. Some other people also are lucky enough to get as many of those "in-the-clear" digitals as you.


First of all, all DVDRs only have physical digital channels 1-135 so they can only tune those cableco channels that they place in or map to those 135 channel slots. They "allow" some channels in those slots to be tuned only cuz the FCC forces them to (locals that can be recd over-the-air) and cuz many people can only afford basic cable, so they have to be able to tune SOMETHING with older analog TVs and new HDTVs (if they can afford one). Their higher numbered channels are ones only their box can tune and serve as a way to force you to rent that box... for extra fee of course.


Cablecos also *typically* scramble as many channels as they can get away with to force you to their box, so people with that box (like you) will have to record the digital channels not in-the-clear via a line connection from the box to L1 on the 2160A.


While a few people with 2160A's have proved that it might not be able to tune all possible channels in their cable system, the only way they knew that was to have or also buy an original 2160 and compare the two. I don't know of a way to verify that your 2160A is tuning all the in-the-clear channels available, but with 50 or more, it sounds about right (altho can't define "right").
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17159256


...Also the TV looks much better with its own signal. I do understand that the 2160A has to convert to HDMI out, but its a huge difference between viewing digital channels from the TV versus the 2160A. Is there any hook up or setting to improve the 2160A digital tuner picture quality?

It has a lot less to do with the HDMI and everything to do with the conversion from HD to SD. Anything that the 2160A tunes and outputs to HDMI/component/composite/s-vid (or records) is down-converted to Standard Def format. That's why your picture looks less good when viewing from the HDMI as opposed to directly from the TV. Depending on how good your TV's upscaler is, tinkering with the HDMI output resolution (480p/1080i/1080p) may improve some aspects of the picture quality (jaggies, shimmering).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson /forum/post/17159593


That's quite incredible. Do they not encrypt anything in Ca. I'm not familiar with that TV, by any chance do you have a cable-card installed in it?

I honestly don't know but I subscribe to the basic package from Comcast and through their box I receive about 80-90 analog and less then 80 digital. With the direct cable feed I am getting an insane amount of digital and makes me kinda wonder if having the box is even worth it. My girlfriend does love her ON DEMAND though so I do need to keep the box, also they don't charge you for the first box anyways, so now I have 3 modes set up on the Harmony to watch TV. 1st is ON DEMAND, direct cable, DVR. I don't have cable cards installed anywhere besides the one built into the cable box itself. Seems kinda odd that if I wanted to have more channels to watch I would have to bypass my cable box, but that is the cableco's way of charging you more in order to receive more from the box. I just thought the cableco regulates everything that comes from their cable lines and for them to offer that many channels from the coax directly seems contradictory.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17162265


I honestly don't know but I subscribe to the basic package from Comcast and through their box I receive about 80-90 analog and less then 80 digital. With the direct cable feed I am getting an insane amount of digital and makes me kinda wonder if having the box is even worth it. My girlfriend does love her ON DEMAND though so I do need to keep the box, also they don't charge you for the first box anyways, so now I have 3 modes set up on the Harmony to watch TV. 1st is ON DEMAND, direct cable, DVR.

Just out of curiosity, are any of the channels repeats? If your TV can tune to the real channel and virtual channel, it may look like you are getting twice as many channels.


When ATSC broadcasts started in my area, my tuner would pick up several networks twice, one on the actual frequency and the second on the given channel number, both were the same digital signal.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/17159741


Only a question on this: how do you get the antenna signal for those OTA channels, a 2nd coax connection on the TV?

I honestly don't know how it's getting OTA channels but yesterday was the first time I had a direct coax feed into the TV. I ran a new coax from the main splitter to the DVR so I wouldn't have to rely on the cable box tuner. (100+ degree attic temperatures wasn't fun and fishing through walls.)Once it was hooked up I did a channel scan, selected AUTO, Analog(STD/HRC/IRC), Digital (STD/HRC/IRC) I'm not sure what HRC/ICR mean. Once the auto program was completed it showed DTV Cable: 412 found, Cable: 86 found (analog I assume), and Air: 12 (OTA I assume, and not the 30 I quoted earlier).


Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/17159741


The TV/DTV switch is reqd for the 2160A's hybrid tuner. Your TV has an integrated analog/digital tuner so no switching reqd. Nothing you can do about that.

Win some, lose some.



Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/17159741


To check for a bad tuner, I'd connect directly from 2160A to TV using BOTH HDMI and Composite Y/W/R (with Progressive Scan OFF)... I know, yuk! is the first reaction, but I get a better pic from my 3575 for straight TV stuff with my cable feed, which is Composite. I'm preserving the Composite signal all the way to the TV and letting the TV upscale to its native 1080p.


Also, I get a better pic thru HDMI by sending 480p and YCbCr Format.


You could try these plus play with HDMI settings as described in this help file ?


These would let you know if the tuner is defective in some way or not?


On the lower number of digital channels, 50-70 is actually good compared to my 13. Some other people also are lucky enough to get as many of those "in-the-clear" digitals as you.


First of all, all DVDRs only have physical digital channels 1-135 so they can only tune those cableco channels that they place in or map to those 135 channel slots. They "allow" some channels in those slots to be tuned only cuz the FCC forces them to (locals that can be recd over-the-air) and cuz many people can only afford basic cable, so they have to be able to tune SOMETHING with older analog TVs and new HDTVs (if they can afford one). Their higher numbered channels are ones only their box can tune and serve as a way to force you to rent that box... for extra fee of course.

I'll be playing with these settings like you said to see what's optimal. It sounds like my unit is working ok and that I need to do some adjustments for picture quality. I needed a confirmation in order to open the unit up and swap the HDD. Thank you. I love the potential of this unit but the tuner defeats digital recordings. I'll post my settings and connections once I find the optimal. Odd that lowering the resolution and running interlaced has better PQ. I'll be keeping up with Funai for FW updates.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/17159741


Cablecos also *typically* scramble as many channels as they can get away with to force you to their box, so people with that box (like you) will have to record the digital channels not in-the-clear via a line connection from the box to L1 on the 2160A.

I do realize the negatives of that box now, never thought it would be that huge of a difference till now. I would have to subscribe to premium in order to get the rest of the channels through the box but by not using it I get them anyways. Again the only advantage is the ON DEMAND. This forces me to use multiple viewing modes. The problem with 2160A tuner is that it's picking up the digital channels that I don't really watch. I think I'm getting 3-4 local stations and the rest I've never watched. I did an actual count last night, 58 digital and about 15-20 digital music stations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/17159741


While a few people with 2160A's have proved that it might not be able to tune all possible channels in their cable system, the only way they knew that was to have or also buy an original 2160 and compare the two. I don't know of a way to verify that your 2160A is tuning all the in-the-clear channels available, but with 50 or more, it sounds about right (altho can't define "right").

I wish I was able to get a hold of a 2160 to do so. J&R discontinued it. Other stores are carrying the 2160A.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb0 /forum/post/17160143


It has a lot less to do with the HDMI and everything to do with the conversion from HD to SD. Anything that the 2160A tunes and outputs to HDMI/component/composite/s-vid (or records) is down-converted to Standard Def format. That's why your picture looks less good when viewing from the HDMI as opposed to directly from the TV. Depending on how good your TV's upscaler is, tinkering with the HDMI output resolution (480p/1080i/1080p) may improve some aspects of the picture quality (jaggies, shimmering).

Thanks chrisb0, I'll be tinkering a bit with it more but it seems that from what you said the 2160A is pretty much going to be a recording mule and if I wanted to watch HD, I would need to use to direct coax to the TV for best quality picture. Playback recordings will have some sort of degradation, just depends on the settings for how much.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dangerdoc1 /forum/post/17162502


Just out of curiosity, are any of the channels repeats? If your TV can tune to the real channel and virtual channel, it may look like you are getting twice as many channels.


When ATSC broadcasts started in my area, my tuner would pick up several networks twice, one on the actual frequency and the second on the given channel number, both were the same digital signal.

I did see some repeats in the channels, I couldn't make out how many and I didn't flip through all of them. The repeats had a different channel though, for example 3.1, 96.14, 114.8 will be the same program. It would be pretty time consuming for me to find out which repeats match each other. The TV registers each individual channel so essentially even through there is 412 channels, there might only be 100-200 different programs. I wonder if there's a way for the TV tuner to differentiate and delete repeats automatically. I know I can do it manually but that would require a whole lot of channel surfing.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17162785


I did see some repeats in the channels, I couldn't make out how many and I didn't flip through all of them. The repeats had a different channel though, for example 3.1, 96.14, 114.8 will be the same program. It would be pretty time consuming for me to find out which repeats match each other. The TV registers each individual channel so essentially even through there is 412 channels, there might only be 100-200 different programs. I wonder if there's a way for the TV tuner to differentiate and delete repeats automatically. I know I can do it manually but that would require a whole lot of channel surfing.

I have the three networks from two cities with the same program content, just diff. commercials. It's really been a blessing cuz we record some programs, like my wife's Soaps, on two diff. 3575's, one from one city and one from the other... helps when one has a transmission problem or stays on weather alerts too long! You might want to KEEP duplicates for similar reasons?
 

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Comcast in my area, while having significantly fewer digital channels I can tune, has about a half dozen exact duplicates.

There's not much you can do about it.
 

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I have a question for anyone using HDMI out to an AVR on the 2160A. I'm not getting 5.1 to my AVR. I am getting HDMI registry on my AVR but the signal is coming up PCM 2 channel. My settings are, HDMI Audio one, DD Bitstream, PCM 96kHz, and I'm using a Yamaha RX-V663. I'm referring to digital broadcast that have DD5.1. Do I need to use the digital coax to my AVR to obtain DD5.1 or is there a setting to get DD5.1 through HDMI?
 

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Just nearly had a heart attack. Was watching EUReKA on SyFy thru my J&R 2160, and suddenly the picture froze. Then, it all went black. Other digital channels were also gone.


I switched to my other recorder's feed (older, no digital tuner) and SyFy was coming thru fine on analog.


Checked out a few channels on the 2160, and the OTAs were there. Got up to a certain point, and began finding the actual cable channels were there. Went back up to SyFy, and it was back.


All I could thinik was that the cable company had gone back to scrambling everything but the OTAs.


Anyone seen anything similar on their machines?


Secondary question-


I did a 4-show high speed dub to DVD on the J&R this afternoon, and the burner made a noticeable "rrrrrr" noise when doing each individual episode. (Noiseless gaps in between as it made ready to do each section of burning.)


Is this a sign that the burner is defective? Going bad?


I played the disc once it was done, and it seemed to play back fine and made no noise.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17163768


I have a question for anyone using HDMI out to an AVR on the 2160A. I'm not getting 5.1 to my AVR. I am getting HDMI registry on my AVR but the signal is coming up PCM 2 channel. My settings are, HDMI Audio one, DD Bitstream, PCM 96kHz, and I'm using a Yamaha RX-V663. I'm referring to digital broadcast that have DD5.1. Do I need to use the digital coax to my AVR to obtain DD5.1 or is there a setting to get DD5.1 through HDMI?

I seem to recall someone saying that the 5.1 format doesn't get transferred to the DVD (or the hard drive?), so playback can't be in that format.


I've done searches for "5.1" on both this thread and the forum, but nothing's coming up. Maybe Wajo's opening post has something on this subject?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ti-triodes /forum/post/17156912


I did a continuous 24 hr TCM session on a 3575 a year ago with no problems so you should be good to go.


Let us know how it works out. Info like that is always welcome around here!

34 hours continuous recording to the HDD came off without a hitch. Only problem is there were no commercials between the end of one program and beginning of next. On several Titles this caused a minor loss of frames at the very end that I would rather have not lost. Oh well, for 34 hours unattended back to back recording I guess it came out as well as could have reasonably been expected. Thanks to all who lent advice and encouragement!
 

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I'm not sure how you did the 34 hours of recording, but what you mention is always going to be a problem in a situation like that.


If you want to do a series of recordings over a certain period, it's a nightmare to get it to stop and start right on the money, that is "between shows". (Especially if you're doing it by way of the timer.)


I'm surprised you only lost a few frames.


I recorded portions of a Twilight Zone marathon for a friend once, and simply broke things up by leaving out episodes that weren't wanted. I started each long timer recording three minutes early, and stopped each a few minutes late. Made sure to get the whole thing, of the episodes that were wanted. Trim off the beginning and end bits, and you're done. Then split the recording at the cut off points.


Any recordings that are split like that need to be dubbed to DVD in real time, tho'. Otherwise, despite your having managed perfect splits, the dubs won't be perfect. You'll get "frame leftovers" from before or after the split.


Dub in real time and the discs will turn out with the perfect cuts you know you made on the hard drive.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamqsr11 /forum/post/17163768


I have a question for anyone using HDMI out to an AVR on the 2160A. I'm not getting 5.1 to my AVR. I am getting HDMI registry on my AVR but the signal is coming up PCM 2 channel. My settings are, HDMI Audio one, DD Bitstream, PCM 96kHz, and I'm using a Yamaha RX-V663. I'm referring to digital broadcast that have DD5.1. Do I need to use the digital coax to my AVR to obtain DD5.1 or is there a setting to get DD5.1 through HDMI?

All MTS audio that goes thru the DVDR's tuner gets processed into L and R channels, then output the same way. So anything you watch thru the DVDR's tuner will be only stereo.


The digital coax audio output will send DD5.1 from a DVD disc to a receiver.


I believe the coax passthru will send whatever audio is in the signal thru to the downstream components (STB, AV, TV)?
 

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Gastrof:


> Was watching EUReKA on SyFy thru my J&R 2160, and suddenly the picture

> froze. Then, it all went black. Other digital channels were also gone.

>

> I switched to my other recorder's feed (older, no digital tuner) and

> SyFy was coming thru fine on analog.

>

> Checked out a few channels on the 2160, and the OTAs were there. Got up

> to a certain point, and began finding the actual cable channels were

> there. Went back up to SyFy, and it was back.


It has happened a half-dozen times in the last year. My first instinct was to blame Comcast, but am now more inclined to blame the recorder. It may be a glitch in the Comcast signal that initiates the freeze and going black, but another recorder receiving the same channel with the same glitch does not go black if it is not recording. Three days ago my Philips froze while I was chase watching during the recording of tennis, but in the other room where my wife was watching live through her Philips everything was okay. The problem has never happened on an analog channel, but since analog is the minority modus operandi that is not an absolute certainty.


The first few times it happened was during play, the screen would freeze and stay black until the timer had run out. Catching it within minutes has happened a couple of times.


The effect of going black lingers for a few minutes. If I catch it happening, I stop recording, switch to analog, then back to another digital bank and then retune the lost station. Using CH+/- does not work, the tuner does not seem able to lock on anything, in fact it does not even try. Maybe switching to analog has the effect of a reboot of digital tuning.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof /forum/post/17164419


I'm not sure how you did the 34 hours of recording, but what you mention is always going to be a problem in a situation like that.


If you want to do a series of recordings over a certain period, it's a nightmare to get it to stop and start right on the money, that is "between shows". (Especially if you're doing it by way of the timer.)


I'm surprised you only lost a few frames.


I recorded portions of a Twilight Zone marathon for a friend once, and simply broke things up by leaving out episodes that weren't wanted. I started each long timer recording three minutes early, and stopped each a few minutes late. Made sure to get the whole thing, of the episodes that were wanted. Trim off the beginning and end bits, and you're done. Then split the recording at the cut off points.


Any recordings that are split like that need to be dubbed to DVD in real time, tho'. Otherwise, despite your having managed perfect splits, the dubs won't be perfect. You'll get "frame leftovers" from before or after the split.


Dub in real time and the discs will turn out with the perfect cuts you know you made on the hard drive.

Gastroff, it was 16-2 hour recordings and 2-1 hour recordings, all back to back to back. In some instances I lost 5-10 seconds of the end of my recordings, in these cases, all recaps of stuff previously shown in the game, or the cheering crowds at the end. I did manage to get all the important stuff in every recording so I am happy, just not enthralled, by my results.



As far as "splits, wherever I can I split right in the middle of however many "dark" frames are available to me.
 

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Gastrof:


Another random peculiarity of these DVRs on playback is a burst of static in the audio stream and the show goes silent.


Press Replay and the same scenes play with no sound loss.
 
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