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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42041 /forum/post/18513133


Looks fantastic. My one complaint is that while I remember liking it, this movie wouldn't be my first choice to get such treatment while others get shafted

It's a good movie, but regardless, take what you can get!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon /forum/post/18513403


There is no grain on the DVD and HDTV versions. There is just a mess of artifacts that once were grain that the encoders couldn't cope with.
There is fine, far more natural looking grain on the BD versions (although there are artifacts in some of your shots as well). Judging from the screenshots, only a judicious amount of grain management was applied to aid the encoders, as it should be.

That's how i see it. The "grain" on the HDTV is something artificial, something that's the result of processing. The BD shows what i believe to be natural film grain



Either way, i think we all agree the BD looks great
 

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Discussion Starter #43

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason One /forum/post/18513429


The point is that the grain was not artificially removed after the fact, as with DNR. Rather, they went back to a source (the original negative) from earlier in the chain, where the grain had not yet been added.

Nice.


By the way why are we on the second page? This excellent PQ blu-ray can not, must not get another page thread. Some people might think AVS nitpickers ultra extreme magnificus totalus phallus is condemning another blu-ray transfer!
 

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Was gonna get this later but walmart had it for 20 even and I just couldn't resist
. This one is worth the money if you're a fan.
 

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Picked it up at BB today based on this thread. Here's hoping the same love/care gets shown to War of the Worlds and the Indiana Jones movies when they release them (well, here's hoping they show this kind of love for all their movies, but if we gotta pick...).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xylon /forum/post/18513109


The DVD and the HDTV versions are grainy as hell (not that I'm complaining). Whatever new DNR tools they used for the blu-ray works very, very well. In fact the final result looks much better than Lowry's method. The "Lowry look" we call it.


Laser Pacific is one company to watch. Does help when Stevie is actively invloved

Is that actually DNR though? My understanding is that the master used for the DVD and OTA HD comes from a print because of the grading process they used for the film whereas this brand new transfer comes straight from the negative. To me, it just looks like an infinitely finer grain structure.


In that shot with Cruise looking at the photo, I see a fine grain structure that makes what's on the DVD look like awful digital noise - unless that shot was DNRed and a fine grain pattern was added to it after the fact. The quote about the cinematographer going back to the film does talk about being able to manipulate the grain so that certainly could be the case. I mean, if DNR really is being used in that shot, consider me impressed. The detail is outstanding.


Edit: Ahh! Sorry, for some reason, I didn't notice that we had a second page! And it sounds like my suppositions were mostly correct, so cool for me.



Just to be extra clear, I am in no way complaining about the tremendous job they did with this movie. I can sum up my feelings with one word: Bravo!
 

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While the new transfer may be technically outstanding, I'm not sure I care for the revised color timing in some of the shots. The cold bluish-grey hues added much to the atmosphere of this movie for me.
 

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It's still very much there, especially in the urban setting shots. It tends to be more natural late in the movie when he's on the run and goes to his wife's house.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon /forum/post/18513403


There is no grain on the DVD and HDTV versions. There is just a mess of artifacts that once were grain that the encoders couldn't cope with.
There is fine, far more natural looking grain on the BD versions (although there are artifacts in some of your shots as well). Judging from the screenshots, only a judicious amount of grain management was applied to aid the encoders, as it should be.

this is what i was seeing too
 

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Yes the HDTV cap doesnt show grain, its showing noise, (Because of inproper mastering and encoding) The orginal film did of course show grain, but not that severe. How good the newly added grain better match the orginal release grainstructure, I cant tell. But it looks really nice. Do anybody knows if they did the same thing to Saving Private Ryan?
 

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I just got through watching this and it is one fantastic looking disc! Can't wait for SPR and the rest of Spielberg's best!
 

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Sweet. There's hope for a version of War of the Worlds that doesn't look like bootleg. I understand grain but the DVDs(HD broadcasts) of minority report and WotW are a bit much.
 

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The way i understand it, the size of the grain of a film corresponds directly to the smallest level of detail a particular film can resolve. The size of the grain is effectively the pixel resolution of film, to put it in digital terms. That means that what you see in the HDTV shots cannot possible be the grain, because the "grain" in those shots is bigger than the smallest detail you can see. What you see in the HDTV caps is a result of the encoded format not being able to resolve / encode the individual grain details in the source, and this detail being lumped together into larger uniform bits that the encode can handle. Much like a low quality JPEG file will start lumping similar adjacent stuff together into larger uniform bits.


Disclaimer: I'm not a pro. I've read about film grain to try to learn about it. This is how i understand things to be. Feel free to educate me
 

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You cant compare grain with pixels. Yes not every grain element vill be visible. But the grainstructure is visible.


Compare it to an aerial picture of a football stadium. You cant see individual persons, but you can see that there a variety of people at the stadium.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MovieSwede /forum/post/18516110


You cant compare grain with pixels

My understanding is that the film grain is the silver halide that get struck by photons, and which form the picture information. In that sense, they are conceptually like pixels. I know they are not the exact same as pixels. But grain is effectively the highest possible resolution of detail that the film can capture. It cannot capture detail that is smaller than the grain size. And so the flip side of that is that detail in a picture cannot be smaller than the grain. And so the stuff you see in the HDTV caps cannot be the actual grain, because the "grain" is bigger than the small detail you can see elsewhere in the cap.


That's how i understand it to work anyway
 
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