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Quote:
Originally posted by Tom_Bombadil


What I've been trying to find out is if a set is properly set up with AVIA/DVE, then how much is the risk lessened? Does it take 3X as long? 5X? Seems like it would lessened considerably vis a vis black bars.

I don't know that there's ever really been anything quantified on that given that you'd need a controled study. I'd venture that you'd get a very significant gain over the black and once contrast and brightness are turned down from torch mode the risk is much less overall regardless of black or grey. I wouldn't even know where to begin to look for a study on this if it did exist.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Tom_Bombadil
Istvan,


I was waiting to see if others who have more experience in dealing with burn-in would respond, seeing none, I'll jump in.


Your logo burn-in is a nasty, and unfortunately all too common, problem. It is surprising that you would have it given that the channel isn't used all that much. Ther reports about burn-in from the MSNBC and Headline News logos and tickers were abundant back after 911 due to the hundreds of hours people left those channels on, even when working around the house, to keep up with the news.


One thing that sometimes lessens or eliminates the problem is to perform a full-screen white-burn. That is, find a way to display a full screen white image (say from a test DVD) for several hours. Or if you have a VCR or DBS receiver that can generate a blue screen with no lettering or symbols on it, then use that and turn up the brightness and contrast to make it pretty bright.


Some who have sophisticated PCs or good image editing tools, can create reverse-burn images, where they capture say a black screen shot that has the logo present, and then create a negative/reverse image of that shot, where then only the logo is black, and then run that screen for a while to even out the picture.


Others may offer more ideas.

Thanks for your answer. I'm pretty upset about that burn in, my son did not watch that channel for more like an hour a day for the past year and a half. As soon as I've got the tv I adjusted brigthness and contrast to less than 50%.
 

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Discussion Starter · #44 ·

Quote:
Originally posted by eRob
Can you still get burn-in with the new DLP and LCD tvs?

No! Now there has been threads about burn-in on LCDs but I don't know how extensive that is.
 

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I have a Sony KP53XBR200 RPTV about 5 years old. I have a little over one month left in my +4 year EW from GE. I also have, courtesy of KTLA Los Angeles, their logo burned into the lower right corner of my TV. Other than boycotting the Morning News, I didn't know what else to do. I tried running an all white image to "wash" the screen, that didn't work.

This weekend I was talking to a CSR at a high end AV store in Santa Monica, and mentioned my problem. He insisted that the EWs they offer cover burn in. I called GE this AM and already have a service scheduled for Thursday for the beast (this set has been one big problem child) and asked about coverage. They want the tech to evaluate it. It sounds like I'll be "let down" gently. I already was LDG trying to claim "lemon" on the TV as I've had the same thing break on the TV 3 times in 4 months. It seems the 3rd occurance happend 3 weeks after the last repair and is still covered by the 30 day mid warranty. If I had waited another 10 days or so, I may have qualified for lemon protection! Grrrrr.

To those that remember this beast, it was quite the set, back in the day. Great SD picture but was plagued early on by green lines in component DVD mode. Sony figured it out and fixed it in the first year. All my problems have been relared to that some input (#5-component) and have been all the calls made to service the set.

I'll report the results on the burn in issue after I see what they do. I scanned above, has anyone successfully had burn in repaired under EW?
 

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Quick question: what is the relation of black level (brightness) and burn-in?


I get white level (contrast) being to high will cause blooming and burn-in. But how does a high black level effect the tubes? Especially if the white level if well below blooming levels.


jdg
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·

Quote:
Originally posted by JohnDG
Quick question: what is the relation of black level (brightness) and burn-in?


I get white level (contrast) being to high will cause blooming and burn-in. But how does a high black level effect the tubes? Especially if the white level if well below blooming levels.


jdg

Contrast and brightness go hand in hand. If your brightness is too high that could possibly cause burn-in. The best thing to do is to use Video Essentials to properly set your brightness.
 

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I have not done extensive research on this yet, but I cannot find info on if a LCD Rear Projection is or is not prone to burn in?



Also, does anyone know if it is or is not safe to use a DVI on non HD stations, or should I have another input hooked up (S-video??) for non HD stations?




I use DVI on my sony WE610 and recently I need to have my TV on with my cable box off and then turn the cable box on while my TV is on to get the picture to appear. I think this is more cable box related since this never used to be the case, but am unsure. Also when this first started happening a message came on the TV that stated "The HD content of this display has been comprimised, please use components inputs". Now I have no clue if this message is from the Comcast HD receiver or my TV. Recently I have not seen this message and the message only started appearing when I had to start recycling cable receiver power with the TV on to get a picture to appear.
 

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I also have an ED plasma used about twice a week in my pool room. Again, I was told that a Component or DVI input used on non HD stations will ruin the TV, is this true? I just got the ED plasm over Memorial Day weekend and so far I like it for the reletively cheap price of $2500 with a wall mount.
 

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Soo...


I have a 57" 16:9 Sony HD-RPTV...


Over the past several months... I became ADDICTED to SOCOM II (A PlayStation 2 Game)


Well... this game involves alot of hiding in dark maps... shooting through bushes... blah blah blah blah blah.


Because of this... my dumbass got sick of squinting and turned the brightness/contrast up pretty high in my `game mode`



Well... luckily... this game doesnt have many areas of high contrast... EXCEPT... for in the bottom right/left corners... there are two areas of white text.



Well... last night I popped in the `Love Actually` DVD (decent for a chick flick
)


The DVD Menu is `PURE WHITE` and right away I noticed what looked like `dirt` on my screen.


Well it was only a few seconds later that I realized... the `dirt` was actually brown-hued... and very vague... outlines of the text from SOCOM. :\\



So... I've looked through the FAQ... and the only fix I saw was `reversing the screen image`


How would I do it in this case... where the only `burn in` is small text outlines in the bottom corners? Is it possible?


If not... what can be repaired in my TV to fix this?
 

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soopa, try to look for info on the "snow" technique. I have seen it referenced as a moderate remedy for burn-in. I assume you just keep snow on your tv for awhile, but do some research into what it involves.


turn your contrast down, as well, if it isn't already. I am not too worried about burn in on my hitachi because the room is pretty dark 24/7 and contrast is at 30 or so.


jomoma....


What box do you have? I have an SA3250HD from timewarner. there is a "passthrough" setting that doesn't convert the signal at all 480i -> 480i, 720p -> 720p, etc. This lets me fill the screen no matter what the signal is. I have no idea if you can damage a tv using DVI. I have heard that LCD and PLasma are susceptible to burn-in just like CRT, but CRT is the most susceptible. in the end it all depends on proper precautions, and about a million other variables
 

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thanks... i'll check that out.


and yeh... i have my `calibrated` setting that im usually on...


but in that dark game it just made it sooo much easier to kill people i play against online with my contrast way up




oh well




hopefully i can fix it.
 

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pheno... i'm having trouble finding info on the `snow technique`... did you see this elsewhere perhaps? link?
 

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There is no problem with using DVI or Component connections. What they are referring to is that in the DVI mode your selection of aspect ratios is limited and sometimes you cant change it at all. So if 4:3 content comes on you cant stretch it so the black bars are there. It seems the plasma people have found that if you watch everything in stretch for the first few hundred hours, they are less susceptible to burn in. You have to watch a good mix of content
 

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Actually plasma sets are more susceptible to burn-in than CRTs. Recent models are better but you can burn a plasma in just a few hours of fixed image viewing. Thus one has to be even more careful of their settings, viewing habits, logos, etc. with a plasma set.


I've read of cases of light burn-in where the "snow" technique has helped. A more drastic manuever is to display a full screen white image with brightness and contrast turned up to try to mask burn areas by doing a full-screen burn.


Burning up a projection TV with games is expensive entertainment there soopa.
 

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Remedy to burn in:

If you can connect your PDP or RPTV to a computer, there is a program that is used by most manufacturers to try to 'fix' a burned in image.

The program is NTEST.exe from Nokia, which can also be found at:

. http://www.majorgeeks.com/download.php?det=960


You want to run the high voltage pattern on this test pattern program for about an hour or so and this should reduce or eliminate your existing burn in.


The premise of this program is similar to running a full white screen; but the act of toggling between dark/white screens ensures that you are running at a maximum voltage mode which 'drives' out burned in particles.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by AFH
IS THERE ANYTHING THAT CAN BE DONE TO CIRCUMVENT "BURN-IN"


Absolutely, the list is as follows:


1) Get your display "calibrated". Now if that entails a professional ISF calibration (~$400) or a calibration via Avia or DVE (~$40). That's your call. Alot of "damage" can be curtailed by dialing down the brightness and contrast from the get go.

2) Put some sort of "color" on the side bars when watching 4:3 content in its native aspect ratio. If you absolutely hate stretching 4:3 content, that is filling the 16:9 aspect ratio of the unit, then make sure that the side bars are set to either "gray" or some other color than "black".

3) Did I mention to dial down the contrast and brightness?

4) Vary your viewing habits. In this day and age of 16:9 DVD's, HD content and SD content this should not be difficult to be achieved.

5) Dial down the contrast and brightness, are you getting this part yet?

6) CRTs are susceptible to "burn-in" when in their infancy as the phosphors have not had a chance to age. A few hundred hours of watching varied material to age the phosphors is not unrealistic and will probably due a lot to curtail possible damage.

7) TURN DOWN THE CONTRAST AND BRIGHTNESS OF THE DISPLAY. Sorry, but I firmly believe that this is crucial to preventing burn-in damage.

8) When you are done playing a video game or watching a movie with the black bars?on the top and bottom, watch a program that fills the screen for the same amount of time you spent playing the video game or watching the movie. This will in a way help to wash?away the previous static image.[/b]

This may not work for everyone out there, but I haven't notice anyone suggest this yet.


Instead of the 'ugly gray bars' on my parents' Mit55311(?), I got them to use the PIP to display three PIP images off to the right when they watch 4:3 material (practically all day) The 4:3 material is not stretched or in any way visibly changed (as compared to a 'tiny' 21" sony CRT in the kitchen area nearby) and the 3 side PIPs are also 4:3 formatted (so they also show up 'correctly')


On the Mit, the three PIP images cycle every few seconds, so the image is kept 'in motion' pretty much the whole time. One forseeable potential problem is where the 3 PIP stops and the 4:3 image begins... there might be a slim black line splitting the two that could cause uneven usage.


Again, it may not work for you, because having the 3 PIPs is somewhat distracting, but my parents actually got used to it and enjoy spotting what else might be on at the same time.


One side benefit is that I feel like i'm getting full use of all the channels from my cable provider this way.



Of course, if this isn't a good way and is just a silly harebrained idea lacking any common sense, please let me know. (maybe that's why it hasn't been mentioned as a way of circumventing burn-in when viewing 4:3 material on a 16:9 tv...)
 

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Is burn-in an issue with videogames on newer CRTs? For instance, will the HUDs and health meters get burned in? What are the guidelines for playing video games on a CRT RPTV?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by Vikram R
Is burn-in an issue with videogames on newer CRTs? For instance, will the HUDs and health meters get burned in? What are the guidelines for playing video games on a CRT RPTV?

as long as phospher is involved, I believe so.


some RPs come with a 'Game Mode' which basically lowers the brightness and contrast (as far as I can tell)


generally, i try to limit it to a half-hour before switching to a different game if there's any static image on-screen...
 
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