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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
There's a new function "Shell::AuthorizeUser" that implements a challenge/response password system -- and to come up with the proper response, you need an elgemal private key. I can't tell if this is used, but if so...*sigh*


You'd almost think they didn't want us poking and prodding.
 

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I allways said if there is a door, there must be a key :D
 

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Clearly the beginning of the end. Certainly no more hacking now. Can eyelids-wired-open be far behind? :confused:


It was fun while it lasted. The prom surgery could prove dangerous to $650 boxes. And since they can't be upgraded, and may only steam to another activated $650 fortress (if @ all), perhaps not such a bargain? Nothing left to do now 'cept detach from the mothership and/or make do with the AIW Radeon, wait for 721, perhaps a little something Moxi?


Return to TOB... to stenciling platitudes on Valenti's toenails, in gold leaf...


Return to pouring Ms. Rosen Whiskey Sour Triplets or Sun of Jamaica with single Beluga Egg chaser?

All the while drugged, strapped to the chair, with eyelids wired open... :(
 

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I'm going to give SonicBlue the benefit of the doubt here. The could have other intentions than preventing owners of the 4xxx's from playing around with the box (although that may be one of the side effects). Now that they are starting to push these things through retail channels, they will be selling these them to more and more people who aren't tech savy. Some of these people will probably connect the ReplayTV's to the net without a firewall. The authentication stuff could just be intended to help keep those boxes from being hacked from the outside.
 

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It is also possible that now that they are selling the service seperately, they do not want people hacking the box to get it free. They may also want to prevent people from increasing the space on their units without paying Sonic Blue their inflated prices for disk space.


/carmi
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by jtl
There's a new function "Shell::AuthorizeUser" that implements a challenge/response password system -- and to come up with the proper response, you need an elgemal private key. I can't tell if this is used, but if so...*sigh*


You'd almost think they didn't want us poking and prodding.
Since I can still see the contents of recorded shows using SwapDV, it would seem the key system is not yet in place, no? The error I get is when trying to transfer a selected file back -- a message to effect that it can't find the MPEG file.


However, the presence of the key is potentially ominous in that once they do the flash firmware upgrade to 4.3 for existing users, they could turn it on at that point and require key exchange rendering all present s/w such as ReplayPC or SwapDV obsolete until if/when the key system is cracked.

->Dave
 

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Could this prevent the ability to increase the drive size/quantity in the box?


Could it cause boxes that have already had drives upgraded or added to stop functioning?
 

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You guys are giving up awfully quick.


Don't forget that ReplayPatrick said that there were new feature(s) on the way.


This could be a part of a plan for on-demand pay-per-view programming.


=Dave=
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by KenL
All the while drugged, strapped to the chair, with eyelids wired open... :(
Oops... sorry forgot the wink.


The reason why SB won't become another four letter word is simply because it's not beholden to the big media companies. Those wishing to spend all their porridge funds with the big-bad-wolf can just get a TiVo?

Grandma... my what big eyes you have! Have they been wired open?
Quote:
Originally posted by jtl
I'd guess their real concerns are, roughly in order

1. people using RNS without paying for it

2. people using 4500s without paying for RNS

3. people modifying RNS client software in ways that causes server-side problems

So if you aren't doing one of those, there's little reason for concern.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Ack, I started a panic and certainly didn't mean to.


This function, used or not is for *access to the shell*.


You don't need that access for streaming. You don't need it for upgrading HDs (although it may have been necessary/useful in figuring out how to do that the first time). You don't *need* it for much of anything, although it's been nice and helpful.


There's no way[1] they can use a system like this to prevent us from getting streaming working -- since we have both sides of that conversation, we have both sides of the key.


OTOH, there *are* other things being done to prevent modification -- as I've been babbling about for a week, there's also a secure signature system being done on all the system files now, to prevent them from being modified.



[1] okay, if they require that both sides of the streaming connection be on the net, they could go talk to a SB server and get keyparts that way that we wouldn't have; but they don't require that, so they aren't doing that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
And the shell's "call" command, which used to let you call any function at all, now has a very short hardcoded list of functions, which doesn't include any of the interesting ones at all (except maybe the new ShmooVideo2).


Todd, who's starting to feel persecuted
 

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Persecuted by who? Just because Replay is making all these mods for you :)


So when you say "there *are* other things being done to prevent modification" Could you clarify that you mean modification of the software running as opposed to hard drive size changes?


aka Should I mod my box before I get the new software?
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yes, I mean they're making it difficult/impossible to modify the running software. I've still seen no evidence they're making it any more difficult to upgrade hd sizes.
 

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Making it difficult to modify the software that is run on the box makes it difficult to hack the box to work without signing up for the $250 lifetime (or whatever it is going to be monthly) fee. Obviously, they want/need that.


If they plan to keep the streaming between boxes feature, they can never stop people from pulling the mpeg files to a computer. Worst case is you run in promisc mode and sniff the packets between two machines streaming. They can't make the boxes stream over the internet for the two boxes in the same house sharing. They can't afford the bandwidth and most people don't have that kind of internet bandwith (for realtime streaming of this size video stream).


It's very unlikely they would use any kind of strong encryption on the stream, the boxes would not be able to handle the encrypt/decrypt without additional hardware added.


It's just a matter of time before swapdv or something similar is working on the new boxes (and old boxes patched). Maybe they will lose guide info, and you will have to hand enter show names for files. Not a huge loss.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Yeah, this whole tower of verification & authentication seems to be designed to keep the magic registry values from being modified (or at least, frmo still working after having been modified), and making sure the software still pays attention to them.


I understand the why, and it's pretty much necessary from their point of view, and it's pretty much what I expected, but I still don't have to *like* it.


This may be pretty much the end of the line for fun with the 4000s -- get streaming working again, then it may be time to find a new obsession.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by reltham



It's just a matter of time before swapdv or something similar is working on the new boxes (and old boxes patched). Maybe they will lose guide info, and you will have to hand enter show names for files. Not a huge loss.
I have a 4504 and can tell you definitely that SwapDV can still see guide info. It is just getting the appropriate handshake to get the files themselves dl off the 4504.


I will definitely be interested in hearing about the first experience with upsizing the hd in the 4500 series. It would be a shame it that can no longer occur.


->Dave
 

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Since the 4000s are going to get the same software as the 4500s then anyone that has a 4000 should upsize their drive before the lockdown. Is it reasonable to assume that upgrades done before the lockdown will stick?
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by GadgetGuy
Since the 4000s are going to get the same software as the 4500s then anyone that has a 4000 should upsize their drive before the lockdown. Is it reasonable to assume that upgrades done before the lockdown will stick?
That may make sense, but guys, keep in mind that our resident 4000/4500 software guru (jtl) said the following a few posts earlier:


"Yes, I mean they're making it difficult/impossible to modify the running software. I've still seen no evidence they're making it any more difficult to upgrade hd sizes."
 
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