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From LG support. Not sure what that means so if I manage to get mine repaired I will be curious to understand what that means. Ie. Is it simply something different in the panel itself which I won't tell or is there a change to the underlying software (I think the newer models use something other than the clear panel noise functionality in the B6). I have to assume it's the former and not the latter since that would basically imply putting an 8 or 9 Series into a B6 series shell sort of thing?
Interesting. Similar to what I was told by the LG service technician that recently replaced the panel in my C7. He said the new panel was better, and something in-between C8 and C9. Not sure exactly what that means. Also all electronics from the C7 was kept, except the electronics board for the panel.

Should it be possible to notice any improvements from the new panel, even though the electronics remains the same? E.g. increased peak/average brightness, better near black uniformity, motion handling, ...? Or would such improvements require new electronics from the C8/C9 too?
 

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Do I risk burn in with this kind of use ?

Hello,


Eyeing the 77CX, tho wondering if with this kind of usage i risk burn in :


During the week : a tv show at night for 2 hours~ or a movie, tho with how poor 2020 good movies are not so much. We generaly end a season or two of a show before moving on to something else. Mostly rips, sometimes the logo is there. I ll certainly start to buy the 4k blu rays once we have a new tv.


Week end : well it s tricky. Sometime we just watch 3 or 4 hours of content during the week end, sometime way more. We can watch a Survivor season in one go with the logo, or play mario kart / party with friends from 2pm to 6am next day.


So knowing that, are we a huge risk burn in couple ? Or should be ok ? I ll play some games too, but nothing multiplayer except local Mario kart / party, my internet is total **** anyway.


Cheers !
 

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Hello,


Eyeing the 77CX, tho wondering if with this kind of usage i risk burn in :


During the week : a tv show at night for 2 hours~ or a movie, tho with how poor 2020 good movies are not so much. We generaly end a season or two of a show before moving on to something else. Mostly rips, sometimes the logo is there. I ll certainly start to buy the 4k blu rays once we have a new tv.


Week end : well it s tricky. Sometime we just watch 3 or 4 hours of content during the week end, sometime way more. We can watch a Survivor season in one go with the logo, or play mario kart / party with friends from 2pm to 6am next day.


So knowing that, are we a huge risk burn in couple ? Or should be ok ? I ll play some games too, but nothing multiplayer except local Mario kart / party, my internet is total **** anyway.


Cheers !
Why would you buy an OLED if you game? Buy an LCD, and game your heart out by all means.
 

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I agree. It's not like LG says "if you watch a lot of shows with a static logo or boxes on it" or "if you plan on gaming", don't buy this set. Only buy this set if you're prepared to reduce OLED light in the 40's; watch varied programming, ideally movies/Netflix shows; don't watch sports for hours on end; etc.

Having said that, on my set (B6), while I've constantly had image retention, it has always gone away. Was only a few weeks ago where it was painfully evident the CNN logo was burnt in as was a box on the left side which is also a CNN trait. That was likely due to my wife watching CNN I'm guessing 5 or 6 hours a day if not more from mid March on-wards with OLED light at 86 (again, this I'm pretty sure was what a lot of the B6 calibration thread was recommending way back when).

Panel is being replaced shortly, will see how the new one fares, but I will calibrate it I guess to reduce OLED light to sub 60 (?) and increase contrast accordingly to get to a decent nit level. Haven't calibrated a set in a few years so will have to brush up again!
 

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I agree. It's not like LG says "if you watch a lot of shows with a static logo or boxes on it" or "if you plan on gaming", don't buy this set. Only buy this set if you're prepared to reduce OLED light in the 40's; watch varied programming, ideally movies/Netflix shows; don't watch sports for hours on end; etc.

Having said that, on my set (B6), while I've constantly had image retention, it has always gone away. Was only a few weeks ago where it was painfully evident the CNN logo was burnt in as was a box on the left side which is also a CNN trait. That was likely due to my wife watching CNN I'm guessing 5 or 6 hours a day if not more from mid March on-wards with OLED light at 86 (again, this I'm pretty sure was what a lot of the B6 calibration thread was recommending way back when).

Panel is being replaced shortly, will see how the new one fares, but I will calibrate it I guess to reduce OLED light to sub 60 (?) and increase contrast accordingly to get to a decent nit level. Haven't calibrated a set in a few years so will have to brush up again!
I don't recall a consensus on OLED light for calibration since it depends on factors like how much ambient light in your viewing room, viewing distance, and most importantly, personal preference. Maybe you're thinking of Contrast. Using AVS HD 709 calibration patterns, I found the proper Contrast setting to be 84 on our set. The default is 85 I believe in Expert Dark mode.


I'm not sure how the new replacement panel will fare, but FYI, we had our B6 on OLED light 60 when new and got burn-in from MSNBC after only about 6 months at roughly 4 hours per day. Here's some things you can try to avoid burn-in with news channels:


1. Turn OLED light down as much as you're comfortable with.
2. Turn Color down as much as you're comfortable with.
3. Use all-direction zoom, stretch diagonally to the max, and move picture until logos/banners are off screen. (Won't prevent burn-in from faces in center of screen over time.)
4. Turn the TV off at least every 4 hours to allow the short compensation cycle to run (no proof this helps, just theory).
5. Don't watch news channels.
 

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I don't recall a consensus on OLED light for calibration since it depends on factors like how much ambient light in your viewing room, viewing distance, and most importantly, personal preference. Maybe you're thinking of Contrast. Using AVS HD 709 calibration patterns, I found the proper Contrast setting to be 84 on our set. The default is 85 I believe in Expert Dark mode.


I'm not sure how the new replacement panel will fare, but FYI, we had our B6 on OLED light 60 when new and got burn-in from MSNBC after only about 6 months at roughly 4 hours per day. Here's some things you can try to avoid burn-in with news channels:


1. Turn OLED light down as much as you're comfortable with.
2. Turn Color down as much as you're comfortable with.
3. Use all-direction zoom, stretch diagonally to the max, and move picture until logos/banners are off screen. (Won't prevent burn-in from faces in center of screen over time.)
4. Turn the TV off at least every 4 hours to allow the short compensation cycle to run (no proof this helps, just theory).
5. Don't watch news channels.
This just seems like so much trouble to go too? Isn't it easier to just buy an LCD? I never watch news channels, or that's what I would've done.
 

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I don't recall a consensus on OLED light for calibration since it depends on factors like how much ambient light in your viewing room, viewing distance, and most importantly, personal preference. Maybe you're thinking of Contrast. Using AVS HD 709 calibration patterns, I found the proper Contrast setting to be 84 on our set. The default is 85 I believe in Expert Dark mode.


I'm not sure how the new replacement panel will fare, but FYI, we had our B6 on OLED light 60 when new and got burn-in from MSNBC after only about 6 months at roughly 4 hours per day. Here's some things you can try to avoid burn-in with news channels:


1. Turn OLED light down as much as you're comfortable with.
2. Turn Color down as much as you're comfortable with.
3. Use all-direction zoom, stretch diagonally to the max, and move picture until logos/banners are off screen. (Won't prevent burn-in from faces in center of screen over time.)
4. Turn the TV off at least every 4 hours to allow the short compensation cycle to run (no proof this helps, just theory).
5. Don't watch news channels.
180*4 = 720 hours to prominent burn-in, which makes sense at 60 OLED light considering 2016 panels burnt-in prominently at 500 hours or so at max brightness. 2017 panels took that 500 to 3,000+ hours. That's 6x improvement. 2018 had their red subpixel boosted further and then 2019 ones even more. So yeah, newer panels will last way, way longer than 6 months, even if you watch news for 4 hours everyday. You'll still get burn-in, but not in 6 months. 4-5 years, probable.
 

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180*4 = 720 hours to prominent burn-in, which makes sense at 60 OLED light considering 2016 panels burnt-in prominently at 500 hours or so at max brightness. 2017 panels took that 500 to 3,000+ hours. That's 6x improvement. 2018 had their red subpixel boosted further and then 2019 ones even more. So yeah, newer panels will last way, way longer than 6 months, even if you watch news for 4 hours everyday. You'll still get burn-in, but not in 6 months. 4-5 years, probable.
Have there been any reports of burn-in with the 2019 OLED models? It definitely seems like most of the issues have been with older models but that could also be due to them just having been in use longer.

I'm a new C9 owner and am a bit wary about potential burn-in. I had a Plasma previously and gamed a lot on it without issues so not sure if I would have much to worry about with my usage patterns. I did take steps to lower the OLED light for SDR content and vary the content I watch on my set so we'll see how things go :)
 

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Have there been any reports of burn-in with the 2019 OLED models? It definitely seems like most of the issues have been with older models but that could also be due to them just having been in use longer.

I'm a new C9 owner and am a bit wary about potential burn-in. I had a Plasma previously and gamed a lot on it without issues so not sure if I would have much to worry about with my usage patterns. I did take steps to lower the OLED light for SDR content and vary the content I watch on my set so we'll see how things go :)
Did you read what I just wrote? Even if someone watches news for 4 hours each day, burn-in on C9 won't happen for...let's see...3,000 on 2017...almost twice the size of red subpixel now so 2x 3,000 is 6,000...divided by 4...1500 days. That's over 4 years. You won't get reports of C9 for a long time. Only exceptional cases where people hit 7-8 hours of same static content will come up after a couple of years. That's the case with 2018 models currently. Hardly any reports. Moreover, correlation between the added size of red subpixel and the half-life might be quite a lot more than linear. So burn-in on C9 isn't going to be a common thing at all for most people...even if they watch ****NN and F#cxNews
 

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Did you read what I just wrote? Even if someone watches news for 4 hours each day, burn-in on C9 won't happen for...let's see...3,000 on 2017...almost twice the size of red subpixel now so 2x 3,000 is 6,000...divided by 4...1500 days. That's over 4 years. You won't get reports of C9 for a long time. Only exceptional cases where people hit 7-8 hours of same static content will come up after a couple of years. That's the case with 2018 models currently. Hardly any reports. Moreover, correlation between the added size of red subpixel and the half-life might be quite a lot more than linear. So burn-in on C9 isn't going to be a common thing at all for most people...even if they watch ****NN and F#cxNews
Thanks, that's reassuring! I would be interested to see the results if Rtings.com ever does another burn-in test with the 2019 or 2020 models.
 

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180*4 = 720 hours to prominent burn-in, which makes sense at 60 OLED light considering 2016 panels burnt-in prominently at 500 hours or so at max brightness. 2017 panels took that 500 to 3,000+ hours. That's 6x improvement. 2018 had their red subpixel boosted further and then 2019 ones even more. So yeah, newer panels will last way, way longer than 6 months, even if you watch news for 4 hours everyday. You'll still get burn-in, but not in 6 months. 4-5 years, probable.
Weekdays only. No, or very little news, on weekends. So 26 weeks x 5 days per week x 4 hours per day = 520 hours. Again, that's just an estimate. It's hard to nail down exactly when the burn in took hold vs when we noticed it or exactly how many hours of news were watched. I recall a couple of posters saying they got BI after only about 100 hours at max OLED light. Then were some who said they got it from a mute button or menu item and those aren't on screen for long at all.


Rtings tested a B6 and six C7s. Both tests at 20 hours per day on, 4 hours off. However, the B6 was turned off once per day while the C7s were turned off 4 times per day. So those short compensation cycles that the TVs run after they're turned off, more of those cycles would've run on the C7s. Could that be why the C7s saw such a huge improvement in burn-in resistance? In other words, if the C7s were run for 20 hours straight and turned off only once per day for 4 hours, would they have burned in much faster, say similar to the B6 test? Did LG actually add any new compensation technology in 2017 models that boost the output of pixels aging faster than the average so that they don't dim and show as burn-in, as some AVS members have claimed?
 

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Hello,


Eyeing the 77CX, tho wondering if with this kind of usage i risk burn in :


During the week : a tv show at night for 2 hours~ or a movie, tho with how poor 2020 good movies are not so much. We generaly end a season or two of a show before moving on to something else. Mostly rips, sometimes the logo is there. I ll certainly start to buy the 4k blu rays once we have a new tv.


Week end : well it s tricky. Sometime we just watch 3 or 4 hours of content during the week end, sometime way more. We can watch a Survivor season in one go with the logo, or play mario kart / party with friends from 2pm to 6am next day.


So knowing that, are we a huge risk burn in couple ? Or should be ok ? I ll play some games too, but nothing multiplayer except local Mario kart / party, my internet is total **** anyway.


Cheers !
Why would you buy an OLED if you game? Buy an LCD, and game your heart out by all means.
Because they are sold as gaming monitors too ? It s not like i play a lot, it just can happen.

Do i risk burn in watching a full season of survivor for example in a row with the logo ? Close to 12 hours I believe. Or if it s once every month or something like that it s ok ? CX tv.

Or playing 15 hours straight once every 2 week ?

If you shut the tv every 4 hours, how long do you need to have it turned off so the refresh cycle can happen and complete

Cheers

Cheers
 

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Weekdays only. No, or very little news, on weekends. So 26 weeks x 5 days per week x 4 hours per day = 520 hours. Again, that's just an estimate. It's hard to nail down exactly when the burn in took hold vs when we noticed it or exactly how many hours of news were watched. I recall a couple of posters saying they got BI after only about 100 hours at max OLED light. Then were some who said they got it from a mute button or menu item and those aren't on screen for long at all.


Rtings tested a B6 and six C7s. Both tests at 20 hours per day on, 4 hours off. However, the B6 was turned off once per day while the C7s were turned off 4 times per day. So those short compensation cycles that the TVs run after they're turned off, more of those cycles would've run on the C7s. Could that be why the C7s saw such a huge improvement in burn-in resistance? In other words, if the C7s were run for 20 hours straight and turned off only once per day for 4 hours, would they have burned in much faster, say similar to the B6 test? Did LG actually add any new compensation technology in 2017 models that boost the output of pixels aging faster than the average so that they don't dim and show as burn-in, as some AVS members have claimed?
We have had this discussion over in the technology thread. The compensation mechanism can do its job only when it has enough headroom, and while initially it was thought that newly licensed tech from IGNIS was behind the boost, but they only licensed pixel circuitry and not the algorithms from IGNIS. So the algos at work were LG's own. Pixel circuitry might have helped; can't be sure thought unless someone with the right info analyzes and the panel and tells us about it. The additional headroom in 2017 might be from change in the stack from 3 stack, 2 colors to 3 stack, 3 colors. Whatever the reason, there was a big leap in performance.

And then red subpixels were boosted in 2018 and 2019. How much they'll improve the performance? Hard to say without testing, because as I mentioned, half-life might have been boosted well beyond what the linear measure would suggest. To be on the conservative side though, 2x performance from 2017 panels can be safely estimated as the reb subpixel is now almost 2x the size of 2017 panels.
 

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We have had this discussion over in the technology thread. The compensation mechanism can do its job only when it has enough headroom, and while initially it was thought that newly licensed tech from IGNIS was behind the boost, but they only licensed pixel circuitry and not the algorithms from IGNIS. So the algos at work were LG's own. Pixel circuitry might have helped; can't be sure thought unless someone with the right info analyzes and the panel and tells us about it. The additional headroom in 2017 might be from change in the stack from 3 stack, 2 colors to 3 stack, 3 colors. Whatever the reason, there was a big leap in performance.

And then red subpixels were boosted in 2018 and 2019. How much they'll improve the performance? Hard to say without testing, because as I mentioned, half-life might have been boosted well beyond what the linear measure would suggest. To be on the conservative side though, 2x performance from 2017 panels can be safely estimated as the reb subpixel is now almost 2x the size of 2017 panels.
It sounds like you're saying that there was indeed new compensation algorithms introduced in the 2017 models with the additional headroom reserved for it to function. Do we know this for a fact? Who is the original source of this information? Did LG confirm this?


What exactly is "pixel circuitry" and what is its function? What are you basing your statement on that there was a big leap in performance with 2017 models? Are you basing this solely on the Rtings real life burn in test with six C7s?


Was the red subpixel size increased in 2018 and then increased again in 2019, or are you just grouping both years together? Not clear what you meant. Also, who is the original source of this information?


Sorry, if it sounds like I'm interrogating or challenging you personally. I'm not. It's just that I've read posts with these claims on AVS over the years, but I have no idea where the information originated from, if it's factually correct, or if anyone actually verified these claims. Wondering if you know where all these claims originated from and if LG themselves have confirmed any of them.
 

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How does one take a picture of the pixel structure? I'm curious to see what my B6 looks like now vs when I get my panel replaced next week.
 

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How does one take a picture of the pixel structure? I'm curious to see what my B6 looks like now vs when I get my panel replaced next week.
Good question. Hopefully, someone who knows will answer. Maybe post your question in another thread like the OLED technology thread or calibration thread. I don't know if a macro lens would be enough. Undoubtedly, you'd need serious magnification.
 

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It sounds like you're saying that there was indeed new compensation algorithms introduced in the 2017 models with the additional headroom reserved for it to function. Do we know this for a fact? Who is the original source of this information? Did LG confirm this?


What exactly is "pixel circuitry" and what is its function? What are you basing your statement on that there was a big leap in performance with 2017 models? Are you basing this solely on the Rtings real life burn in test with six C7s?


Was the red subpixel size increased in 2018 and then increased again in 2019, or are you just grouping both years together? Not clear what you meant. Also, who is the original source of this information?


Sorry, if it sounds like I'm interrogating or challenging you personally. I'm not. It's just that I've read posts with these claims on AVS over the years, but I have no idea where the information originated from, if it's factually correct, or if anyone actually verified these claims. Wondering if you know where all these claims originated from and if LG themselves have confirmed any of them.
You just need to head over to OLED Technology thread and read the last 2-3 pages to get many of your questions answered and the sources of the info. We went over all of this there. Red subpixel was increased in 2018 and then AGAIN in 2019. You can indeed take pictures of the pixels with a macro lens, or simply reverse the direction of a normal lens with manual focus, and that'll function as a macro lens too.
 
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