My new theater

4280 Views 79 Replies 16 Participants Last post by TexmasterPEB, Dec 23, 2019

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · Oct 11, 2019

I am about to embark on the theater build in our new home. Fortunately, it has a dedicated theater room, but it needs everything else.

I am going to start by running some dedicated circuits to the amp rack area, and then wire runs from there to all of the speaker locations. 12ga to all but subs. Those get 10ga. Then paint, projector mount, screen (133”) and new carpet to finish it off.

It will be a 7.3.4 setup. Nothing insane or unique, but figured that I would start a thread and document the build over the coming weeks.

As a first pic, here is my new cabinet with some of the gear loaded. Along with the rest of the electronics, I will add a coolerguys triple 2u fan on the back side bottom, blowing in. Convection will take the heat out the top.

Anyway, I’m looking forward to the build and outcome. Any questions along the way, fire away.

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gibson61

· #2 · Oct 11, 2019

Congrats on the new Home. Be great if you could post some pics of the current room so all can then add comments or advice. Great Rack by the way. Looks like allot of power.

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #3 · Oct 11, 2019

2

Here are some images of the room as it is today.

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TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #4 · Oct 12, 2019

For my in-wall sides, would A or B be the better location? MLP is the 2nd row (on right in this picture)

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MississippiMan

· #5 · Oct 12, 2019

A.......e'bry day.

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #6 · Oct 12, 2019

MississippiMan said:
A.......e'bry day.

A is more or less what I had in our last house, but Dolby says it should be the B location for atmos, right?

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MississippiMan

· #7 · Oct 12, 2019

TexmasterPEB said:
A is more or less what I had in our last house, but Dolby says it should be the B location for atmos, right?

No...your going to have 2 rows of seats, and the location shown/ suggested is correct for Side Surround.

In any correct instance, the sides should be exactly that "Side" that are at each side of the primary Row. If you want Side Effects of the same ilk for the Rear row, you would have to go 9.2.4
Otherwise, the Rear Row must accept imagery as it comes from correctly positioned drivers.

Yes, you can change it up, but the gap difference between the Front Array and the Side Surrounds will create a more likely fade (hole) in the surround Sound staging...and you'd also have to reposition the Front Atmos to try to keep that content staging correctly.

In a 2 Row situation such as yours, if I was designing a 7.2.4 system, the Side Surrounds would be Dipoles.

Dolby's illustration is a generic Guidleline....not an absolute. It does not / cannot take any differing Room variables into account. It is a singular depiction. Even the give angles are not sacred...Speaker design and dispersion characteristics absolutely must come into play. So...you must make the compensatory adjustments based on room dimensions, speaker design and performance, and acoustic considerations (per seating locations)

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TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #8 · Oct 12, 2019

MississippiMan said:
TexmasterPEB said:

A is more or less what I had in our last house, but Dolby says it should be the B location for atmos, right?

Click to expand...

No...your going to have 2 rows of seats, and the location shown/ suggested is correct for Side Surround.

In any correct instance, the sides should be exactly that "Side" that are at each side of the primary Row. If you want Side Effects of the same ilk for the Rear row, you would have to go 9.2.4
Otherwise, the Rear Row must accept imagery as it comes from correctly positioned drivers.

Yes, you can change it up, but the gap difference between the Front Array and the Side Surrounds will create a more likely fade (hole) in the surround Sound staging...and you'd also have to reposition the Front Atmos to try to keep that content staging correctly.

In a 2 Row situation such as yours, if I was designing a 7.2.4 system, the Side Surrounds would be Dipoles.

Dolby's illustration is a generic Guidleline....not an absolute. It does not / cannot take any differing Room variables into account. It is a singular depiction. Even the give angles are not sacred...Speaker design and dispersion characteristics absolutely must come into play. So...you must make the compensatory adjustments based on room dimensions, speaker design and performance, and acoustic considerations (per seating locations)

Now I’m confused. The rear row is the primary listening position, so the sides should be next to each end of it, right?

I do have the option of going 9.2.4 and placing sides in both the A and B locations. Is that advantageous over just having them in one location?

MississippiMan

· #9 · Oct 12, 2019

TexmasterPEB said:
Now I’m confused. The rear row is the primary listening position, so the sides should be next to each end of it, right?

I wasn't aware that your plans involved centering your viewing and listening around a optimized 2nd row.
Still, it is the distance between the "Sides" and the Front R/L/C Array that will make sound sound imaging more difficult to stage correctly.

Front Atmos as well.

"Back in the Day"...when Surrounds actually did mean "Rears", most every Receiver had variable Delay adjustments that could be made because there could be a LOT of distance between the Front & Rear speakers. Most current equipment does provide Digital Delay based upon inputted distance from the Signal source/amps, (...really good Delay circuits are primarily limited to Pre-Amp models) but any such approach is still a "make do" one as opposed to correctly positioned and performing Speakers...and therein can be subject to a lot of variables in Content mixing and delivery.

I do have the option of going 9.2.4 and placing sides in both the A and B locations. Is that advantageous over just having them in one location?

In your sized room? ABSEWLOOTLEE! I cannot begin the even reason why it would not be done if possible...unless the budget was an over-ridding factor. For that matter....going with 9.2.6 would be fabulous, but that type 15 Channel Processor / Amp combo is somewhat costly.

Truthfully speaking, I would need to overview you room's dimensions and plot out an ideally suited positioning. The Shadow Boxing Pillars are somewhat limiting as far as placement...as pertains to the seating locations, but all in all I see a workable solution.

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BIGmouthinDC

· #10 · Oct 12, 2019 (Edited)

put the side surround speakers at A and C locations not A and B. Pony up for a processor capable of doing the necessary decoding.

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MississippiMan

· #11 · Oct 12, 2019

BIGmouthinDC said:
put the side surround speakers at A and C locations not A and B. Pony up for a processor capable for doing the necessary decoding.

Yeah.............. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

There is so much having been saved by having the room come to you as complete as it is, spending for the few things that will perfect it seems only prudent.

BIGmouthinDC

· #12 · Oct 12, 2019

the ones at C will be higher

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #13 · Oct 12, 2019

I dont see “C” noted anywhere in the image.... help! If it is the column next to the bar top behind the 2nd row, it will be too close to the rears. Those will be sitting on the bar top, polk fxiA6s, In bipole mode.
There is a random speaker there in the picture, but not the actual one that will be located there.

Regarding A and B locations both having side speakers, the only way I can do that is if they are both fed the same signal; I am running a marantz Av7705 for my pre amp, and would simply wire them in parallel from the appropriate amp, which can easily handle the 4ohm load. Buying the extra set of in-walls is no problem.

Thanks

BIGmouthinDC

· #14 · Oct 12, 2019

I wouldn't put the rears on the bar top they would go over the cabinets . Or remove the wall cabinets altogether. Your acoustics will improve assuming you mount some treatments in that room which are very much needed. Put the microwave on or under the counter.

A---B---C it is on that last column.

MississippiMan

· #15 · Oct 12, 2019

TexmasterPEB said:
I dont see “C” noted anywhere in the image.... help! If it is the column next to the bar top behind the 2nd row, it will be too close to the rears. Those will be sitting on the bar top, polk fxiA6s, In bipole mode.
There is a random speaker there in the picture, but not the actual one that will be located there.

Regarding A and B locations both having side speakers, the only way I can do that is if they are both fed the same signal; I am running a marantz Av7705 for my pre amp, and would simply wire them in parallel from the appropriate amp, which can easily handle the 4ohm load. Buying the extra set of in-walls is no problem.

Thanks

Yes....creating a wider Side Surround image by combining A & B in parallel is a viable solution, owing to your seating circumstances. Not a perfect solution, but better than using just one at either location.

SteveCallas

· #16 · Oct 12, 2019

I’m assuming a x.3.x system is actually a x.2.x system but you are using 3 subs, or do you have discrete processing for 3 separate EQ’d subs?

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #17 · Oct 12, 2019

If I put the rear on top of the cabinets I have two issues;
1) direct path to my ears will be blocked at least partially by the bar
2) i was told they would be too close to the ceiling speakers by other board members, such that I would lose sound location between rears and heights.

I could ditch the cabinets but then I amplify issue 1 above.

My processor has 2 discreet sub outs, but I run a miniDSP w 4 channel outs.

BIGmouthinDC

· #18 · Oct 12, 2019 (Edited)

How handy are you? there is no reason for 42 inch high bar top in your seating configuration If you cut it down to counter top height and get shorter stools that will help help with the audio. If your goal is to make your second row your MLP placing speakers on the bar top will be too close. You need to get them on the back wall. You might be able to cut the bar top down to desk height (30" inches) and use executive swivel chairs for bar seating. That would really open up the back sound stage.

TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #19 · Oct 12, 2019

BIGmouthinDC said:
How handy are you? there is no reason for 42 inch high bar top in your seating configuration If you cut it down to counter top height and get shorter stools that will help help with the audio. If your goal is to make your second row your MLP placing speakers on the bar top will be too close. You need to get them on the back wall. You might be able to cut the bar top down to desk height (30" inches) and use executive swivel chairs for bar seating. That would really open up the back sound stage.

I am extremely handy.

Funny you mention the bar; I was just telling the wife I could open up the face of it such that it is just supported by columns and the sound could pass through the open areas. Dropping it down is also an option, but a bit more work.

I could lose the bar all together, but then I have to do a bit of tile work. Probably the best option though.

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TexmasterPEB

Discussion Starter · #20 · Oct 13, 2019 (Edited)

Ok, so if I ditch the bar and some rear cabinets and move forward with three rows of seats (middle row would be primary position), should I have side speakers at A, B and C?

Would rear speaker placement be OK next to the door where there is currently no cabinet, and opposite that where the microwave is currently? This arrangement would be symmetrical and keep the cabinets above the sink and the 3 cabinets next to those (Momma would like to keep some storage).

Thx

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