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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I tried it once and didn't get a reply, so i'll rephrase...


I'm new to the forums, have read a bit of the posts and need help deciding with which projector should i go...


My big question is, under a tight budget (around EUR 300), since it's not going to be used that often and given the fact that me and my girlfriend are most of the time just watching stuff on our laptops, should we go for a regular bulb projector or a LED one?


The facts:


1) I've read that the 200 ANSI lumens on LED projectors result in perceivably more than that given how focused light is from a LED;


2) I found equally priced bulb projectors with a rating of 2000 ANSI lumens and sometimes double the CR.


So, thinking about usability (ambient light restrictions etc) and whether colors tend to be crisper or not on LED projectors, should i go LED or not?


I'm thinking about either the LG HS-201 or the Acer K11, or several other regular bulb options in the same price range... Help anyone??
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yeah, i hope too, but it doesn't seem like... How is this possible??


Isn't anybody interested in budget led projectors? Can't anybody tell me if 200 ANSI Lumens from a led projector makes it usable enough in a non-controlled environment? And how does it compare to a similarly priced regular bulb/color-wheel one?


Disappointing forum full of disinterested experts.
 

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So sad... hahah I'll help you!



Okay, FYI, LED projectors are said to have more oomph and therefore are under valued by their 'lumen' output, but it is exaggerated to say that a 200 lumen LED projector is close to what a 2000 lumen non-LED projector is capable of achieving. Especially in your 'non light controlled environment' i suggest you to go with the 2000 lumen projector you saw for the same price.


Plus, another thing is that with 200 lumens on that LED projector, don't expect to project very far, especially in a non light controlled environment.


Which projector did you see with 2000 lumen btw? For your budget you can look at the HD66
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chumpchange21
So sad... hahah I'll help you!



Okay, FYI, LED projectors are said to have more oomph and therefore are under valued by their 'lumen' output, but it is exaggerated to say that a 200 lumen LED projector is close to what a 2000 lumen non-LED projector is capable of achieving. Especially in your 'non light controlled environment' i suggest you to go with the 2000 lumen projector you saw for the same price.


Plus, another thing is that with 200 lumens on that LED projector, don't expect to project very far, especially in a non light controlled environment.


Which projector did you see with 2000 lumen btw? For your budget you can look at the HD66
For a little over your budget you might be able to find a used Optoma HD20. I just saw one for $600 on my local craigslist.


There's a big huge thread on this projector. It seems to be the best low budget projector right now.
 

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Quote:
Hi,


I've just bought a LG HX301g projector and I'd like to share my thoughts. Some of the things I'll write here are already mentioned in this thread but here are my humble opinion about hx301.


(before i start, hx301g was announced in India, most probably, it is a product for middle east and asia, I live in Turkey, and although it is advertised as Hx300 in the store, when I saw the box, I am surprised to see that the model number is Hx301g. I think the only differences between hx300 and hx301 are ht301 supports 1080p and lacks FM transmitter.)


I am a photographer, and also a photography instructor living in Ankara, Turkey. I have a Panasonic AE3000 full HD and LG AH115 720p projectors, but their lamps are too expensive to spend during the lectures, so I decided to buy a LED projector. I prepare full HD slide shows and use panasonic for these (apart from watching movies ofcourse).. And LG AH115 at home and for remote locations as it is easier to carry. (Panasonic is huge


I will be comparing the HX301 to Panasonic AE3000.. I know it is not fair to campare these two, but this is all I have now in studio. here is the two in the same picture:




I will clarify some of the misleading points about LG HX300-HX301 series in my experience.


1."ultraportable" : When you look at the specs, you can be fooled by the dimensions and weight of the projector, but wait until you see the power brick. It really is a brick and weighs exactly the same amount with the hx301 (~800 grams). So you need a bag that should hold both of them. Together with the power brick, hx301 will be as heavy as good old LG AH115. By the way, out of the box, there is a nice carrying case.


2."No lamp heat, therefore no cooling": It is not true, the lamp becomes hot, and the fan is working. If you choose "Presentation" mode, which is the brightest mode, it seems fan works at maximum speed most of the time. I said "most of the time" because fan speed is not constant, it changes and I should say it is annoying. Fan noise changes continuously. While I am writing this message, it is turned on, the fan noise is noticeable. After watching a movie, if you shut down the Hx301, unlike the other projectors, it shuts down. No additional cooling, nothing. So you can shut it down and take it to its bag immediately and go. But be prepared for a hot bag.


"LED projectors are brighter than the conventional projectors" this seems not true. As I am a photographer, I have a 'light meter'.. Which means I can measure the amount of light falling to a surface. So I made an experiment. I put the projectors to a same distance from a white wall (actually it is not important if it is a white wall or a black curtain, as the light meter measures the light "falling to the surface" not "reflected by the surface". So the type of the surface is irrelevant in this example.


I put HX301 to the same place with AE3000 (which is roughly 3m [9.8 feet] to the screen) So the diagonal of the image is around 2.50m (=100inch)


I connected HX301 to a popcorn hour A110 from HDMI port and played Star Trek 2009. I have found a very bright scene (where the romulan ship is about to go into warp ) and measure the brightest point assuming the amount of the light is the maximum at that point that the projector can give. HX301 was at presentation mode (the brightest mode) during the test. The result was 4.1 EV (EV means exposure value used to measure the amount of light)


HX301:



You may wonder why the picture is so dark, you'll see in the next picture.


to make this meaningless number (4.1 Ev) more meaningful, I repated the same experiment with the AE3000. And the result was 6.3 EV:


Panasonic AE3000:



You can compare the above pictures to see how they look in terms of brightness. The brightness of HX301 is like watching AE3000 with sun glasses.


So I have two numbers 4.1 EV for HX301 and 6.3 EV for Panasonic.. When you increase the EV by 1, you increase the amount of light twice (it is called "1 stop"). So after a calculation we see that, panasonic is 4.84 times brighter than Hx301 (square of [6.3-4.1=2.2]). If 100 photons arrive to the wall from HX301, then 484 photons arrive from panasonic.


If you measure the light from 1.4 meters to the HX301, you can read 6.3 EV.. In other words, you can get the same illumination with AE3000 if you put HX301 1.5m away from the screen which makes an image size of 40 something inch diagonal.


Here is another comparison (with the projectors are in the same distance to the screen):


Hx301:



AE3000:



I took these photos with the same values (aperture, shutter speed and ISO) that's why HX301's results are so dim. If you watch two projectors side by side, you see like this. I hope this is an answer to the question "how bright is HX301/HX300"


If I let the camera measure the light and then take the picture, both pictures (ae3000 and hx301) would be the same for the same scene as the camera wants to gather the same amount of light. Here is the photo of HX301 screen when you use auto exposure modes (or green mode)




Good news is, if you don't compare HX301 with a high end projector, the brightness of the screen seems very good. You can see all the detail in the movies, although i have difficulties adjusting the correct colors. But I'll find somehow.


The usb port is a bonus for me, it can power portable HDs. So I can use a 500 gb portable disk and i can watch the movies in it. Only bad thing is when I use it with a HD if I use headphones, there is a continuous high pitch sound on the background. I think if I use a flash disk, the sound will be gone. it has a built in pdf and ppt reader, but very limited, no animations whatsoever. It can only show pages one after another. You can use remote to change the slides.


The good thing it can read most of the movie formats including mkvs. If the sound is DTS, then is says "Unsupported audio" and you can't hear a thing. But there are some programs which can convert dts to dolby (google 'popcorn mkv audio converter'), then you can watch them with sound. It didn't play a specific mkv and a mp4, i don't know why, but I successfully played a 1080p video which my laptop can't play. It can't read subtitles embedded in mkvs, there must be a separate subtitle file with the exact same name with the movie. You can't change the size of the subtitles. With a specific movie file, the projector shut down itself and I had to turn on again. May be a missing codec or defective file which computer player can handle but projector cannot. The file can play on the computer with media player.


It is surprising to see how good it can down sample HD videos. I thought SD and HD would not make a great difference, but it does. More important for me, it can resize the text very good. So if you use, say, 1280x1024 resolution, the characters are still looking good and readable. My current setting is 1280x720 and even the tiniest words can be read.


I am pleased with the projector so far. I don't use it for watching movies, rather to show Powerpoint presentations during class hours. If you buy it for watching movies, i think you can be happy with it. Although you can buy much brighter pj's at the same price, if you think the lamp life, the overall cost is very low. You should watch it near darkness or otherwise contrast is very low. So if you have a light controlled environment and plan to place it 1.5 - 2m to the screen then you'll be ok with it. If you plan to watch it on 2.5x1.8 meters screen, then you can think of some other alternatives.


If you have any questions, i'll be happy to answer.


Hope this helps,


Melih
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=468

I guess all this was just to hard to understand




Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by scolfaro View Post

yes, i tried this in my own thread, and now i'll give my final shot here...


HOW DO THESE BUDGET LED PROJECTORS FARE UP AGAINST SIMILARLY PRICED REGULAR BULBED ONES (as regards usability and picture quality in a non-controlled light environment)?


Do the 2.5000 ANSI Lumens from regular bulbed ones mean a big difference against the 200 ANSI Lumens from these?



Thank you.
Quote:
The pure led stuff is just not bright enough.yes there is a big difference.Really the only upside ever was no bulbs.


A good comparison.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=468


There is a lot of fanboi love that gos on in the led threads so BEWARE!




do you read the replies or follow the links?
 

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@Huskerfan, I don't think this guy lives in the U.S., he's talking in Euros, or I could be wrong (maybe the O.P. just likes Euros and not greenbacks lol)?

@eat meat

This is a great link:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=468


Thanks eat meat



I guess that pretty much clarifies my point on how LED 200 lumens does not equate to 2000 lumens HAH.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hello guys! Just when i thought the thread was dead... I ended up going with a regular bulbed one, Acer X110. Final thought before actually buying it was the cheaper the better :-/


I just thought, "well, 2500 ANSI Lumens, 5000hrs in eco-mode, with the image that far away 800X600 can't make that big of a difference and maybe we aren't even going to use it that much anyway, so why spend more?". I can see after 6hrs using it right out of the box that i was wrong in several aspects there...


I'll try to reply to y'all here:


1) Chumpchange, as you saw it, the pj is the Acer X110 (for 299 euros); And yes, you were right and some of my girlfriend's friends warned her that it wasn't quite the same also, so adding that to the stuff i read here i decided to "not led"... The HD66 is almost 600 euros, unfortunately...


2) Ditchdigger, all of the pjs mentioned are found for around 500-600 euros... Being my first projector, i guess i just didn't have the balls to risk spending more on smtg i wasn't sure to enjoy... Plus i thought that if i spent half and waited a couple years maybe there would also be a cheaper/higher brightness hassle-free led alternative;


3) Huskerfan, chumpchange is right
- i live in Austria, some gadgets seem to be cheaper, or at least similarly priced here, whilst others are just twice as expensive... Somehow Acer is the former here;


4) Eatmeat, i saw your reply on the other thread, and thank you for the heads up, anyway
Unfortunately (or fortunately...) we have a party here tonight and that kind of rushed us onto physically available projectors and out of online buying, which narrowed our options further...


In the end it was Benq 525 - Acer X110. 50% cheaper, 20% less pixels and 100% more contrast, plus longer lamp-life. Was it a good decision? I'm not sure, but at least i didn't spend that much to regret it. It seems on par with the resolution that my parents have on an oldish 65 inch rear projection tv, which was of course not HD, but has been always enjoyed... As for becoming a projection addict, it unfortunately looks quite possible and i was already thinking about ways of dumping the lower-res one and going closer to hd, but that might be utterly stupid right now and i think i'll hang-on to it for a while and check what my final thoughts are on projecting stuff and watching, since i'm not that much of a tv buff to begin with...
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by scolfaro
In the end it was Benq 525 - Acer X110.
Wait, so went with the BenQ 525?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by chumpchange21 /forum/post/19624603


Wait, so went with the BenQ 525?

Nope, Acer X110... Somehow it's a bit depressing when you shoot a 100"+ picture and then walk-in to see lego sized pixels hanging in there, but i'm not sure if 1024X768 would be so different from 800X600... Plus, the contrast in the Acer is a lot better (4.000 vs 2.600 in the BenQ).


In the end i'm not quite sure, if it's a good trade losing 35% contrast and 20% in lamp-life to get 20% more pixels (all that while paying 120 euros more)... Is it? What would you have done? 'Cause maybe we still can argue with the sales dude and exchange it (our Acer) for the more expensive one (BenQ) before the 2 weeks "trial" period is over...


I wouldn't say we're unhappy though, we clocked 12+ hours in the first weekend with the thing, and watching BBC Life on it just stopped the conversation in our party... Good thing we were already too drunk to care
 
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