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Discussion Starter #1
All other aspects when talking HDR projectors is so far secondary it ain't even the same f**king sport. madVR & JVC 4k folks know what I'm talking about. I won't buy a projector without it because I'm not a dummy. If you don't at least have madVR coupled with a non JVC 4k projector, throw everything including yourself in the garbage. Someone start a revolt in this under $3k projector forum we demand to have it!
 

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The LG HU70LAB has dynamic tone mapping.

Without full P3 coverage or dynamic tone mapping, 4K/HDR is pointless though imo.
 

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How good the dynamic tone mapping is on the LG HU70LAB. Does it even come close to MadVR, does it compare with content mastered with Dolby Vison or HDR10+, or is it just better than nothing?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
we are all dummies

All other aspects when talking HDR projectors is so far secondary it ain't even the same f**king sport. madVR & JVC 4k folks know what I'm talking about. I won't buy a projector without it because I'm not a dummy. If you don't at least have madVR coupled with a non JVC 4k projector, throw everything including yourself in the garbage. Someone start a revolt in this under $3k projector forum we demand to have it!
BTW, I bought an Epson 3800 a couple months back and it's a wonderful picture for the money especially on an alr screen in a living room, but it was impossible to use the Cinema preset without distorted flesh tones in lots of low-light/shadowed scenes with HDR. The only "fix" is to use Natural instead. The difference between the two is roughly 85% of Rec.709 for Natural vs. about 110% of Rec.709/75% P3 which is a pretty noticeable difference in color. After countless weeks of calibrating, custom curve tone mapping, endless tweaking, etc. it was only until I got madVR going when I saw the stunning difference dynamic tone mapping makes & it totally solved the distorted flesh tones problem. Now having what looks like a 100" 4k HDR display in your living room for $1400 after Epson's own discounts plus cost of screen is something special, and I'm jealous of the JVCs having even better DTM inherent to the projector itself applying that magic to all sources. If the NX5 came in white where I live, I would buy it instantly. So I guess what I'm saying is, you have no choice but to be a dummy like me buying the 3800, but I will not be a dummy again! Fool me once!!
 

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BTW, I bought an Epson 3800 a couple months back and it's a wonderful picture for the money especially on an alr screen in a living room, but it was impossible to use the Cinema preset without distorted flesh tones in lots of low-light/shadowed scenes with HDR. The only "fix" is to use Natural instead. The difference between the two is roughly 85% of Rec.709 for Natural vs. about 110% of Rec.709/75% P3 which is a pretty noticeable difference in color. After countless weeks of calibrating, custom curve tone mapping, endless tweaking, etc. it was only until I got madVR going when I saw the stunning difference dynamic tone mapping makes & it totally solved the distorted flesh tones problem. Now having what looks like a 100" 4k HDR display in your living room for $1400 after Epson's own discounts plus cost of screen is something special, and I'm jealous of the JVCs having even better DTM inherent to the projector itself applying that magic to all sources. If the NX5 came in white where I live, I would buy it instantly. So I guess what I'm saying is, you have no choice but to be a dummy like me buying the 3800, but I will not be a dummy again! Fool me once!!
Why would you buy a JVC in white? Those projectors are best for velvet batcaves, where all not dark objects must be removed.

One solution for with or without madvr is a colorimeter. They're not that expensive. If you have madvr that would be a nice addition.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Why would you buy a JVC in white? Those projectors are best for velvet batcaves, where all not dark objects must be removed.

One solution for with or without madvr is a colorimeter. They're not that expensive. If you have madvr that would be a nice addition.
For my living room, bud :cool:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I hope it does not have white walls.

Or mirrors as I saw on one thread.
No, my living room is perfect for ALR as I alluded to above. If you haven't experienced the magic of a living room/alr/high lumen projector combo, you're missing out. With a fair amount of ambient light, you still get an incredible punchy picture with great blacks and contrast.
 

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No, my living room is perfect for ALR as I alluded to above. If you haven't experienced the magic of a living room/alr/high lumen projector combo, you're missing out. With a fair amount of ambient light, you still get an incredible punchy picture with great blacks and contrast.
I have a W2000 (HT3050) and a Cinegrey 3D. I would not call it great blacks. Not sure where you got the impression that great blacks can be had with anything less than 0 ambient light.
 

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No, my living room is perfect for ALR as I alluded to above. If you haven't experienced the magic of a living room/alr/high lumen projector combo, you're missing out. With a fair amount of ambient light, you still get an incredible punchy picture with great blacks and contrast.
I don't know how to take a picture at my screen without my living room looking dim, but this gives an idea.
 

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I have a W2000 (HT3050) and a Cinegrey 3D. I would not call it great blacks. Not sure where you got the impression that great blacks can be had with anything less than 0 ambient light.
Great blacks is an opinion and in this case informed by choosing the right paint and screen material and projector. You do understand there is a lively living room market for projectors? The NX5 is the N5 overseas and comes in white for that exact market. Stop arguing with opinions just to argue, especially in my silly thread about dynamic tone mapping. :rolleyes:
 

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Using a Sim2 Mico40 and an XY Black Crystal 0.8 I can get an extremely watchable vibrant and detailed picture at 20fl in higher ambient light, even with lower APL content.

Also DTM has unlocked the true potential of alot of older dlp projectors. Wait until you start seeing more native wide gamut rgb led/laser single chip dlp with high quality lenses.

You think that epson looks nice, try something like hitachi lp-wu3500, panasonic pt-rz470, xiaomi mijia alpd3.0, or if you can find them, the sim2 micos, runco q750i, or even 3chip dlp projectors. Transcendent color and sharpness. perfect motion performance ala crt, and perfect uniformity.

Another very interesting observation is these pure led projectors(i dont know if this is true for laser or laser/led+phosphor) sparkle less on gained ALR screens. I can only imagine its due to the narrower band wavelength of the light source.
 

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Great blacks is an opinion and in this case informed by choosing the right paint and screen material and projector. You do understand there is a lively living room market for projectors? The NX5 is the N5 overseas and comes in white for that exact market. Stop arguing with opinions just to argue, especially in my silly thread about dynamic tone mapping. :rolleyes:
You started it. Bought ALR into the conversation. Personal preference can only go so far. The problem is some people just happen to stumble on a post like that and get the impression that a good picture can be had with ambient light. Especially blacks. You have no way of knowing what they will consider a good looking image.

And although this is an assumption and maybe projection, I believe most people will not find a picture like the one posted above ok. On reason everybody is used to TVs and TVs don't wash out like that.
That picture is mostly bright, but even in there the dark areas look obviously affected. How about a lower ADL picture.

Just because JVC sells a white cased LCoS projector does not mean it should be used in ambient light. I think most users on this forum would think that would be a poor use of such a machine. In the dark with an ALR screen that's a different story, although you'll still find detractors.

Room treatment and strategically placed lights can help, but low ADL scenes are still a challenge. These two examples look great at first glance, but if you look closely at the dark areas in the image it's obvious the black level is elevated. This is fine for sports, but not movies or well produced TV/series IMO:




bdht is making me curious about about the units he's mentioning, it's too bad regional availability is non existent. And my personal priority is good blacks. I have no problem watching in the dark, but others are not comfortable.


But I don't want to continue this conversion if you don't want to. Cheers.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
It's one thing to disagree and another thing to talk like that. But I'm not going to respond.

Good luck with the thread.
Looking forward to your next response about how you're not going to respond. Sorry your Cinegrey 3D sucks :(
 

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bdht is making me curious about about the units he's mentioning, it's too bad regional availability is non existent. And my personal priority is good blacks. I have no problem watching in the dark, but others are not comfortable.
Hm, whats the metric for good blacks? The Mico40 has 3000:1 native at 600 lumens, 15,000 dynamic, and looks more like 25,000:1 and 8-900 lumens due to how much brighter the high yield narrow band wide gamut leds with a dmd appear. Black levels are superb unless directly comparing to low ADL auto-iris D-ILA or OLED. These projectors should have been mainstays but low measured light output put people off(although the person i purchased the mic40 from was using a 160" screen, said perfect for sdr but not bright enough for hdr, at around 10fl) and now the demand for 2160p resolution(regardless of being less sharp and detailed) won the day, hence projectors like the ht9060.

Now the 0.67" business rgb dlp projectors are probably stuck at 2000:1, and the 0.47" dmd 1000:1. So not a great black floor, but actual intrascene contrast due to the uniformity, high ansi contrast of 600:1, and color contrast/performance, makes for a very nice image in every aspect except for low APL black floor.

If something like the hitachi can apply 5x gamma corrected dimming youll have a very good 10k:1 dynamic contrast, native p3 gamut, 600:1 ansi contrast emissive display tack sharp, with a high quality lens, dmd pixel response, and almost 2000 calibrated lumens with low power usage low heat output no bulbs no filters for under $3k. Theres no reason it shouldnt exist and be readily available except for demand for 2160p.

 

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I have a W2000 (HT3050) and a Cinegrey 3D. I would not call it great blacks. Not sure where you got the impression that great blacks can be had with anything less than 0 ambient light.
I can add to this as well as my spouse has light sensitivity and can rarely watch something with all the lights off. What I've been doing is essentially shrouding the projection screen with black velvet/fabric and having dimmer lights on on either side of fabric. This brings up the ambient light level of the room, but prevents direct light from hitting the screen. In combination with the darker grey ALR screen partially offsets the increased ambient light and provides a very good black level without all lights on. i.e. say even a 0.001fl black floor looks brighter than the unmasked portions of the screen.
 
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