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Need help integrating MBM’s with existing subs

1140 Views 11 Replies 7 Participants Last post by lknhomeaudio, Aug 19, 2019

lawdogx

Discussion Starter · Aug 10, 2019 (Edited)

I have four mini marty’s that graph pretty well and wanted to add some mbm’s to help fill some mid bass dips. I built a pair of VBSS’s tuned to 31hz, used the recommended filter settings, and put them in spots in the room that I know to be good for mid bass. They graph as intended, but when added to the existing subs they destroy the response at the VBSS tuning frequency. Below is the Mini Marty’s playing alone in blue, and Mini Marty’s and VBSS’s all together in red (no smoothing, no EQ). I confirmed polarity on all subs and have time aligned them all. Any suggestions for getting these subs to play well with each other?

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johnson636

· #2 · Aug 10, 2019

How do you have them crossed? Same frequency range? I have my 24's low-passed at 40hz and my MBMs pick up from there

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lawdogx

Discussion Starter · #3 · Aug 10, 2019

johnson636 said:
How do you have them crossed? Same frequency range? I have my 24's low-passed at 40hz and my MBMs pick up from there

I had asked Matt about this in the VBSS thread before starting the build, his response was “I'd run them all full range if you can, more sources give you the benefit of response smoothing and increased output over using them in their own separate frequency ranges.” Right now that is how I’m running them.

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smcmillan2

· #4 · Aug 10, 2019

Have you flipped phase on the VBSSs? Or the Martys?

I had a pretty big dip at my VBSS's tune when I added sealed UM18s to the mix. Playing with phase shallowed it out quite a bit.

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johnson636

· #5 · Aug 10, 2019

lawdogx said:
I had asked Matt about this in the VBSS thread before starting the build, his response was “I'd run them all full range if you can, more sources give you the benefit of response smoothing and increased output over using them in their own separate frequency ranges.” Right now that is how I’m running them.

I would agree with that statement if you're well adapted to get them to play well together

However, I chose simplicity. In my setup, there is absolutely zero reason for my mbm's (4 PA460s loaded in 4cu ported) to play below 40hz... The 24s have that frequency on point

I have my MBMs playing 40hz-200hz

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Gorilla Killa

· #6 · Aug 10, 2019

Its reversing phase at port tune, it's easier to integrate subs ported at the same frequency. Try putting a HP at 40hz like johnson said, make it steep like -48db and see what happens.

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lawdogx

Discussion Starter · #7 · Aug 11, 2019

johnson636 said:
How do you have them crossed? Same frequency range? I have my 24's low-passed at 40hz and my MBMs pick up from there

Gorilla Killa said:
Its reversing phase at port tune, it's easier to integrate subs ported at the same frequency. Try putting a HP at 40hz like johnson said, make it steep like -48db and see what happens.

Thanks for the suggestions. I tried playing with the phase. It did smooth out the 31hz problem, but destroyed everything else. I’m game for giving a try to splitting the sub frequencies. What do you guys recommend for LPF for the marties and HPF for the VBSS’s? Do you use the same frequency and filter for both or overlap them?

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BassThatHz

· #8 · Aug 11, 2019

This is a known problem for ported/horned subs.

As mentioned. Try increasing the slope to 18, 24 or 48db/oct firstly.
If that doesn't work THEN look at the 2-way subwoofer option. (Anywhere from 30-40hz should be fine...)

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johnson636

· #9 · Aug 11, 2019

I've suggested to you how I have mine setup below

johnson636 said:
How do you have them crossed? Same frequency range? I have my 24's low-passed at 40hz and my MBMs pick up (high passed) from there

lawdogx said:
Thanks for the suggestions. I tried playing with the phase. It did smooth out the 31hz problem, but destroyed everything else. I’m game for giving a try to splitting the sub frequencies. What do you guys recommend for LPF for the marties and HPF for the VBSS’s? Do you use the same frequency and filter for both or overlap them?

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dsmrider07

· #10 · Aug 16, 2019

For me phase didnt do much but cause other nulls/make nulls worse. Start with adding some delay to the vbss

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lknhomeaudio

· #11 · Aug 16, 2019

I've been seeing these mid-bass threads for years, and have always been curious what the response curve must look like. I'm guessing it's not the straight-ish house curve that most of us try to achieve?

Can someone with strong mid-bass show me you response curve? Thanks!

Is it anything like this? (but of course not that smooth lol)