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Narrow Room Hardwired Surround Setup

1344 Views 16 Replies 6 Participants Last post by  Pasteycakes, 
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I’m seeking some advice from the community on how to best utilize my equipment in a unique space in my new home. In the attached photos you’ll see that my TV is mounted above the fireplace. I know this setup is considered a faux pas but trust that I explored all options and it truly is the only and best place to place the television in this room given the narrow dimensions. I installed a “Mantelmount” for the TV so it pulls down from the mantel to a comfortable viewing height and angles the TV towards the couch for relatively straight-on viewing; this can be seen in the view facing away from the window. Another unique architectural feature is that this room is lofted in the middle with 25’ or so ceilings.

This home was hardwired with a 5.0 Bose Acoustimass surround sound system that I surmise is original to the ~20 year old home. In my research I have gathered that the community is not fond of this brand or product. I must stress that the Bose was not my choice and it was here before I was. I have this running through a Onkyo NR626 receiver to which I’ve connected to my TV via ARC. The Bose system runs all 5 channels through this “module” which is a passive sub type device that serves as a crossover for the lows and sends the highs to the “cube” speakers. I’ve added a Polk sub for some lows. I actually don’t have a problem with how this unit sounds for music but the setup is not great for HT.
Given the dimensions of where the speakers are mounted it makes for an awkward setup. I have the Front Left and Front Right channels going to the cube speakers by the dining room which are some 12+’ away from the viewing area, 5’ behind the TV, and mounted 8’ high. The surrounds are also mounted 8’ high on either side of the couch; not ideal per Dolby recommendations but it’s not bad. The center channel cube is not mounted and is now just sitting on the mantel. I manually “aim” it towards the couch when watching movies and into the room for music. Audio wise, the center channel seems to be the worst part of the Bose system. During films dialogue is muddy and I find myself turning up the volume to hear it and then turning it down during action.

I know “soundbar” is another dirty word in this community but I think for my purposes adding a high quality passive 3 channel LCR soundbar to the setup may work well for my purposes. For example this Klipsch RP-440D-SB or this KEF HTF7003 Sound Bar or slightly larger HTF8003. This would attach below my TV on the Mantelmount and thus would face directly towards me on the couch when watching movies and directly out to the room for music when the TV is up. These soundbars retail for $600 and that’s about all I’d want to spend on this component. My NR626 does not support Atmos, unfortunately, but it does support Dolby Pro-Logic IIz Height for a 7.1 setup. My thought was to move the current Front Right and Front Left Bose cubes to be used at Front Height speakers. These would still be routed through the Bose “module” as I’ve read the cubes cannot be connected directly to the receiver. I’d use the same rear surrounds from the Bose as I have today, and I'd disconnect the Bose center cube speaker entirely.

Thoughts on this proposed setup? I know it’s not recommended to mix speaker sets and this Bose system gets a lot of flack but in this case I’d only be using the Bose for front height and surround speakers and I’d be using much higher quality drivers for the more important LCR channels.

Might it be more advantageous to upgrade to a stand alone center such as this Polk S35? My concern in doing that is that my front channels will be so far away. Even if I upgrade the Bose speakers eventually they'll be in the same location as that's where they're hardwired.

Thanks!
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kblackburn101
Pasteycakes said:
I’m seeking some advice from the community on how to best utilize my equipment in a unique space in my new home. In the attached photos you’ll see that my TV is mounted above the fireplace. I know this setup is considered a faux pas but trust that I explored all options and it truly is the only and best place to place the television in this room given the narrow dimensions. I installed a “Mantelmount” for the TV so it pulls down from the mantel to a comfortable viewing height and angles the TV towards the couch for relatively straight-on viewing; this can be seen in the view facing away from the window. Another unique architectural feature is that this room is lofted in the middle with 25’ or so ceilings.

This home was hardwired with a 5.0 Bose Acoustimass surround sound system that I surmise is original to the ~20 year old home. In my research I have gathered that the community is not fond of this brand or product. I must stress that the Bose was not my choice and it was here before I was. I have this running through a Onkyo NR626 receiver to which I’ve connected to my TV via ARC. The Bose system runs all 5 channels through this “module” which is a passive sub type device that serves as a crossover for the lows and sends the highs to the “cube” speakers. I’ve added a Polk sub for some lows. I actually don’t have a problem with how this unit sounds for music but the setup is not great for HT.
Given the dimensions of where the speakers are mounted it makes for an awkward setup. I have the Front Left and Front Right channels going to the cube speakers by the dining room which are some 12+’ away from the viewing area, 5’ behind the TV, and mounted 8’ high. The surrounds are also mounted 8’ high on either side of the couch; not ideal per Dolby recommendations but it’s not bad. The center channel cube is not mounted and is now just sitting on the mantel. I manually “aim” it towards the couch when watching movies and into the room for music. Audio wise, the center channel seems to be the worst part of the Bose system. During films dialogue is muddy and I find myself turning up the volume to hear it and then turning it down during action.

I know “soundbar” is another dirty word in this community but I think for my purposes adding a high quality passive 3 channel LCR soundbar to the setup may work well for my purposes. For example this Klipsch RP-440D-SB or this KEF HTF7003 Sound Bar or slightly larger HTF8003. This would attach below my TV on the Mantelmount and thus would face directly towards me on the couch when watching movies and directly out to the room for music when the TV is up. These soundbars retail for $600 and that’s about all I’d want to spend on this component. My NR626 does not support Atmos, unfortunately, but it does support Dolby Pro-Logic IIz Height for a 7.1 setup. My thought was to move the current Front Right and Front Left Bose cubes to be used at Front Height speakers. These would still be routed through the Bose “module” as I’ve read the cubes cannot be connected directly to the receiver. I’d use the same rear surrounds from the Bose as I have today, and I'd disconnect the Bose center cube speaker entirely.

Thoughts on this proposed setup? I know it’s not recommended to mix speaker sets and this Bose system gets a lot of flack but in this case I’d only be using the Bose for front height and surround speakers and I’d be using much higher quality drivers for the more important LCR channels.

Might it be more advantageous to upgrade to a stand alone center such as this Polk S35? My concern in doing that is that my front channels will be so far away. Even if I upgrade the Bose speakers eventually they'll be in the same location as that's where they're hardwired.

Thanks!
View attachment 3135084
View attachment 3135085
Click to expand...
Do you use the fireplace? You can probably fit 3 identical towers under it or evenly around the room if you use it , as far as surrounds place them somewhere your more comfortable with . S35 is too tiny I wouldn’t bother a passive soundbar is better .
Get a front view of the TV, I’m shocked a massive room like that has Bose speakers but there so popular due to tiny size in non audiophiles I’m not surprised...
go for largest speakers you can fit .... going to need some serious subs too . Polk which model? Could be a temporary fix
I’ve used towers as surrounds to successfully, on bookshelve speakers stands . But bookshelves may be fine ...
Small speakers are terrible for that room ... go big or go home 🏡..
I’ve seen smaller movie theaters 🎭 ...then that room.
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RayGuy
Looks like there is already a soundbar just under the TV???

If it's just an optical illusion, add the Phase Tech Teatro 3 channel passive soundbar to the mix of options. Quality sound, well reviewed, will cost a bit more for a better option, Like Totem or Triad.

Be sure to read the music portion of the article ...

Phase Technology Teatro TSB3.0 Soundbar Review
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Zorba922
Ok, so there is a massive amount of info and two helpful photos, but there's also some very ESSENTIAL info that's missing.

1. How important is COSMETICS? Are you under severe WAF pressure to stick with relatively compact white speakers? I take it your have small kids so bookshelf speakers on stands are out of the question, but would some high quality yet shockingly affordable tower speakers work?

2. What % of your usage will be TV/HT and what % will be music?

3. What is the total budget maximum that you are willing/able to spend on upgrading this setup?

Yes, the Polk S35 would certainly be an improvement over the abysmal Bose "center channel" in the same way that your current Polk sub is a big improvement over the equally abysmal Bose "bass module"---mainly because Bose is such a ludicrously low bar. Especially given the huge space.

However, you'd be very surprised how much much bigger of an improvement you could get with just a little bit more money these days---and no, I'm not suggesting some silly "audiophile" setup costing thousands and thousands of dollars. But even as little as $1K could get you a very pleasing system of real speakers and a real subwoofer ... IF you know where to look and what to get, by which I mean not the junk sold at Best Buy. Hell, even that $600 you mentioned for an active LCR soundbar could go a lot further than you ever imagined.

I'll wait for your answers to the first 3 questions, before offering more ideas.


Pasteycakes said:
I’m seeking some advice from the community on how to best utilize my equipment in a unique space in my new home. In the attached photos you’ll see that my TV is mounted above the fireplace. I know this setup is considered a faux pas but trust that I explored all options and it truly is the only and best place to place the television in this room given the narrow dimensions. I installed a “Mantelmount” for the TV so it pulls down from the mantel to a comfortable viewing height and angles the TV towards the couch for relatively straight-on viewing; this can be seen in the view facing away from the window. Another unique architectural feature is that this room is lofted in the middle with 25’ or so ceilings.

This home was hardwired with a 5.0 Bose Acoustimass surround sound system that I surmise is original to the ~20 year old home. In my research I have gathered that the community is not fond of this brand or product. I must stress that the Bose was not my choice and it was here before I was. I have this running through a Onkyo NR626 receiver to which I’ve connected to my TV via ARC. The Bose system runs all 5 channels through this “module” which is a passive sub type device that serves as a crossover for the lows and sends the highs to the “cube” speakers. I’ve added a Polk sub for some lows. I actually don’t have a problem with how this unit sounds for music but the setup is not great for HT.
Given the dimensions of where the speakers are mounted it makes for an awkward setup. I have the Front Left and Front Right channels going to the cube speakers by the dining room which are some 12+’ away from the viewing area, 5’ behind the TV, and mounted 8’ high. The surrounds are also mounted 8’ high on either side of the couch; not ideal per Dolby recommendations but it’s not bad. The center channel cube is not mounted and is now just sitting on the mantel. I manually “aim” it towards the couch when watching movies and into the room for music. Audio wise, the center channel seems to be the worst part of the Bose system. During films dialogue is muddy and I find myself turning up the volume to hear it and then turning it down during action.

I know “soundbar” is another dirty word in this community but I think for my purposes adding a high quality passive 3 channel LCR soundbar to the setup may work well for my purposes. For example this Klipsch RP-440D-SB or this KEF HTF7003 Sound Bar or slightly larger HTF8003. This would attach below my TV on the Mantelmount and thus would face directly towards me on the couch when watching movies and directly out to the room for music when the TV is up. These soundbars retail for $600 and that’s about all I’d want to spend on this component. My NR626 does not support Atmos, unfortunately, but it does support Dolby Pro-Logic IIz Height for a 7.1 setup. My thought was to move the current Front Right and Front Left Bose cubes to be used at Front Height speakers. These would still be routed through the Bose “module” as I’ve read the cubes cannot be connected directly to the receiver. I’d use the same rear surrounds from the Bose as I have today, and I'd disconnect the Bose center cube speaker entirely.

Thoughts on this proposed setup? I know it’s not recommended to mix speaker sets and this Bose system gets a lot of flack but in this case I’d only be using the Bose for front height and surround speakers and I’d be using much higher quality drivers for the more important LCR channels.

Might it be more advantageous to upgrade to a stand alone center such as this Polk S35? My concern in doing that is that my front channels will be so far away. Even if I upgrade the Bose speakers eventually they'll be in the same location as that's where they're hardwired.
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I think you have the right idea for a passive LCR soundbar. Another place to look is HTD (Home Theatre Direct).
The SB3 is a good option when paired with a capable sub: Versa SB3
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squared80
Drop down screen over the windows. Go from there.
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kblackburn101 said:
Do you use the fireplace? You can probably fit 3 identical towers under it or evenly around the room if you use it , as far as surrounds place them somewhere your more comfortable with . S35 is too tiny I wouldn’t bother a passive soundbar is better .
Get a front view of the TV, I’m shocked a massive room like that has Bose speakers but there so popular due to tiny size in non audiophiles I’m not surprised...
go for largest speakers you can fit .... going to need some serious subs too . Polk which model? Could be a temporary fix
I’ve used towers as surrounds to successfully, on bookshelve speakers stands . But bookshelves may be fine ...
Small speakers are terrible for that room ... go big or go home 🏡..
I’ve seen smaller movie theaters 🎭 ...then that room.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply, I do use the fireplace frequently in the cold months so the towers wouldn't work for me. Thanks for the feedback on the S35.

I know front view is better but it's not really an option. You can kind of see in one of the views there is a small staircase directly opposite the fireplace/TV. It's way too close to put a couch and would block the egress and be very awkward.

I inherited some random equipment from my father when he downsized homes including the AVR and the Polk Sub which I hooked up already; it's an old model: PSW202.

I'm definitely not opposed to going bigger! However I feel it would a bit of a waste to not use the prewired cable for anything; also I'm a bit constricted by my TV placement.
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RayGuy said:
Looks like there is already a soundbar just under the TV???

If it's just an optical illusion, add the Phase Tech Teatro 3 channel passive soundbar to the mix of options. Quality sound, well reviewed, will cost a bit more for a better option, Like Totem or Triad.

Be sure to read the music portion of the article ...

Phase Technology Teatro TSB3.0 Soundbar Review
Click to expand...
Thank you! I haven't come across that model and I've scoured the internet for passive speaker bar options...not much of a market apparently. Your eyes don't deceive you; there's a cheap powered sound bar under there that I used in my old small condo. I had it already so I hung it up but I'm looking to upgrade.
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kblackburn101
Pasteycakes said:
Thank you! I haven't come across that model and I've scoured the internet for passive speaker bar options...not much of a market apparently. Your eyes don't deceive you; there's a cheap powered sound bar under there that I used in my old small condo. I had it already so I hung it up but I'm looking to upgrade.
Click to expand...
I’d stick to the soundbar or passive soundbar, until you find a way for towers or something maybe when budget is larger . Unfortunately fireplace is the worst spot for audio set up 🆙, so sorry about that .

The back speakers could be used as surround or Atmos , the two on the right of the tv are so far away ... I’m not really sure what to use them for , possibly background music ? Or kitchen.
Have you tried the Bose how do they sound ?
For movie theater level sound you’d need to spend a lot so , stick to cheaper options til you get bored of them .
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Zorba922 said:
Ok, so there is a massive amount of info and two helpful photos, but there's also some very ESSENTIAL info that's missing.

1. How important is COSMETICS? Are you under severe WAF pressure to stick with relatively compact white speakers? I don't want to be tripping over stuff but I'm not opposed to larger equipment. WAF situation can be finessed. Nope no attachment to little white speakers, they were just here already. I do like the idea of using the existing wiring however. I take it your have small kids so bookshelf speakers on stands are out of the question, but would some high quality yet shockingly affordable tower speakers work? Yes to kids so correct bookshelves on stands may not be an option. Not opposed to doing that on either side of the couch for surrounds but I'm not sure how I'd do that for L/R or C given the pulldown and angled TV. Similar response to the towers; I'm not opposed but I'm struggling to figure where I'd put them.

2. What % of your usage will be TV/HT and what % will be music? 30%/70%

3. What is the total budget maximum that you are willing/able to spend on upgrading this setup?

Budget is flexible but maybe like $2k total to give you a ballpark. However I was thinking I'd piecemeal it. Like I said with those passive speaker bar options I was thinking the $600 range would be appropriate for me right now. I hope to replace the rest of the Bose cubes eventually with either in-ceiling or better quality, full range on-wall/ceiling speakers. I just don't have the time to do that part right now.

Yes, the Polk S35 would certainly be an improvement over the abysmal Bose "center channel" in the same way that your current Polk sub is a big improvement over the equally abysmal Bose "bass module"---mainly because Bose is such a ludicrously low bar. Especially given the huge space.

However, you'd be very surprised how much much bigger of an improvement you could get with just a little bit more money these days---and no, I'm not suggesting some silly "audiophile" setup costing thousands and thousands of dollars. But even as little as $1K could get you a very pleasing system of real speakers and a real subwoofer ... IF you know where to look and what to get, by which I mean not the junk sold at Best Buy. Hell, even that $600 you mentioned for an active LCR soundbar could go a lot further than you ever imagined.

I'll wait for your answers to the first 3 questions, before offering more ideas. I'm listening!
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sigpig said:
I think you have the right idea for a passive LCR soundbar. Another place to look is HTD (Home Theatre Direct).
The SB3 is a good option when paired with a capable sub: Versa SB3
Click to expand...
Thanks for the rec!
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RayGuy
Pasteycakes said:
Thank you! I haven't come across that model and I've scoured the internet for passive speaker bar options...not much of a market apparently. Your eyes don't deceive you; there's a cheap powered sound bar under there that I used in my old small condo. I had it already so I hung it up but I'm looking to upgrade.
Click to expand...
Actually, it's a growing market, but most of the better quality options are in the four digit range, so your options are somewhat limited.
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kblackburn101 said:
I’d stick to the soundbar or passive soundbar, until you find a way for towers or something maybe when budget is larger . Unfortunately fireplace is the worst spot for audio set up 🆙, so sorry about that .

The back speakers could be used as surround or Atmos , the two on the right of the tv are so far away ... I’m not really sure what to use them for , possibly background music ? Or kitchen.
Have you tried the Bose how do they sound ?
For movie theater level sound you’d need to spend a lot so , stick to cheaper options til you get bored of them .
Click to expand...
Thanks for confirming my suspicions. I know the fireplace is not ideal and couple that with the pulldown/angle setup I have I've created a challenge.

I have used the Bose. Honestly for music, it sounds good and fills the room (loud enough for my upstairs neighbor to complain about it anyway). I use the PLII music setting so maybe that's what those "far" front speakers are for, I don't know. For movies tho it's pretty bad especially out of the center and the left and right channels are seemingly miles away. I did the Audyssey setup through the Onkyo but there's only so much that can account for. The surrounds are fine and yeah I see those (or at least speakers in that location if not those ones) as being used for Atmos someday. Maybe the "far" fronts could be replaced with full range angled speakers as part of a x.x.4 atmos someday???
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RayGuy said:
Actually, it's a growing market, but most of the better quality options are in the four digit range, so your options are somewhat limited.
Click to expand...
If you have recs or a sticky of recs I'd be happy to peruse even if in the 4 figure range. Thanks.
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Zorba922
Pasteycakes said:
1. I don't want to be tripping over stuff but I'm not opposed to larger equipment. WAF situation can be finessed. Nope no attachment to little white speakers, they were just here already. I do like the idea of using the existing wiring however. I take it your have small kids so bookshelf speakers on stands are out of the question, but would some high quality yet shockingly affordable tower speakers work? Yes to kids so correct bookshelves on stands may not be an option. Not opposed to doing that on either side of the couch for surrounds but I'm not sure how I'd do that for L/R or C given the pulldown and angled TV. Similar response to the towers; I'm not opposed but I'm struggling to figure where I'd put them.

2. What % of your usage will be TV/HT and what % will be music? 30%/70%

3. What is the total budget maximum that you are willing/able to spend on upgrading this setup?
Budget is flexible but maybe like $2k total to give you a ballpark. However I was thinking I'd piecemeal it. Like I said with those passive speaker bar options I was thinking the $600 range would be appropriate for me right now. I hope to replace the rest of the Bose cubes eventually with either in-ceiling or better quality, full range on-wall/ceiling speakers. I just don't have the time to do that part right now.
Click to expand...
$600 right now, I'd get a pair of these JBL towers on sale (free return shipping in case you aren't pleased) and they will do well for your 70% music usage even without a strong sub.

JBL Stage A190 | Home Audio Loudspeaker System

Designed and engineered in JBL’s world-famous acoustic engineering facility in Northridge, California, the Stage A190 is the flagship of the JBL Stage Series. This floorstanding loudspeaker features a 2 ½-way design with patented High-Definition Imaging (HDI™) waveguide geometry, 1-inch (25mm)...
www.jbl.com www.jbl.com

You can put them on either side of the TV. At 50lbs each they should survive your two kids.

You could also add one of these towers directly under your TV as a center speaker---it would work very well since it's only 36.6" tall and your TV appears to be mounted pretty high up (if you could fit a 3rd A190 there that would be ideal of course but that one is 42" tall.

JBL Stage A170 | Home Audio Loudspeaker System

Designed and engineered in JBL’s world-famous acoustic engineering facility in Northridge, California, the Stage A170 is the most compact floorstanding loudspeaker of the JBL Stage Series. The narrow footprint features a 2 ½-way design with patented High-Definition Imaging (HDI™) waveguide...
www.jbl.com www.jbl.com

With a robust front 3 doing 90% of the output during movies, you will be be fine keeping the 2 rear surrounds for now, or going with a pair of Polk OWM-3 (Amazon) if you want something white, compact, cheap and easily ceiling/wall mounted.
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RayGuy
Pasteycakes said:
If you have recs or a sticky of recs I'd be happy to peruse even if in the 4 figure range. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Totem, Triad, James Loudspeaker, Martin Logan, Monitor Audio, Golden Ear, PSB, Paradigm, Legacy ... off the top of my head.

One other thought. Your MantleMount has a weight limit, so be aware of your remaining capacity and eliminate the options that exceed that limit. In truth, you would probably want to stay under the weight limit, if at all possible, to preserve it's mobility over time.
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Thank you all for your responses. This was a very helpful discussion and I think I'm going to take a little bit of advice from all of you.

@kblackburn101 I'm going to stick with the soundbar setup I have for now until I get bored and want to really invest. I'll someday use those overhead speakers by the couch for an atmos setup. As for those far away ones, I dunno, maybe a "zone 2" or something. I set up the Bose system + my sub with an old AVR and am just using it for Sonos and vinyl right now.

@RayGuy ; thanks for the passive SB recs. That Phase Technology TSB3.0 may be the ticket but I'm going to hold off until I get a new TV and may have to mess with the mantelmount. I was running low voltage through the walls and went ahead and put 3 wires up there for the future. I'm cognizant of the weight limits of the mount and I'll be sure to stay comfortably under.

@Zorba922 , I'm not going to go with the towers in this room but I have another (much less awkward) room that was hardwired with a different 5 channel HTIAB with tiny speakers (Def Tech Procinema 600) and something along those lines may work great for that space. That project is a few months away but I may reach out to you or post on the forums for some recs at that time.

Thanks again everyone.
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