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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
k, so i think my network throughput is kinda sluggish. i have 3 pc's, my desktop/media server, htpc, and laptop.


desktop:

790gx mobo, phenom x3 (2.6ghz), 4gig ddr800 ram running vista business x64.

the os is on a pata western digital 500g hd (i recently switched to)

media is saved on 3 sata samsung spinpoint f1's.


network:

belkin N+ gigabit router, all cables less than 25ft.


laptop:

5400rpm hd


htpc:

785g mobo, athlon x2 4200 (2.2ghz)

os is on a sata 500g (forget manufacture off hand)


desktop -> laptop = ~10MB/sec

desktop -> laptop via patch cable = ~10MB/sec

desktop -> htpc = ~45MB/sec

desktop -> desktop = ~80MB/sec (any drive to any other drive)


are these typical speeds? i *thought* i remember desktop -> laptop as being faster. i recently reformatted the laptop and moved my desktop OS to the pata (had an sata before) (the hdd is master and cd slave on the pata) and not sure if something got messed up. both the desktop and laptop recognize the gigabit network.


also expected the desktop -> htpc to be faster.



are these speeds about right or is something goofy?


EDIT: ok, for some reason desktop -> laptop is now doing ~60MB/sec.


just need to figure out desktop -> htpc speeds now.
 

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The available bandwidth from the router is divided up by the number of different signals that are being routed through it at the same time.

The available retirval rate of data from any single disk drive is divided up by the number of different files you are trying to retrive from it concurently.

And of course there is the overhead associated with switching between concurrent usage of bandwidth or Disk throughput between the multiple concurrent users of the resouce.
 

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I would say that depends on the switch. Some switches will guarantee the full bandwidth by port. As I am unfamiliar with his switch he would need to validate. If your at a a few $$ or less then the bandwidth is aggregated across the ports. And this is under ideal situations.


Your through put issue is either the interface on the machine and/or your disk throughput. Even though SATA is rated at 375 MB/s you will never see this. Typically if you can have a sustained transferr of about 120 MB/s you are doing real good. I typcailly with my drives get around 90 - 110 MB/s they are older slower SATA drives.


Your laptops are most likely 5400 rpm drives which is always the limiting factor - much slower drives for laptops.


The net net is.. your network is most likely fine and your limiting factor is your hard drives. Try upgrading the drivers, turning on AHCI, enable write back cacheing in the Device Properties, etc. You will gain some but not that much.



Quote:
Originally Posted by walford /forum/post/17001720


The available bandwidth from the router is divided up by the number of different signals that are being routed through it at the same time.

The available retirval rate of data from any single disk drive is divided up by the number of different files you are trying to retrive from it concurently.

And of course there is the overhead associated with switching between concurrent usage of bandwidth or Disk throughput between the multiple concurrent users of the resouce.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanglx /forum/post/17001822


I


Your through put issue is either the interface on the machine and/or your disk throughput. Even though SATA is rated at 375 MB/s you will never see this.

THe SSDs are starting to hit the cap, I saw benchmarks on a crazy 1TB 3.5" drive that had internal raid, writes were up, but reads still maxed out ~220MB/s


I think that's about the hard limit for SATA 3gbps, also a 1 gigabit per second network card means about 125 megabyte per second of actual throughput. Remember 8 bits to a byte.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford /forum/post/17001536


Two points to consider.

1. The router can only receive annd route and output one signal at a time.

2. The system can only retrive data from one disk drive at at time.

Depends on how the router is.


If the router is a router + a hub that is true.

If the router is a router + a switch that is not true.


Granted this means that the desktop can talk to the laptop and the HTPC can talk to the internet without collision, that if the HTPC and the laptop both want to talk to the desktop then it will have prioritize the packets.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by stanglx /forum/post/17001822


I would say that depends on the switch. Some switches will guarantee the full bandwidth by port. As I am unfamiliar with his switch he would need to validate.

er, what do you mean validate?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stanglx /forum/post/17001822


Your through put issue is either the interface on the machine and/or your disk throughput. Even though SATA is rated at 375 MB/s you will never see this. Typically if you can have a sustained transferr of about 120 MB/s you are doing real good. I typcailly with my drives get around 90 - 110 MB/s they are older slower SATA drives.

kk, i wasn't sure if the fact that my OS is on a old pata drive that it could slow things down. i'm pretty sure the throughput goes thru north or south chipset and has nothing to do with the OS hd, correct?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stanglx /forum/post/17001822


Your laptops are most likely 5400 rpm drives which is always the limiting factor - much slower drives for laptops.

yep, its 5400rpm and kinda figured that was the reason for the slow xfer. i get the same speed over the network and with a patch cable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stanglx /forum/post/17001822


The net net is.. your network is most likely fine and your limiting factor is your hard drives. Try upgrading the drivers, turning on AHCI, enable write back cacheing in the Device Properties, etc. You will gain some but not that much.

and thats the other part, my htpc is win7 and gigabyte doesn't have all the drives for win7 out yet. i'm not 100% sure if i should try vista drivers either.
 

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There probly a perfectly good explanation for all of this ---


U should test your speed ONE PATH AT A TIME, meaning when measuring desktop -> laptop, for example, have everything else on the network not doing any communication. This will discount whatever ultimate bandwidth the switch is able to handle.


AND to discount hard disk bottleneck, transfer data RAMDRIVE to RAMDRIVE. This will certainly measure the ultimate limit of your network. What the heck is a ramdrive? a ramdrive is part of your memory, diguised as a disk drive, but much faster.


Ultimately, the network is probly not your problem, but the other components that are slowing things down.


Ethernet cables can go up to 100m, so your 25 FT is a non-issue.


If after all of this, u still think there is something wrong with the network, come back.
 

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Also something to think about

10MB/s is pretty close to max for 100mbps, I'd double check to see that it does have a gigabit nic. And then does your laptop have an N card, or is it just a G card?


The HTPCDesktop xfer @ 45bmps shows that the network is doing better than the 10MB/s from the laptop.


PATA 133 is still good enough for almost all physical HD's look at the perfomance of a raptor 120MB/s sustained reads, 90MB/s writes those easily fit on PATA 133 or gen1 SATA150, it's really only SSDs that need anyting >PATA and they really want 3rd gen SATA. And then the way the info snakes through your system isn't anything to worry about, the botteneck is almost surely at the drive spindle or a 100mb/s nic.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBobb /forum/post/17002586



AND to discount hard disk bottleneck, transfer data RAMDRIVE to RAMDRIVE. This will certainly measure the ultimate limit of your network. What the heck is a ramdrive? a ramdrive is part of your memory, diguised as a disk drive, but much faster.

I was just thinking about partitioning up a ram drive, last time I made one was back in like win 3.1


Can you still make one in vista/7?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBobb /forum/post/17002586


There probly a perfectly good explanation for all of this ---


U should test your speed ONE PATH AT A TIME, meaning when measuring desktop -> laptop, for example, have everything else on the network not doing any communication. This will discount whatever ultimate bandwidth the switch is able to handle.

when i did the speed tests, there was little to no other activity on the network. its just my 3 pc's and a 4th that was inactive at the time.


gonna check the drivers on the htpc, thats kinda where i'm thinking the issue is.


and i'm gonna assume that the 10MB/sec to the laptop limited due to the 5400rpm hd.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sotti /forum/post/17002609


Also something to think about

10MB/s is pretty close to max for 100mbps, I'd double check to see that it does have a gigabit nic. And then does your laptop have an N card, or is it just a G card?


iThe HTPCDesktop xfer @ 45bmps shows that the network is doing better than the 10MB/s from the laptop.


PATA 133 is still good enough for almost all physical HD's look at the perfomance of a raptor 120MB/s sustained reads, 90MB/s writes those easily fit on PATA 133 or gen1 SATA150, it's really only SSDs that need anyting >PATA and they really want 3rd gen SATA. And then the way the info snakes through your system isn't anything to worry about, the botteneck is almost surely at the drive spindle or a 100mb/s nic.

it is all over cat5e cable and 100% gigabit system. each OS is showing a 1.0 Gbps connection. the router is also gigabit ( belkin N+ router ). i went thru the settings to see if it some how got set to only 10/100 but can't find anything to change the setting. i'm assuming switching the default speed is not an option.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
aite, i installed the win7 drivers for the htpc and still getting the same speeds. os shows a 1 Gbps connection as well.


i can only guess that its the hd's that are slowing me down. files are xfered from sata to sata drives and find it hard to believe they could be the bottlenecks. is there a benchmarking software i can run to see?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bojangles139 /forum/post/17002832


and i'm gonna assume that the 10MB/sec to the laptop limited due to the 5400rpm hd.

That's close to 100 mbit/sec, I think ur expectation maybe a tad high.


I mean just because u got a gigabit network, u don't expect one single traffic to approach this new speed do ya? And that's good, because ethernet networks, even with switches is still a SHARED medium, so u certainly will see its benefit when u have multiple things/machines talking to each other. In fact if u get close to 1 gbit from desktop -> laptop, this means whenever these pairs are talking, everything else have to wait! (technically, not really, the pairs are slowed down in order for the other machines to have their turn).
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBobb /forum/post/17003191


That's close to 100 mbit/sec, I think ur expectation maybe a tad high.


I mean just because u got a gigabit network, u don't expect one single traffic to approach this new speed do ya? And that's good, because ethernet networks, even with switches is still a SHARED medium, so u certainly will see its benefit when u have multiple things/machines talking to each other. In fact if u get close to 1 gbit from desktop -> laptop, this means whenever these pairs are talking, everything else have to wait! (technically, not really, the pairs are slowed down in order for the other machines to have their turn).

wait, what?


10MB/sec = 80Mbps on a 1000Mbps network. how is that high expectation?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bojangles139 /forum/post/17003354


wait, what?


10MB/sec = 80Mbps on a 1000Mbps network. how is that high expectation?

Mhhhh how should I say this.....


OK, u got nice Mustang, drive on a U.S. highway, good day, no traffic, u can go 150 m.p.h b4r it starts to shake.


So u move to Germany, now your same car is on the autobanh, wow, no speed limit, super-smooth roads! But the same car still cannot go much more beyond the original 150 mph UNLESS u upgrade the car to a... Ferrari.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBobb /forum/post/17003396


Mhhhh how should I say this.....


OK, u got nice Mustang, drive on a U.S. highway, good day, no traffic, u can go 150 m.p.h b4r it starts to shake.


So u move to Germany, now your same car is on the autobanh, wow, no speed limit, super-smooth roads! But the same car still cannot go much more beyond the original 150 mph UNLESS u upgrade the car to a... Ferrari.


And that analogy is pretty good because the 5400rpm laptop can probably read at 40-50 megabytes a second, or 3-4x a 100mbps network, but he's not getting 3x4 throughput even though the speed limit's been raised (as is obvious where he's getting 45mbps other places)
 
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