[lou99]

Hello all..


I live in a prewar building with wood floors and one really thin (plain) wall. I this wall with my neighbor - whom is having hard times dealing with my home theater. My setup is very modest - Onkyo 507 and Aperion Audio 5TB's. I have a 80 watt sub, side firing, sitting on top of a sub-dude, with 1/4 gain. They complained. They are home all day and night and there is no suitable time of day to play music. I removed the sub and tweaked the system to only play 70hz and above. However I still need to sound deaden this wall as these frequencies still penetrate at low volumes. Please help? Therese gotta be a solution since LFE 80hz and below is out of the picture.


Thanks!

 

[bluesky636]

With a wall that thin, there is very little that you can do. Sound absorbers placed on walls are designed to control reflections, not for soundproofing. Sound is being transmitted through both the wall and the wooden floor. To soundproof your room would require either very thick absorbing material or reinforcement of the wall and floor. None of which is practical.


Your best bet is to try and make friends with your neighbors. Show them your system and give them a lttle demo. Then try and get them to agree to a time period and duration when you can play your music or movies. That is what I did when my wife and I lived in an apartment and my next door neighbors (two elderly sisters) complained. It worked quite well and we become good friends. Later, when we bought a second floor condo, my downstairs neighbor told me he was stone deaf in one ear and didn't really care how loud I played things.

 

[lou99]

Thanks! I made friends with them - they are alright - its still pretty bad sounding on their end at low frequencies. Its not my fault (or theirs). Its the wall.. I can hear faint voice through the wall. I thought 70+HZ would be a obtainable goal. I'm thinking of adding a sheet or two of sheet rock over the bad wall. I dont think the floor is a problem since I have the main speakers on spikes and small pieces of rug. I also do not have a sub. Any other thoughts? I was also considering getting a bigger area rug to go completely under the home theater setup all the way to the sofa.

 

[Rasterfarian]

Do you own your space, or are you renting? If you're renting, there isn't much practical you can do but move.


If you own, there are option$. How nice is the place? Is the wall plaster, sheetrock, or something else? Is there nice baseboard and/or crown molding? How much are you willing to spend (perhaps mitigated some by how handy you are)? Are you (currently) married?

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by lou99 /forum/post/18118859


Thanks! I made friends with them - they are alright - its still pretty bad sounding on their end at low frequencies. Its not my fault (or theirs). Its the wall.. I can hear faint voice through the wall. I thought 70+HZ would be a obtainable goal. I'm thinking of adding a sheet or two of sheet rock over the bad wall. I dont think the floor is a problem since I have the main speakers on spikes and small pieces of rug. I also do not have a sub. Any other thoughts? I was also considering getting a bigger area rug to go completely under the home theater setup all the way to the sofa.

Carpeting will help with noise transmission through the floor. Increasing the wall thickness is the only real solution for that problem. If you are able to use additional sheetrock, than consider using this:

http://www.greengluecompany.com/


I have heard a lot of positive things about it. Good luck.

 

[Roger Dressler]

Aside from the green glue, instead of the sheetrock use a layer of Quietrock . I used 510 on my common wall in my house, with GG, and it worked very well. Installs just like sheetrock.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler /forum/post/18120328


Aside from the green glue, instead of the sheetrock use a layer of Quietrock . I used 510 on my common wall in my house, with GG, and it worked very well. Installs just like sheetrock.

From the website you referenced:


545THX

Highest

performance

1-3/8"

60-80

2 hours

(estimated)

The only THX certified

drywall, superior sound

isolation, even at 50 Hz

High-end home theaters,

commercial theaters,

studios


That looks like wicked stuff!

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

What Roger said. I saw on a home improvement show the other day that one layer of Quietrock has the soundproofing effectiveness of eight layers of standard sheetrock! Maybe you could do the neighbor’s side of the wall as well. That should take care of it!


Regards,

Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[lou99]

Quietrock looks like a good starting point!


Its an apartment.. but I have two options..


Just "stick" the sheet rock over existing wall. or do it right and blend it in.


The super wont even know these walls are all hackjobs!

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

You could hire a contractor to apply the correct texture to the wall, repaint, and on one would ever know the work was done. You’d have to get longer screws for the electrical outlets and switches.


Regards,

Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[Roger Dressler]



Quote:
Originally Posted by lou99 /forum/post/18122648


Quietrock looks like a good starting point!


Its an apartment.. but I have two options..


Just "stick" the sheet rock over existing wall. or do it right and blend it in.


The super wont even know these walls are all hackjobs!

You need to tape/compound the seams, at least, to get the full effect.

 

[rhcorolla]

What are the common wall dimensions?


I would consider a removable false wall made out of 2 x 4's @ 16" stud centers w/ thicker sheet rock face (or quiet rock), & staple stud voids w/ r-11 insulation.


Maybe use wood screws for installation, so it is easier to remove whenever you leave the place.


Another short term consideration is heavy quilt/ fabric lined wall.


Owens-Corning 703/ 705 rigid insulation is used for sound treatment panels & has good absorption coefficients. You could make bass panels too.

 

[lou99]



Quote:
I would consider a removable false wall made out of 2 x 4's @ 16" stud centers w/ thicker sheet rock face (or quiet rock), & staple stud voids w/ r-11 insulation.

Sounds intense. I have no idea what you mean by this

I'll google..

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne A. Pflughaupt /forum/post/18122449

one layer of Quietrock has the soundproofing effectiveness of eight layers of standard sheetrock

Hey Wayne. I love QuietRock. Solid stuff and they have lab tests. I respect that. For the sake of the group at large, however the concept of 1=8 is a marketing sell point. As much as I respect the product, this has never been supported by any data for many years.


Lou99, the solution to your room isolation is dependent upon the specific structure you have. If you can hear small voices, this leads me to believe there may be flanking somewhere in addition to the sound traveling through the walls, etc. http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/...cles/flanking/


At a minimum you would want heavy (standard 5/8") drywall and damp it. That doesn't address the floors, however, and that won't get you to a 70Hz solution. If wood framed 16" OC studs, your coupled walls probably have a LF resonance point of maybe 100-125Hz. If your wall (ceiling, floor) resonance is above the frequency to be blocked, not such great success.


Spikes (or the need for them) probably isn't a real issue, as the great majority of the energy is efficiently translated into sound, not cabinet vibration (usually).


Carpet is effective for footfall noise, but not airborne unless the frequency is quite high.

 

[bluesky636]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted White /forum/post/18124811


Hey Wayne. I love QuietRock. Solid stuff and they have lab tests. I respect that. For the sake of the group at large, however the concept of 1=8 is a marketing sell point. As much as I respect the product, this has never been supported by any data for many years.


Lou99, the solution to your room isolation is dependent upon the specific structure you have. If you can hear small voices, this leads me to believe there may be flanking somewhere in addition to the sound traveling through the walls, etc. http://www.soundproofingcompany.com/...cles/flanking/


At a minimum you would want heavy (standard 5/8") drywall and damp it. That doesn't address the floors, however, and that won't get you to a 70Hz solution. If wood framed 16" OC studs, your coupled walls probably have a LF resonance point of maybe 100-125Hz. If your wall (ceiling, floor) resonance is above the frequency to be blocked, not such great success.


Spikes (or the need for them) probably isn't a real issue, as the great majority of the energy is efficiently translated into sound, not cabinet vibration (usually).


Carpet is effective for footfall noise, but not airborne unless the frequency is quite high.

Great website, Ted. Easy on the eyes, easy to follow, excellent photos/drawings.

 

[rhcorolla]



Quote:
Originally Posted by lou99 /forum/post/18124573


Sounds intense. I have no idea what you mean by this

I'll google..

Intense problem (paper thin wall), intense solution (new & improved insulated wall).

Seriously, it's not that complicated. 2 x 4 horizontal @ top & 2 @ bottom (if 8' h wall); vertical 2 x4's @ 16" centers in between headers w/ insulation in cavities prior to sheet rock/ quiet rock fastening.


You may want to check avs dedicated theater forum, & in particular, acoustical treatment thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...55432&page=196


Pose your question(s) there for some possible helpful advice.

 

[Ted White]



Quote:
Originally Posted by rhcorolla /forum/post/18125074



Intense problem (paper thin wall), intense solution (new & improved insulated wall).

Seriously, it's not that complicated.

I would say there are many details that would likely be missed if not thought through and planned. The underestimation of the level of detail is why beople get disappointed. One wall won't solve the problem.

 

[rhcorolla]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted White /forum/post/18128096


I would say there are many details that would likely be missed if not thought through and planned. The underestimation of the level of detail is why beople get disappointed. One wall won't solve the problem.

Agreed, but it's a good start, particularly since the other side of the wall is where the complaining originates from ...

The "not complicated" comment on my part was from his questioning of the wall construction though, not from a total sound treatment angle.

 

[tvrgeek]

Thanks for the links, I was just about to search for similar products. I don't get what is special about GreenGlue other than being a compliant caulk.

 

[Ted White]

Well, you're question is understandable. Green Glue is a material categorically described as a visco-elastic damping compound. Damping materials and caulk look the same, to be sure. Toothpaste also looks similar. The molecular properties of all three are quite different.


Various caulks and latex damping materials are all polymers of some sort. Small chains of polymer suspended in a water base. Caulk is designed to stay fairly rigid (viscous) and only mildly elastic, resisting dramatic temperature fluctuations, UV, and water.


Damping materials are much less viscous, much more elastic. If you felt dried samples of each you would feel a significant difference between them. High performance damping materials will remain very flexible and appear to still be wet.


When the viscosity and elasticity are in the correct proportions, the thin layer will effectively convert kinetic energy (sound) to thermal energy (heat). This energy conversion is what we refer to as damping.


Damping materials can't seal, and a sealant can't damp (from a practical consideration).