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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 5.1 set-up. I am considering moving my front speakers and my left/right surrounds (4 speakers total) onto walls -- (I'm a little nervous about leaving them on stands with two very large dogs and two of the stands being very exposed to dogs/people/vacuum cleaners), not to mention the benefits of no exposed speaker wiring and more space in the room). However, I have several questions about doing this.


(Note that the speakers in question (all 4) are Paradigm Atoms).


1. Tweeter wants to charge a flat rate of $549.00 to do this -- that includes the speaker wire; running the speaker wire throught the walls, etc.


Is this a ridiculous amount of money for this? Other places charge an hourly rate of approximately $100.00 per hour, but will not give estimates on how many hours it will take.


2. The left/right surrounds will be on side-walls pointing towards each other, with a couch in between. However, because of a door, the left/right surrounds, when wall-mounted, would either have to go on the wall in a line with the laps of a listener on the couch (as opposed to their heads); or the speakers would have to be about two feet behind the back edge of the couch.


Which of those two options is the best location for the left/right rear surrounds -- in line with the lap of the listener or a couple of feet BEHIND the listener (actually a couple of feet behind the couch, so maybe 2 1/2 feet behind the listener's heads)?


Another possible third option (to line-up with the heads of the listeners on the couch) is ABOVE the door frame, but that will put the speakers at about the ceiling level. Would this be preferred over the other two options? I had read that these speakers should be about 6 feet off the ground (2 or 3 feet above a seated person's ears).


3. The right and left side-walls are not equal distances from the center of the couch in between. In other words, the left surround will be about 12 feet from the prime seating location, while the right surround will be about 6 feet from the prime seating location.


In that situation, what should the delay in the receiver be set to (note that my receiver only allows you to set delays for the left/right surrounds as one unit -- not individually). So should the delay be set for the 12 foot distance, the 6 foot distance, or the average (9 feet) or something else altogether?


4. In mounting the front speakers, should they be situtated so the middle of the speaker is at the level of the top of my TV (which is where my center speaker sits)? Or where should they be in relation to the top of my TV/center speaker? Note that it is a 55 inch RPTV. So the center speaker is slightly above my head as is (when I'm sitting down).


5. Does it matter (since I can make adjustments via delay and speaker calibration), that my center speaker will be about 3 feet closer to me than my fronts when the fronts are hung on the front wall (due to the depth of the RPTV)? Or is that a non-issue, as long as it is compensated for with the delay and speaker level/calibration settings?


Thanks for any help.


Eric
 

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Here are my quite take on your questions:


1. Can't answer this one...


2. The "text-book" placement of the L/R surrounds is either straight to the sides of the listening position or a bit behind it, and 2'-4' above the head. So, either the second or third options you listed should work fine. As always, the best way to decide between these options is to actually experiment. Have a couple of people (or a couple of ladders) to temporarily place the surrounds, and listen to your favorite soundtracks.


3. I would suggest you set them to 12 feet, because one thing you do not want is to have the sound from the surround speakers arrive at your ears before the front channel sounds. That will direct your attention more to the surround speaker (our brain is designed to do so), and compromise the ambiance effects. Obviously, this depends also on your distance from the front channels. Anyway, since the difference in the L/R surround distance is pretty large in your case, it might be time for you to consider upgrading your receiver to one of those that allows you to set the speaker distance individually (I believe that the majority of current models, mid-priced and above, will do).


4. Regardless of the height of the TV screen and the center channel, I would set the front L/R speakers so that their tweeters are approximately at the height of the listener's head. In fact, that should place them approximately to the height of the TV screen as well. But again, I would experiment before you start drilling the walls.


5. The text book says that the front 3 channels should be approximately equidistant from the listener. But I do not think your placement would pose a problem, provided that the levels/delays would be correctly set in the receiver.
 

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Hi Eric,


#1) Seems too high a price. I would only accept a fixed price for any work. Omnimount makes great wall brackets, and running wire is easy using these type of brackets because you can put a larger hole up where the speakers go...feed a snake down the wall to a smaller hole near the floor or behind the base board and pull the wire up through the wall and cover the hole with the bracket mounting plate on top and the base board or blank cover plate below.


#2) It is NEVER a good idea to mount a main speaker directly to a wall. Using a bracket to space the speaker several inches from the wall is a very good idea. The reason for this is the lower the frequency a speaker reproduces the more the sound "migrates" or flows on that surface. This simply means that the lower frequencies will "over excite" the room and cause a coloration of the sound. Remember, sound is moving air, and these lower frequencies will use your walls as a sort of wave guide. Also it is a good idea to keep the speakers 18" or more from any side walls. This migration of low frequencies will be lessened if the main speakers are part of a bi-ampped system or are part of a sub/satellite system with a high pass filter set. I hope this helps, I truely have designed and set-up countless audio systems and found common sense and locating speakers in space (as opposed to near surfaces) can make you sound far far better. Good luck and enjoy all a great system give.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by sushi
Here are my quite take on your questions:


2. The "text-book" placement of the L/R surrounds is either straight to the sides of the listening position or a bit behind it, and 2'-4' above the head. So, either the second or third options you listed should work fine. As always, the best way to decide between these options is to actually experiment. Have a couple of people (or a couple of ladders) to temporarily place the surrounds, and listen to your favorite soundtracks.

Thanks for the response.


If I go with the above the door frame option, the speaker will be about 8 feet above the ground -- is that too high?

Quote:
Originally posted by sushi



3. since the difference in the L/R surround distance is pretty large in your case, it might be time for you to consider upgrading your receiver to one of those that allows you to set the speaker distance individually (I believe that the majority of current models, mid-priced and above, will do).

I was surprised about this regarding the delay settings. I have an Onkyo TX-SR700 -- which is a pretty good mid-range receiver. Unfortunately the delay settings can not be different for left/right surrounds.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Quote:
Originally posted by Steve 77
Hi Eric,



#2) It is NEVER a good idea to mount a main speaker directly to a wall. Using a bracket to space the speaker several inches from the wall is a very good idea. The reason for this is the lower the frequency a speaker reproduces the more the sound "migrates" or flows on that surface. This simply means that the lower frequencies will "over excite" the room and cause a coloration of the sound.
This (see below link - and choose MB-60 after the page loads) is the mounting hardware that is recommended for Paradigm Atom speakers -- is this sufficient to space it far enough from the wall?

MB-60 Mounting Hardware
 

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caesar1,


The surrounds at 8' from the floor is not necessarily too high. Many people do similar placements, and get excellent results. Again, to make sure it works for you, do experiment.


The bracket looks to me like it will provide the Atoms sufficient clearance from the wall to prevent an overt coloration.


I, too, am surprised to hear that the Onkyo SR700 cannot set independent surround distances... :(
 

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Hi Eric,


The MB-60's look good and will work good (especially if you are using a sub with a high pass ouitput), but if I had a second choice that palced the speakers a minimum of 4" from the wall I would choose that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Any other opinions/thoughts out there?
 
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