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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/18717333


Great!



Now, a BIGGER experiment...


Delete some or all analog channels, then see what you can find in the digital tuner that might be freed of "analog interference"?


Not sure how best to find, but maybe those another device like TV finds already? Either that or a digital AON again?

Well, it was worth a try, wajo. But, no go. I deleted all analog channels except the Weather Channel and a complete digital AON yielded nada.


I got a card in the mail from Comcast on Thursday saying that in addition to being authorized an STB and 2 DTAs, current "Standard" subscribers (the old extended basic tier) could upgrade to the digital starter tier without any additional charge.


When I went to pick up the equipment on Friday, they only had one DTA on hand, so I wound up with 2 STBs, the Moto DCT2224s. Last evening I hooked up one STB to the 3575 via E1 composite. There's no S-video out on the STB. I also connected the STB to the Slingbox via RF (the latter has two IR blasters), so I can now access both units from my PC or laptop in order to remotely manage recordings.


It's not ideal, but better than having only the locals for the 3575 - after the QAMs went scrambled last week.
 

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Discussion Starter #9,602

Quote:
Originally Posted by stump69 /forum/post/18735859


When I went to pick up the equipment on Friday, they only had one DTA on hand, so I wound up with 2 STBs, the Moto DCT2224s.

Just in case you missed it, here's Scott_111's note on setting the 2224 for changing channels at a set time (ignore "VCR instructions").
 

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Discussion Starter #9,603 (Edited)


HOW DVD BURNER OPERATES, USING AS A PLAYER

Jump To:
How Our DVD Burner Operates
Using This DVDR as a DVD Player

How Our DVD Burner Operates

The laser diode (LD) that burns our discs is a packaged semiconductor with heat sink, like the one pictured below. Pics are from this Wiki article.
Packaged Laser Diode
LD Chip on Head of Needle

The heat sink is probably the most-critical part of the design since heat is the No. 1 enemy of the LD, and its focusing lens.

To help understand how our DVD burner operates, here's some info from a Maxim article that helps explain our DVD write (DVD-WR) and read (DVD-RD) operating times. Your accumulated burner DVD-WR and DVD-RD times can be viewed thru the SKIP 321 menu.

The article includes two interesting charts reproduced here: Fig. 1 showing LD Power Levels and Fig. 2 showing a Typical LD Pulse Profile. (Note: "Rewriting Pulse" and "Recording Pulse" in Fig. 2 are identifying the lines only, not a power level.

Fig. 1 - LD Power Levels


Fig. 2 - Typical LD Pulse Profile


Our DVDR LD's are "pulsed" to produce the recorded data marks (pits) in concentric tracks around a DVD. Tracking is aided by grooves in the polycarbonate layer facing the burn media. [Dual-layer (DL) discs have two grooved polycarbonate layers.]

Instead of maintaining the highest Record power level during recording, it pulses between recording and "bias" power repeatedly in a "multi-pulse train" throughout the mark-creation process.

It's important to note that bias power is both the Standby (just-plugged-in) AND DVD-RD power level. It's the power level the machine maintains on the laser while the machine is "off" so it's ready to read from the get-go. As soon as a disc is loaded, the machine starts counting that as DVD-RD time.

That explains why our Skip 321 procedure shows both DVD-WR and DVD-RD times when recording or dubbing to a DVD, where we might expect there to be only DVD-WR time... the laser pulses between rec and bias power throughout the burning process. Also, DVD "Write Strategies," which are stored on most blank discs, call for very short "cooling" pulses, which reduce LD power to the bias level, further adding to the DVD-RD stats.

Go back to list.... Go to main list of help files.

Using This DVDR as a DVD Player

Heat is the worst enemy of the laser diode (LD) and plastic focusing lens in our DVD burners and the LD or lens are almost always the first things to go. That's why heat-sink design is a big deal in DVD drive design.

Many people advise not using this DVDR for DVD playback cuz it makes the LD "wear out" faster. They often recommend a separate player and note how long their players have lasted.

That's a testament to how little wear-and-tear playback causes. A player or recorder's LD uses bias (standby) power when the machine's just ON, when a disc is loaded, and when a disc is being read for playback... same power level for all!

So, basically, our DVDRs use the same no-heat, "just-plugged-in" bias/standby power to read discs, with LD power of ~3-5mW, so they're exactly like players in that respect. It's only when we perform writing ops... burn/erase/format... that the machine kicks the power up to a higher LD power level of ~30-50mW for RTR or an est. 150-200mW for HSD. So, our DVDR LDs could wear out faster, but then...

THE DVD DRIVE IN THIS DVDR IS NOT THE SAME AS THE WUSSY DRIVE IN A PLAYER, where the most stressful thing is reading thru a finger print. A DVDR drive has to be a more "robust" design overall to handle the more stressful burning ops.

In other words, you can certainly use a separate player for playing DVDs if you already have one, can afford to buy one, or have space for one, but for normal family timeshifting and archiving, you can enjoy this DVDR as both a recorder AND a player without undo concern.

Since our DVDR burners use the same STANDBY/OFF (bias power) level as a player for reading a disc, the more likely failure will be of the drive/sled motors. But, even then, no worse odds than of a dedicated player for same number of open/close/load ops.

The real bottom line: PLAYING DVDs generates about as much heat as a piss-ant doing pushups on a marshmallow! Also, DVD drive replacement in our PhilMag DVDRs is a relatively simple DIY job and less than $70 for the burner, as described here.

Go back to list.... Go to main list of help files.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/18733619


Are you talking about a cable signal, not OTA, and thru the tuner or line input rather than the coax passthru, and on programs you know are sending 5.1? Lots of caveats to consider.


I just confirmed that an OTA signal can carry DD5.1 if the program has it, and the 2160's coax passthru should just pass that raw signal thru.


In fact, here's a thread on OTA stations that carry DD5.1.

I'm always cable, never OTA. The only indicator I have for 5.1 is my JVC receiver which has Linear PCM, DD, DTS, and a whole bunch more. The H2160 sends its component video to my TV and the coax to the receiver. No RCA cable on the H2160, no RF out used either. If I tune, with the H2160, to the HD CBS station, the coax output of the H2160 does not make the JVC think 5.1 is present. If I use a Sony HD DVR or a Panasonic EZ28 or my Sony 32XBR9 TV, their optical output always make the JVC indicate 5.1 when tuned to CBS HD, and goes to linear PCM when tuned to any SD channel (and only analog on analog channels). I don't know what makes 5.1 work or why the receiver lights up with 5.1 when I play a DVD on the H2160 that has DD 5.1 on its cover. But it does. I have no other way to test this, sorry. I guess we'll have to leave it with the status that my cable signal and the H2160 tuner are not good friends.


Just to clarify: coax above means S/PDIF and RF means F-type. I guess my use of coax might be confusing, but cable, to the best of my knowledge, is normally RG-59 or RG-6. OTA does not have to be coax, but these days it usually ends up that way through a balun somewhere from the antenna (balanced) to F-type coax (unbalanced).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/18735899


Just in case you missed it, here's Scott_111's note on setting the 2224 for changing channels at a set time (ignore "VCR instructions").

Did I miss something, or did Scott actually say those instructions did NOT work with his 2224, and that he had to get a DCH3200 before he could set a cable box to cooperate with preset recordings?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo /forum/post/18736433


Some random thoughts on the Polaroid, its odd RF inputs and passthru, its sole tuning of ANALOG PBS 22, and its position in the daisy-chain:


FEEDBACK?

ANALOG INTERFERENCE?
?

Nope, on the Polaroid you can choose to do an analog OR digital channel scan, depending on which input you've connected the RF cable. I've not run an analog channel scan on this machine. In this case, it is still picking up DIGITAL PBS on 22.1 and 22.2 from the raw cable, though none of my other tuners can find it.



I'm not complaining though.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof /forum/post/18736676


Did I miss something, or did Scott actually say those instructions did NOT work with his 2224, and that he had to get a DCH3200 before he could set a cable box to cooperate with preset recordings?

You are correct; Scott did say that he had to upgrade in order to get a programmable STB. I went through all the menu options today, and the DCT2224 only has a 'reminder' function that is useless unless you're actually watching another channel at the time and don't want to miss the beginning of another program.
 

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Discussion Starter #9,608

Quote:
Originally Posted by stump69 /forum/post/18736921


Nope, on the Polaroid you can choose to do an analog OR digital channel scan, depending on which input you've connected the RF cable. I've not run an analog channel scan on this machine. In this case, it is still picking up DIGITAL PBS on 22.1 and 22.2 from the raw cable, though none of my other tuners can find it.



I'm not complaining though.

My random thought ref. to a possible influence on the upstream recorders, not the Polo itself... and having no analog channels in button-memory doesn't mean it's not receiving an analog signal and "trying" to do something with it... like feed it back to where it came!
 

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Discussion Starter #9,609

Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof /forum/post/18736676


Did I miss something, or did Scott actually say those instructions did NOT work with his 2224, and that he had to get a DCH3200 before he could set a cable box to cooperate with preset recordings?

Yup, have to change the help file.
 

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Just a quick update ... Going from one recording on 2160 to new 2160 Hdd is great for sequential editing. I like to grab selections from a show and the usual disc edit was a bit laborious since it required that I watch the show, then do multiple edits or even title splits and then dub to DVD. This way , I can watch the recorded show at the same time I'm dubbing selections I want to save from the recording. I think it'll be a timesaver. only did a few last night but I'm liking the workflow. now I have to go back and swap in an s- video cable, which may boost the quality a bit.


Quote:

Originally Posted by wajo

Progressive OFF on the sending Mag.


Receiving Mag OFF only if you're using S-Vid or Comp. to the TV for viewing the result.





One final note -- this still works with the receiving 2160 using component video out to tv and progressive enabled. The source 2160 has to have progressive OFF even if you are not using any output on the machine. The progressive setting being flipped on is enough to keep it from sending out the video signal by svideo or composite output. (At least that's how it seems to be working here)
 

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Regarding 5.1... I've never heard of a DVD player that did not render 5.1 in the digital audio outputs. So the presence of 5.1 when playing a DVD is to be expected.


To receive OTA, the tuner must decode the Transport Stream TS which contains HD and 5.1


Unfortunately, DVD recorders only record the video SD and the audio stereo version of that signal.


To make matters worse, from the days of VHS, surround sound has never been recordable - only what is contained in the stereo tracks. ....Except for D-VHS which was specifically designed to record the entire TS.


Of course HD DVR's do this, but they are just black box containers and do not count at actual recorders - where recorder means recording the content on something, some tape, some disc, etc.


5.1 could be recordable because PC DVD copiers allow you to completely compromise the video quality while chosing to maintain the full 5.1


So as it stands, only D-VHS records the 5.1 (and of course, not to mention, the HD too).


If D-VHS can do it, what is the problem with DVD/HDD units doing it too?


I don't get it.

Tom


PS. Of course, the FCC defined IEE1384 Firewire as the digital interface with D-VHS recording capability but somehow the FCC allowed industry to run wild and develop HDMI which locks everyone out. HD won't be here until I see recorders w/HDMI inputs in my book. So I guess HD will never be available in the form that the FCC promised everyone - a promise that allowed them to sell off the SD frequencies... Also remember, that DVD recorders were the first to be able to record HTSC without appreciable loss - but that was when NTSC was basically obsolete and being shut down. So it may be that we'll see HD recorders for current resolutions when the next HD improvement obsoletes all the current gear.
 

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I do hope that this is the appropriate thread for the forthcoming rambling.


Wisemen,


My picture is not quite as sharp as I think it should be. My Comcast cable rep (on the phone) thinks the picture should be sharper than it is. Insights would be appreciated.


Here is the setup


Cable line feeds into the Magnavox 2160 Ant In

Mag's Ant Out feeds to Cable Box Ant In

Mag's HDMI feeds to TV's HDMI port

Cable Box Ant Out feeds to TV Ant In


As a result of this I am able to watch TV without the Mag being turned on. When it is turned on I can watch via its Analog or its Digital, um tuners, or just continue watching as if it is not turned on.


So far so good. Here is what I am experiencing.


A) With the Mag turned on and using its Digital tuner, the reception is outstanding.

B) With the Mag turned on and using its Analog tuner, the reception is so-so.

C) With the Mag turned off, and viewing through the cable box, the reception is so-so.


Here is the conundrum.


A much older TV (Twelve years versus One year) displays a better image than either of the B/C scenarios above. But perhaps unexpectedly and rightly so, the new TV's display in Scenario A is better than the Old TV's display. I'm using the Price is Right as a barometer (Actually, I'm using TPIR model Rachel as a barometer. Grrrr.) To recapitulate -- With MAG on and viewing through its tuner - picture is outstanding; With Mag on and viewing through analog, or with Mag off and viewing through cable tV, the picture is so-so. Yet, on the old TV the picture quality is consistently somewhere between outstanding and so-so


The plot thickens.


I have an Emerson purchased about 8 years ago that is not connected to cable. In fact, I needed to buy one of those Digital Converter box thingys for it. When I watch TPIR on this set, the image is similar to the oldest TV, namely, the picture quality is better than the new TV without the Mag turned to Digital or with it turned on viewing from Analog.


At first I thought that the new TV, being a superior TV, was showing me more, namely more flaws. But the Comcast rep indicated that this is not how things should work. He informed me that my reception should be as good with the new TV as it is with the old TV.


Before I go about rearranging wires, hooking up a new cable box, or calling in a Comcast technician, I thought I'd run this by you learned men.


Is what I am experiencing normal? If not, any leads as to the cause and any possible remedy?


Thanks again for your time, patience and expertise.



Yours
 

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Discussion Starter #9,613

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lxloco /forum/post/18738651


Cable line feeds into the Magnavox 2160 Ant In

Mag's Ant Out feeds to Cable Box Ant In

Mag's HDMI feeds to TV's HDMI port

Cable Box Ant Out feeds to TV Ant In

You don't say what type of HDTV and size... makes a big diff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lxloco /forum/post/18738651


A) With the Mag turned on and using its Digital tuner, the reception is outstanding.

As it should be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lxloco /forum/post/18738651


B) With the Mag turned on and using its Analog tuner, the reception is so-so.

As it usually is, esp. if the HDTV is BIG. They should ban analog channels on a large HDTV!


I also have cable, which is a composite signal, and my HDMI upconversion makes my pic look very slightly worse, so I use digital Composite (AV) cables to my 47" LCD HDTV.


You should also try HDMI > Format > YCbCr as described in this help file.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lxloco /forum/post/18738651


C) With the Mag turned off, and viewing through the cable box, the reception is so-so.

For max. PQ thru the box, you need a line connection like Component or HDMI for it also.
 

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You should really get a HD cable box and hook the cable boxes HDMI(or component) out directly to your HDTV. I'm guessing your current cable box is only tuning the SD channels while the Maggy is tuning the clear QAM HD channels, that explains why the Maggy looks better.

As to why your older TVs look better with SD, that's a common problem with many HDTVs displaying SD and it has mostly to do with contrast ratio.

If you want to display SD it's best to use a SD set(or a higher quality HDTV) many lower or mid priced HDTVs look fine or even good with HD but not so hot with SD.


Again if you get a HD cable box and tune the HD channels Rachel should look better than ever
especially since CBS is about as good as HDTV gets, 1080i and very good bitrate.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra /forum/post/18736658



Just to clarify: coax above means S/PDIF and RF means F-type. I guess my use of coax might be confusing, but cable, to the best of my knowledge, is normally RG-59 or RG-6. OTA does not have to be coax, but these days it usually ends up that way through a balun somewhere from the antenna (balanced) to F-type coax (unbalanced).

You're right! the terminology is confusing. When I said cable coax, I meant RG-59 or RG-6 coaxial cable. The H2160 Digital Coax does not output DD 5.1 when we use its tuner.


My setup is TWC cable RG-6 Coax --> H2160, H2160 RG-6 Coax --> TV, H2160 HDMI --> Receiver, Receiver HDMI --> TV, TV Optical --> Receiver


When I watch TV using the TV tuner, it routes DD 5.1 audio from broadcast HD programs to the receiver through the Optical cable.
 

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just a quick question is this a dup thread of that huge one about the mag 2160..

or is this totally new information.. just amazed at how well researched these players are.. to hats off again... good stuff!
 

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Discussion Starter #9,617

Quote:
Originally Posted by bodhi78 /forum/post/18738899


You're right! the terminology is confusing. When I said cable coax, I meant RG-59 or RG-6 coaxial cable. The H2160 Digital Coax does not output DD 5.1 when we use its tuner.


My setup is TWC cable RG-6 Coax --> H2160, H2160 RG-6 Coax --> TV, H2160 HDMI --> Receiver, Receiver HDMI --> TV, TV Optical --> Receiver


When I watch TV using the TV tuner, it routes DD 5.1 audio from broadcast HD programs to the receiver through the Optical cable.

Have you tried the 2160's dig. coax audio out with HDMI Audio Off?
 

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Hi all,


I am experiencing 2 minor problems with H2160 # 1. Since I am still wi the 90 day warranty, I thought I would see what the experts think about them.


[1] I was watching a movie which I had earlier recorded to my HDD through a DTV cable channel. At one point the picture got very light for about 3-4 seconds, after which it returned to normal. About 15 minutes later the same thing happened. Other than that the pic quality was excellent. I suppose, that could have come from the original broadcast, but I am wondering if it could be from bad HDD sectors. Thoughts?


[2] Ocassionally, when I turn it on, it wants to tune in to either channel 111 analog, or channel 1.1 digital. The last couple times I turned it on & pressed the DTV/TV button, it first tuned to ch 111. When I pressed this button again, it tuned to ch 1.1. It does not seem to be repeatable. When I turn the unit off & then back on [to see if it will repeat], it tunes to the last station [as it should]. [Maybe time dependent?] When I first got the unit, I had this problem a couple times. I reran autoscan and it appeared to work properly for a while. But it is at it again. Thoughts?


Jer
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuzzo /forum/post/18738917


just a quick question is this a dup thread of that huge one about the mag 2160..

At this stage, with the H2160 being the only available HDD model from Funai for quite some time now, if it were up to me, I'd have at least taken the thread with "Philips" from the stickies and replaced it with the big, dedicated-strictly-to-the-H2160 thread. I mean, when was the Philips 3576H last manufactured and sold new, anyways? It's got to have been almost a couple of years now.
 

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Discussion Starter #9,620

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuzzo /forum/post/18738917


just a quick question is this a dup thread of that huge one about the mag 2160..

or is this totally new information.. just amazed at how well researched these players are.. to hats off again... good stuff!

Not dupes at all and definitely not the same. The vast majority of info is in THIS "huge" Sticky thread. All these models have essentially the same manual and operate virtually the same... they're yearly clones.


There is surprisingly LITTLE in this thread that applies to just one model... what applies to one generally applies to all, which is why there's a single thread to cover multiple, cloned models. Even people with the older models can, and opften do, come here and find everything they need in one thread.


I'm often surprised at people with the older 3575/76 models telling me they're just now finding this thread and wish they had found it sooner, and I'm sure there'll be MANY more who will find it in the future with questions on their "older" models... they're very durable recorders!



Used and refurb'd older models, 3575 and 3576, are still being sold through Amazon, Overstock and others, so some new users may come from there. Essentially, there's no extra "burden" by continuing to talk about those older models since comments apply to all current models too. Most refs to models are in the form of "this DVDR" or "your DVDR."


We've finally gotten to a place that a Google search for Philips 3575, 3576, Mag 2160 and even the new Mag 513 will all see this thread very near the top their list of hits.


Anything discussed in this Sticky thread worthy of note I incorporate in the list of help files, if not already there. That list, page 1 of this thread, has iinks that lead you to virtually all the info on a specific subject. Each subject page also has jump links so you can key in on just one element of that subject as needed... helps people find just a kernel of needed info in a hurry.


Some of the subject matter links back to specific posts by others who have contributed significant info, so people can read summaries, then go on to those other linked posts for ALL the info and details, as desired.


I think MANY people don't even know the pg. 1 list of help files exists. Others say they've read EVERY post, which is OK but prob. unnecessary.

If ever in doubt, go to page 1 for the list of help files.

 
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