[mike 01hawk]

Room Dimensions: 20x22
Screen: 118inch canvas painted light gray (Rolled 2 coats of Kilz and then rolled 1 coat of Behr Silverscreen (SS))
Projector: Epson 8350
Current Throw distance: 14ft 10inch
Finished Throw distance: Will be ~12ft
Ambient Light: 6 windows, but can be controlled a bit with blinds. Not at all "bat cave" dark.


Here are some pics to give you an idea of what I have currently. It was 4pm w/ an overcast sky so it wasn't full in your face bright in the room, but still pretty bright. There are 2 windows per wall:

Stock projector settings, nothing has been changed. Dynamic = Torch bright for ambient viewing. Cinema = Darkest setting, better color/flesh tones

Camera on tri-pod, Auto ISO, using 2 second timer to reduce blur

1920x1080 Desktop Background


Blinds open, Cinema mode

Blinds open, Dynamic mode

Blinds closed, Dynamic mode!!!

:sunny:

Avatar 720p rip


Blinds open, Cinema mode

Blinds open, Dynamic mode

Blinds closed, Cinema mode

Blinds closed, Dynamic mode

Full darkness outside, with 4 60w light bulbs on full blast in center of the room

Easily watchable, but I'd rather not have the lights on full blast.


Dynamic

Dynamic

Some up close shots of my screen as it is:


There is definitely orange peel / texture over the entire screen. If I look at the screen from an extreme viewing angle I can also see a few roller marks

This shows what the unpainted canvas looks like:

Why I'm wanting to go with a new paint formula:

While the silverscreen is definitely livable, I find myself having the 8350 in Dynamic or Living room "torch" mode a majority of the time. Also, the darker earthier colors like browns and greens seem really really muted. There isn't much 'pop'. Looking back at my desktop picture you might say "what the heck is Mike thinking". But if you look at the Avatar pics you'll see how things seem 'blah'ish. Also I want to be able to really enjoy the projector even with small amounts of ambient light.


I have already purchased the $50 Refurbished HVLP sprayer. Currently the RS-MaxxMudd formula is in the lead for me because it seems to be an idiot proof mixture.

My questions

What kind of screen prep will be needed? Give it a general once over with a foam sanding block?


Can I spray right over SS or will I need to have a white 'base'?


That's it for now. Follow along and I'll be posting more pics of my progress.


Any bets on how long before MM posts in here?

 

[MississippiMan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike 01hawk Any bets on how long before MM posts in here?

3 hrs.


But my Wife wants to go to dinner.


Your on the right track. You could use the existing surface, by wet sanding it to a slippery smooth state. The darker background behind the RS-MaxxMudd LL would enhance Blacks even more through attenuation. Might cost a teeny bit of PoP, yet still be crazy better than the SS alone.


The best choice is to use some Primer AFTER sanding, get a nice Flat white reflective base going for your, and then spray RS-MaxxMudd "Standard" for the proven Sizzle as well as significant contrast enhancement.

 

[mike 01hawk]

Yikes, that was an expensive trip to HD and Michael's!!!

What you see pictured cost ~$60 + another ~$60 for what you don't see, the "no name" HLVP: http://www.gleempaint.com/noname.html . Then if you add in the cost of the stretcher bars (~$160 IIRC), cotton canvas (~$10), and staple gun (~$20) used on it, you're looking at over $310+ for a screen

I hope someone in the Tulsa County area wants to "rent" my HVLP and buy the unused MaxxMudd once I'm finished!!!

Questions

Is the 100 grit sanding sponge the right grit?


Since I'm using the "no name" HLVP, how much of the 12oz distilled water should I use?


I'm assuming I can get measuring syringes at places like Walgreens? I'll google that now.

 

[MississippiMan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mike 01hawk /forum/post/19566066


Yikes, that was an expensive trip to HD and Michael's!!!


What you see pictured cost ~$60 + another ~$60 for what you don't see, the "no name" HLVP: http://www.gleempaint.com/noname.html . Then if you add in the cost of the stretcher bars (~$160 IIRC), cotton canvas (~$10), and staple gun (~$20) used on it, you're looking at over $310+ for a screen

I hope someone in the Tulsa County area wants to "rent" my HVLP and buy the unused MaxxMudd once I'm finished!!!

Questions

Is the 100 grit sanding sponge the right grit?


Since I'm using the "no name" HLVP, how much of the 12oz distilled water should I use?


I'm assuming I can get measuring syringes at places like Walgreens? I'll google that now.

You should not need to use Syringes when mixing RS-MaxxMudd


That darn 'ol Frame is a big expense.


The Sponge is a "Medium Grit" and will work fine if a light touch is used. Aggressive sanding under firm pressure will introduce scratches though.


There might be a "Used" market on this DIY Forum for the "No Name" sprayer for those who purchase them for what amounts to a one time use. All others....quit'cher Beeatchin'....if you use it for even 1-2 other projects that can benefit from a professional looking finish, it's paid for 2-3x over the $49.95 cost.

 

[mike 01hawk]

How am I going to measure out 16oz from a 32oz container (the poly). Or 7oz from an 32oz container? Just borrow the Mrs's glass measuring cup?

What about the water mixture? Any thoughts on that?


Also, while I'm not reeeeeally griping about the costs involved, all the little costs DO add up. Something a DIY'er needs to consider if they go down this path.

 

[MississippiMan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mike 01hawk /forum/post/19567649


How am I going to measure out 16oz from a 32oz container (the poly). Or 7oz from an 32oz container? Just borrow the Mrs's glass measuring cup?

What about the water mixture? Any thoughts on that?

Zat's what I do. It's all Water Based and rinses out easily enough...considering. Besides, those would be some mighty big Syringes!

Have some Paper towels handy to wipe the lips of the Cans after you pour, and when pouring the Thicker UPW, pour out at least an extra ounce to allow for the paint that will stick to the side of the Measuring cup.


BTW, be sure to stir the Poly up really well before you pour it out (do NOT shake) because it settles /separates in the Can it comes in.

Quote:
Also, while I'm not reeeeeally griping about the costs involved, all the little costs DO add up. Something a DIY'er needs to consider if they go down this path.

No more so than spending even more for a Mfg Screen and getting even less value for the money spent. Then there is the personal satisfaction of being able to hook Thumbs behind Suspenders and crow a bit about how "I did it myself, thankyouverrrrymuch !!!"

 

[expertmech]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike 01hawk Yikes, that was an expensive trip to HD and Michael's!!! What you see pictured cost ~$60 + another ~$60 for what you don't see, the "no name" HLVP: http://www.gleempaint.com/noname.html . Then if you add in the cost of the stretcher bars (~$160 IIRC), cotton canvas (~$10), and staple gun (~$20) used on it, you're looking at over $310+ for a screen I hope someone in the Tulsa County area wants to "rent" my HVLP and buy the unused MaxxMudd once I'm finished!!! Questions Is the 100 grit sanding sponge the right grit? Since I'm using the "no name" HLVP, how much of the 12oz distilled water should I use? I'm assuming I can get measuring syringes at places like Walgreens? I'll google that now.

Mike - I'm about to go on a "Shopping Spree"


Can I ask.. Is THIS what we see in this picture:



RS-MaxxMudd (for moderate ambient light)

16 oz. Delta Pearl Metallic #02601

12 oz. Delta Silver Metallic #02603

4 oz. Folk Art Champagne Metallic Gold #675

7 oz. UPW flat

16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic - Satin finish

12 oz. distilled/tap water**





*Edit to add - Looks like it is, It just took some eye strain to read the sizes contents on those smaller bottles



CAN YOU VIDEO TAPE YOURSELF WORKING THE SPRAY GUN WITH SOME BACKROUND MUSIC..... LOL!!!!!


GOOD LUCK!!!!!

 

[MississippiMan]

That's what you see, all right.

 

[beastaudio]

your post inspires me, just sayin... the SS looks great and I cant wait to see some before and afters!! I am poised to journey down this road although I may be getting a bit ahead of myself, Still have to run wire, drop in new black ceiling tiles, paint normal walls etc but Im really just wanting to do the screen and have it ready!!! Should you paint walls after the screen? I might like that idea better

A wagner sprayer can assist in this process too!!

 

[mike 01hawk]

The sprayer arrived!

However I'm going out of town this weekend, so it won't be until the 11th that I'll be able to focus on my screen.


I do plan on painting the walls in that room a nice dark/deep hunter green

 

[beastaudio]

What size screen are you running by the way?

 

[beastaudio]

Oops, just kidding saw that it is 118" Sorry

That is a great size, I was looking at 120" and then considered dropping to 100". Guess i can compromise at 110!!!!

 

[mike 01hawk]

Quick update:


Projector is mounted at it's final spot. 12 feet on the dot away from the screen so it's in it's "premo" location for throw distance vs screen size.


I thought I'd get a LOT more brightness being closer. So much so that I could live in Cinema mode 24/7. That's not the case

I'm still finding myself switching to Living Room even in total darkness

Needless to say I can't WAIT for this weekend to get here so I can spray some RS-Maxxmudd!!!

 

[aharami]

waiting for your findings before I go and buy a HVLP. Anyone know how the 'noname' brand HVLP compares to the Wagner Control Spray HVLP? This will be my first DIY screen (first projector, to be completely honest) and at first I was just thinking of going with a rolled on mixture, but if a HVLP system will give me the best results, I'll go with that. I read thru the entire sticky thread at the top of this forum, but that just talks about simple paint mixtures. What other mixtures are out there besides the Maxxmudd?


Mike I have a similar projector to yours - Epson 8700. I just got it and tested it out. This is what it looks like on a primed wall

Basement's not done yet, so walls will be painted darker

 

[MississippiMan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by aharami /forum/post/19612532


waiting for your findings before I go and buy a HVLP. Anyone know how the 'noname' brand HVLP compares to the Wagner Control Spray HVLP? This will be my first DIY screen (first projector, to be completely honest) and at first I was just thinking of going with a rolled on mixture, but if a HVLP system will give me the best results, I'll go with that.

I've been suggesting the "No Name" unit to everybody while they are available because it's really a good unit, normally priced at over $100.00, and it has inter-changeableSized Tips. The older Wagner Control Spray has less output and so requires that the paint be as thin as possible. Also the older Wagner is a "All in one" Electric HVLP, and it's filters are right there....in the vicinity of the spray dust. It also develops heat that requires it be disassembled immediately after paining lest the retained heat bake the paint inside the Nozzle to a point that cleaning it out becomes much harder than simply rinsing.


The newer Wagner Control Spray "Plus" is a very good unit....but if given a choice between $88.00 and $49.00, there is not enough difference between the two units (no name) to warrant the more expensive choice. Only if you plan on using the sprayer chosen for many other projects that involve large areas would the Wagner CSP be the preferred choice. But be also advised that the Wagner CSP only comes with one size Tip, and it puts out paint at a considerable rate. This means finding the right viscosity for the output so as to not "dump" paint onto the smooth surfaces we like using for Screen substrates.


And yeah....spraying is ALWAYS the preferred route to take...with a Basic or Advanced paint. Perfection (...or nearly so...) in a Screen surface's texture and composition is always going to render the absolute best results.

Quote:
I read thru the entire sticky thread at the top of this forum, but that just talks about simple paint mixtures. What other mixtures are out there besides the Maxxmudd?

Lots of 'em. Beyond the "Basics" into "Advanced", the primary differences involve using Metallic content within paint to improve gain, contrast, and the rendering of detail.


RS-MMud's higher performance "Cuzin" is Silver Fire....pretty much essentially the same thing excepting that it uses a RGBY derived colorant (ultra dark Gray) that allows the shade of Gray to be virtually infinitely adjusted to whatever sade needed to combat the effects of ambient Light.


RS-MaxxMudds are a bit more "mix-friendly" and the "Standard" and "Retro" versions still possess a decent degree of ambient light rejection despite being fairly light shades of silvery gray. They two enhance perceived contrast, and they have gains of 1.2+


Mike I have a similar projector to yours - Epson 8700. I just got it and tested it out. This is what it looks like on a primed wall

Quote:
Basement's not done yet, so walls will be painted darker

Ceiling should be darker than the walls. It doesn't have to be "Black", however the closer the top of the Screen is to the Ceiling, the darker that Ceiling should be.


These times are exciting times when one is considering the future state of a project. Making judicious choices and getting started helps make for a more relaxed "do". It's all to easy to become confused and "stuck in the quagmire" of too many choices and too many conflicting remarks.


Best to go with the proven results you see posted by "Happy Campers" as there is seldom seen anyone fibbin' about how good a job they did/were able to do, or how well it performs. I believe in all my suggestions, but they are not the only ones out there by any means.


They just seem like it sometimes because I can't sleep much between 2-5 am.

 

[aharami]

MM, thanks for the detailed reply. Sorry, I don't know anything about HVLP sprayers. What are the main differences between the nonname HVLP/Wagner Control Spray HVLP vs. an automotive HVLP system like this one ? I'm assuming the automotive one would require an air compressor whereas the noname/wagner comes with one? But I already have a 3lb air compressor. I'm wondering which will give me better results.


I'm building my own DIY speakers too and I want to paint them piano back. Can I use the noname HVLP for that? or will the automotive HVLP sprayer be better suited for painting something piano black?


And if I get the HVLP, I'll probably use that to paint my whole basement, making my job much easier. Should the screen be painted last?

 

[aharami]

nevermind about the noname HVLP vs automotive HVLP question. I googled it and found this link which explains everything. I think I'll get the turbine HVLP from gleempaint

 

[MississippiMan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by aharami /forum/post/19619962


nevermind about the noname HVLP vs automotive HVLP question. I googled it and found this link which explains everything. I think I'll get the turbine HVLP from gleempaint

Good man. Air Pressure Hose fed HVLPs demand extra equipment such a Rust / Water Filters, and need the specific Tips for the best results with a given paint. And at even the highest pressures they will not apply paint as quickly.


I have a $800.00 HVLP Rig w/32 Gallon Tank. It's not been used in almost 3 years since I became a "Wagner-ite"


Well OK...I have used the Tank to pump up my Car/Lawnmower tires.

 

[mike 01hawk]

Quick update. -Still in progress.


Behr Silverscreen

After 2ish coats of Kilz2 (yeah, I can't tell much difference either)

I LOVE HVLP!!!


OMG!!! Why didn't I do this ages ago. It is SOOOO SIMPLE. Well let me re-state. It's a bit of a PITA getting the paint to the right viscosity, and then having to filter it while you dump it into the bowl. But it took me like a grand total of 30 seconds to put on the first Kilz2 primer coat. I was actually ticked off I was finished! I WANTED MORE STUFF TO PAINT!!! LOL


Anyway back to the beginning of today:


Got the screen setup in the garage. With the help of 2 small space heaters it's still somewhat warm in the garage even though it's ranging from 50-30 Fahrenheit outside. I sanded all the high peeks and a couple roller marks w/ 3M 320grit sand foam. It really made a difference. Instead of being sandpaper rough, the surface is now smooth, but there is still a slight eggshell, it's still not smooth as glass.


I then threw own 2.5 coats of Kilz2. I say 2.5 cause I ran out of paint on the 3rd application of Kilz2

Also in my haste to check out how well I did on painting I got the HVLP too close to the wet paint and the constant air blowing out of the tip caused some runs

Oh well, nothing some sanding won't fix.


I mixed up the RS-maxxmudd but good lord. I probably added 30oz of water to get it to the right viscosity for my sprayer. I guess that's no big deal.


Here's a question though. I have 2ish coats of Kilz2 on the screen but I also have enough Behr UPW left over to do 2 coats of UPW. Would I get any benefit from spraying UPW (versus the Kilz2) before I go RS-Maxxmudd?


BTW This is the pattern / wait time I plan on following which came from a modified version of: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post19493373


1. Spray one coat of primer

2. Wait 1 hour

3. Spray another coat of primer

4. Wait 1 hour

5. Spray another coat of primer (but run out half way thru

)

6. Wait overnight

7. Sand lightly with fine sand sponge (3M 320 grit)

8. ??? UPW Coat 1 and 2

9. Duster coat 1 of RSMM

10. Wait 45 min

11. Duster coat 2 of RSMM

12. Wait 45 min

13. Coat 1

14. Wait 1.5 hours

15. Coat 2

16. Wait 2 hours

17. Coat 3

18. Wait overnight

19. Coat 4 if necessary

 

[MississippiMan]

All that sounds good, but I'd strongly advise you increase the width of your masking plastic by at least 2x that of what I see. Once you get into the Silver-ed paint you'll see the over spray.


There is not that much compared to other sprayers, but it's there, and it will stick to close-in surfaces.