[Mulder331]

This is off of: http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_el...d_recorder.htm


First we made DVD possible. Then we made it portable. Now, we’ve made it recordable! Introducing our DMR-E10 DVD Recorder. It lets you record just about anything onto a DVD-RAM disc. Like TV programs and movies broadcast over the air, cable or satellite. Or home movies from your camcorder and recordings stored on VCR tapes.


Mike: Why does Panasonic make this DVD-RAM Drive that by their own admission will record "TV programs and movies broadcast over the air, cable or satellite" and then do what they did with the ShowBlocker?


My apologies if someone has mentioned this already.


Mark Condon

 

[DrStrange]

I don't see anything there that says it will copy from DVDs. In fact it seems to go out of it's way to be very specific in mentioning everything but DVDs (such as "movies broadcast over the air" rather than simply "movies"). So it could be crippled in just the same way the Showstopper is, and more than likely is.

 

[Skeptic]

I suspect this is just another example of Panasonic obfuscation of the designed-in crippling of their products.


The signal-phrase "broadcast over the air, cable or satellite" is code for "will not record any signal broadcast over the air, cable or satellite that appears to have MacroVision protection"


This device probably explains the Showblocker's crippling. Look for the same Marketing Manager to manage both products. This person probably marketed breakfast cereals before joining Panasonic USA. Unable to distinguish between a removable media digital recorder and a revolution in Television watching, he applied his minimal grasp of the technology to the detriment of his customers (actually, once you purchase, he doesn't care about you. You are no longer a "potential customer", so he has no responsibilities to you. Not his Department (nor anyone else's, apparently).


Just a theory.



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Skeptic

 

[Mulder331]

DrStrange:

I never mentioned that it would copy from DVD's. I was relating it to the problem the ShowBlocker has recording regular stations.


Mark

 

[Philosofy]

Hey Mike, here's some more fuel for your fire: I sold a Tivo to someone this weekend whose Showstopper prevented him from Recording a Bulls game. He was PISSED, especially when I told him about your lack of response until letters were written to the president of Panasonic. He can't return his Showstopper (past the return date), but he's sure sorry he bought it. Also, he does not have access to the internet, so he can't stop by this forum to rant.


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Phil

 

[riker]

I don't understand your confusion?! The Showstopper is SUPPOSED to allow you to record shows and movies to your unit (that don't have MV which is all of them right now). The fact that for some people it's too sensitive and falsely triggers the blocking is a BUG, but the design, intention, and statements have ALWAYS been that it will not allow you to record MV protected signals to the unit. The DVD recorder will have the EXACT same implementation, and will not let you copy DVDs or other signals with MV, but will allow non-MV signals just like the Showstopper is SUPPOSED to do. Once they fix that bug it will behave like that.


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-=- Glenn -=-

 

[Philosofy]

Quote:

Originally posted by riker: ... Once they fix that bug it will behave like that.

And when will this be? Mike has been screaming at the top of his lungs for quite some time, and is just now getting noticed by the powers that be.


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Phil

 

[Lee Thompson]

Quote:

Originally posted by Philosofy: And when will this be? Mike has been screaming at the top of his lungs for quite some time, and is just now getting noticed by the powers that be.

It will be whenever enough information can be given to ReplayLogan so the bug can be *properly* isolated and then fixed. This endless ranting and whining is useless.

 

[Mulder331]

Quote:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------Originally posted by riker:

The newly announced dvd unit is not less restrictive than the showstopper as the poster suggests.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ummmm read PANASONIC's OWN writing, again.


First we made DVD possible. Then we made it portable. Now, we’ve made it recordable! Introducing our DMR-E10 DVD Recorder. It lets you record just about anything onto a DVD-RAM disc. Like TV programs and movies broadcast over the air, cable or satellite. Or home movies from your camcorder and recordings stored on VCR tapes.


I don't know about you but that does not sound too restrictive. No where in there does it say anything about MV shows over the air, cable or satellite. Nor could I find anyhting saying it will not copy signals with MV on their web page.


Mark Condon

 

[RandyL712]

Mulder,


IMHO you're on a witchhunt. Anyone who knows what Macrovision is knows that any consumer video recording device will scramble a Macrovision signal.

 

[RandyL712]

Mike,


I'm talking about the DVD-R, not a DVR http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif I'll be more clear in the future. In any event, my point holds true: concerning a DVD-recorder, it is EXPECTED that the MV scramble the signal.

 

[Mulder331]

A withchunt? Geezzzzzz. I am the bad guy??? I bought a SS only to find out later that I might have just bought a $600 dollar door stop. What Panasonic is doing is wrong. A Replay is made for a specific purpose. The SS will not perform that function by Panasonic's own admission in the future. Then they advertise this DVD-RAM with no mention of MV anywhere. If I am on a witchhunt then Panasonic is on a moron hunt to see how many consumers they can cheat out of their money.


Mark Condon


[This message has been edited by Mulder331 (edited 11-08-2000).]

 

[riker]

I again dont understand your point. In BOTH cases Panasonic is using deceptive if not downright false advertising to dupe the consumer into buying the units thinking that they can copy anything they want. It's only afterward they find out that the SS blocks recording of anything with MV and that the DVD-R does also which is why they very carefully worded the release to specify only YOUR PRIVATE RECORDINGS as being copyable to DVD but leaving enough vagueness to dupe a novice buyer.


Again, they are very consistent in their actions and intentions so I can't see how or why you are saying they acted differently here than with the showstopper. Or am I missing your issue/question?


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-=- Glenn -=-

 

[riker]

Mike, you are missing the whole point. I am not saying that the Panasonic decision to change the MV implementation on their flavor of the Replay is a good thing, obviously it's stupid. I am also not saying a thing about the advertising or promises they made about it. I am replaying TO THIS THREAD ONLY which states that the new recordable DVD unit has LESS MV implementation than their Showstopper, which is totally untrue. The design decision for the showstopper is to prevent the recording of any MV protected signals to the unit, while allowing all unprotected tv and movie channels to be recorded (which is where the bug comes in). That is the EXACT same implementation they are stating for the DVD recording, where you can record tv and movies to it as long as they are not MV protected. You cannot copy MV encoded DVDs or MV encoded tv shows, just like you cannot on the showstopper. Their design, while illogical and bad for business, has been consistent at least. The newly announced dvd unit is not less restrictive than the showstopper as the poster suggests.


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-=- Glenn -=-