[FenceMan]

Hello, everyone.
I know that the Radiance Pro power supply is switching power supply(12V 5A).
Has anyone ever changed the switching power supply to linear power supply?
Does linear power supply improve video quality for the Radiance Pro?
Do you have a suggestion for linear power supply brand?
Thank you for your help and support.

Keces P8 absolutely lowered the noise floor for audio especially on my Lumagen. Also piece of mind that your expensive video processor isn't connected to potential doom by only a $10 chinese power supply.

 

[Mike_WI]

Which aspect is handy - just knowing the power consumption?

I saw a thread on Head-Fi about Keces P8 that has some info.

 

[bobof]

Keces P8 absolutely lowered the noise floor for audio especially on my Lumagen. Also piece of mind that your expensive video processor isn't connected to potential doom by only a $10 chinese power supply.

The supply that Lumagen provide is a cut above your suggestion - it is certified to medical standards. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that it is probably better documented than the Keces product...

 

[FenceMan]

The supply that Lumagen provide is a cut above your suggestion - it is certified to medical standards. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that it is probably better documented than the Keces product...

You plug into that, I'll use the Keces.

 

[*Harry*]

Has anyone ever changed the switching power supply to linear power supply?
Does linear power supply improve video quality for the Radiance Pro?
Do you have a suggestion for linear power supply brand?

A year ago I'd measure the 12V input with my oscilloscope and it was w/o issue. In my opinion we got a very good power adapter and I do not think that a linear PS would have any benefit on digital processing. As linear supplies are uncommon these days, you hardly can find a very good old school 12V/5A (except laboratory PS devices) ... because good ones are massive and heavy.

What is your question based on exactly? Elimination of pixel problems or HDMI handshake problems?

 

[FenceMan]

The supply that Lumagen provide is a cut above your suggestion - it is certified to medical standards. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that it is probably better documented than the Keces product...

In fairness my bad experiences (multiple) all came with DVDO power supplies which look physically similar to stock Lumagen. I can believe you if you tell me Lumagen is built better...

 

[*Harry*]

wow - I haven't heard of the Keces P8 yet ... here in Germany you can't get it below 670 EUR ... are you guys serious that this PS is no overkill for a video processor? Well, in terms of linear audio I would agree, but not in aspect regarding digital processing.

 

[woofer]

Hello, everyone.
I know that the Radiance Pro power supply is switching power supply(12V 5A).
Has anyone ever changed the switching power supply to linear power supply?
Does linear power supply improve video quality for the Radiance Pro?
Do you have a suggestion for linear power supply brand?
Thank you for your help and support.

I am using the "Uptone" Audio" JS-2 ...... JS-2 Linear Power Supply

 

[jrp]

Hello, everyone.
I know that the Radiance Pro power supply is switching power supply(12V 5A).
Has anyone ever changed the switching power supply to linear power supply?
Does linear power supply improve video quality for the Radiance Pro?
Do you have a suggestion for linear power supply brand?
Thank you for your help and support.

People often ask me if a Linear Power Supply is a good idea. In short, yes, it can provide improvement. I have a few people who have switched to a Linear Power Supply and the feedback has been positive.

As I have discussed, HDMI jitter, and the electrical noise in the HDMI signal and back to the mains, can affect audio quality, and in some cases video quality.

I have discussed that lower-jitter can reduce the bit-error-rate of an HDMI signal. Lower HDMI clock jitter will also mean the de-jitter circuits in the audio processor start with a cleaner signal and so can send a lower-jitter signal to the DAC's. Lower jitter at the DAC leads to lower distortion in the audio. This can be heard, but how much is system dependent.

The linear power supply will act as a noise buffer between the Radiance Pro's high speed digital electronics and the mains. This noise reduction can improve the wall power going to the power amplifiers, and there is the possibility the lower noise floor may improve audio.

The Linear power supply also provides a cleaner, lower electrical-noise-floor power to the Radiance Pro itself. Noise floor can directly affect output jitter to some degree. Also a lower electrical-noise-floor in the Radiance Pro may mean a lower-noise-floor on the HDMI output injected in the the audio-processor and the projector/TV. A lower electrical-noise-floor can mean an improvement in the audio signal-to-noise ratio. For video a lower electrical-noise-floor for an analog display technology (DiLA and LCOS are analog at the display level) can reduce background noise in the image.

Note that I use "can" and "may" and "potentially" for these comments. I do this since any improvement is system dependent. You may not hear or see any improvement, but you might. I have heard some improvement form a linear supply for audio, but this is a subtle improvement. If you want the absolute best audio, then I believe you will be happy spending the money on an excellent "audio quality" linear power supply for the Radiance Pro.

I mentioned there is a chance that you might see a video improvement. However, if you do it would be subtle, and once again you may not see any improvement.

I wish I could be more adamant you will hear and see an improvement. Unfortunately any improvement is system and viewer/listener dependent. For those who want the best audio and video, I think a linear power supply for the Pro is a good investment. Just understand your mileage may vary.

I plan to purchase a Keces P8 12 VDC at 8 Amp single output supply (KECES) as soon as they come back in stock, for my testing here. There are other brands of high end linear power supplies that could also suit this application.

 

[Chris5]

I use a Farad Super3 for audio, very good.

 

[loggeo]

Which aspect is handy - just knowing the power consumption?

My original power supply burnt out. I also got a lot of drops. I decided to go with a purer solution of linear power and lower the noise floor.
I know it can be excessive, but I value my Lumagen Pro. That is not to say that anybody using a regular power supply cares less.
I was able to see what would happen to the power consumption when I had drops and how settings affect power drawing.

 

[bobof]

I was able to see what would happen to the power consumption when I had drops and how settings affect power drawing.

Out of interest, what did you find? I'm interested to know the numbers for different settings. It's obviously not very high consuming device at any settings though if 5A 12V is sufficient.

 

[giomania]

I have an EquiTech balanced power electrical sub panel, but am guessing that doesn’t improve the stock switching power supply.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[loggeo]

Out of interest, what did you find? I'm interested to know the numbers for different settings. It's obviously not very high consuming device at any settings though if 5A 12V is sufficient.

I can't recall my Lumagen going over 3.2-3.3A tbh. But there is a difference when outputing 1080p and 2160p of about (less actually) than 1A.
What was interesting is when I had drops, consumption fell to about 1A and then would go back up to regular.
Anyway, you tell me the settings I can tell you the consumption.

 

[bobof]

I can't recall my Lumagen going over 3.2-3.3A tbh. But there is a difference when outputing 1080p and 2160p of about (less actually) than 1A.
What was interesting is when I had drops, consumption fell to about 1A and then would go back up to regular.
Anyway, you tell me the settings I can tell you the consumption.

Cool, thanks. I guess when your dropouts were happening you were having a full reset through the HDMI chain causing processing to restart. Can see in some cases seeing the consumption could be pretty useful. (actually, at a much more detailed level, power analysis is often used to try and crack security systems as it can provide many clues about operation...!)

 

[riddle]

And whats this power supply? Lumagen Radiance 4444 / 4446 Pro PSU

 

[*Harry*]

Hi Jim:

I have discussed that lower-jitter can reduce the bit-error-rate of an HDMI signal.

Is it possible to display the BER counter in the Radiance Pro info screen? Ideally refreshed every few seconds ...
That could help to narrow down HDMI cable/link, or as discussed now, relationships to "12V quality" issues.

The linear power supply will act as a noise buffer between the Radiance Pro's high speed digital electronics and the mains. This noise reduction can improve the wall power going to the power amplifiers, and there is the possibility the lower noise floor may improve audio.

The Linear power supply also provides a cleaner, lower electrical-noise-floor power to the Radiance Pro itself. Noise floor can directly affect output jitter to some degree. Also a lower electrical-noise-floor in the Radiance Pro may mean a lower-noise-floor on the HDMI output injected in the the audio-processor and the projector/TV. A lower electrical-noise-floor can mean an improvement in the audio signal-to-noise ratio. For video a lower electrical-noise-floor for an analog display technology (DiLA and LCOS are analog at the display level) can reduce background noise in the image.

Complete understandable. I just have some doubts, that on seat position any real perceivable picture improvement will be given, if the Radiance Pro is the only one device in chain with a super clean linear PS, but all HDMI interfaces and electronic components inside the other units still being powered by its build-in switching power supplies.

I plan to purchase a Keces P8 12 VDC at 8 Amp single output supply (KECES) as soon as they come back in stock, for my testing here. There are other brands of high end linear power supplies that could also suit this application.

Please share your findings with us, especially in terms of video.

 

[audioguy]

At the risk of starting a mud throwing contest, any comparisons, short of side by side, should be done where the viewer does not know what option they are viewing (eliminates expectation bias).

 

[bobof]

At the risk of starting a mud throwing contest, any comparisons, short of side by side, should be done where the viewer does not know what option they are viewing (eliminates expectation bias).

Spoilsport!

 

[Mike_WI]

At the risk of starting a mud throwing contest, any comparisons, short of side by side, should be done where the viewer does not know what option they are viewing (eliminates expectation bias).

The supply that Lumagen provide is a cut above your suggestion - it is certified to medical standards. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that it is probably better documented than the Keces product...

A year ago I'd measure the 12V input with my oscilloscope and it was w/o issue. In my opinion we got a very good power adapter and I do not think that a linear PS would have any benefit on digital processing. As linear supplies are uncommon these days, you hardly can find a very good old school 12V/5A (except laboratory PS devices) ... because good ones are massive and heavy.

What is your question based on exactly? Elimination of pixel problems or HDMI handshake problems?

People often ask me if a Linear Power Supply is a good idea. In short, yes, it can provide improvement. I have a few people who have switched to a Linear Power Supply and the feedback has been positive.

As I have discussed, HDMI jitter, and the electrical noise in the HDMI signal and back to the mains, can affect audio quality, and in some cases video quality.

I have discussed that lower-jitter can reduce the bit-error-rate of an HDMI signal. Lower HDMI clock jitter will also mean the de-jitter circuits in the audio processor start with a cleaner signal and so can send a lower-jitter signal to the DAC's. Lower jitter at the DAC leads to lower distortion in the audio. This can be heard, but how much is system dependent.

The linear power supply will act as a noise buffer between the Radiance Pro's high speed digital electronics and the mains. This noise reduction can improve the wall power going to the power amplifiers, and there is the possibility the lower noise floor may improve audio.

The Linear power supply also provides a cleaner, lower electrical-noise-floor power to the Radiance Pro itself. Noise floor can directly affect output jitter to some degree. Also a lower electrical-noise-floor in the Radiance Pro may mean a lower-noise-floor on the HDMI output injected in the the audio-processor and the projector/TV. A lower electrical-noise-floor can mean an improvement in the audio signal-to-noise ratio. For video a lower electrical-noise-floor for an analog display technology (DiLA and LCOS are analog at the display level) can reduce background noise in the image.

Note that I use "can" and "may" and "potentially" for these comments. I do this since any improvement is system dependent. You may not hear or see any improvement, but you might. I have heard some improvement form a linear supply for audio, but this is a subtle improvement. If you want the absolute best audio, then I believe you will be happy spending the money on an excellent "audio quality" linear power supply for the Radiance Pro.

I mentioned there is a chance that you might see a video improvement. However, if you do it would be subtle, and once again you may not see any improvement.

I wish I could be more adamant you will hear and see an improvement. Unfortunately any improvement is system and viewer/listener dependent. For those who want the best audio and video, I think a linear power supply for the Pro is a good investment. Just understand your mileage may vary.

I plan to purchase a Keces P8 12 VDC at 8 Amp single output supply (KECES) as soon as they come back in stock, for my testing here. There are other brands of high end linear power supplies that could also suit this application.

And whats this power supply? Lumagen Radiance 4444 / 4446 Pro PSU

Interesting especially (to me) the unexpected jrp positive response about power supplies.

Is there such a thing as a power supply noise generator?
If defined noise types could be used as input and compared that might be helpful to show the thresholds and video our audio changes such noise would impart.
Will watch this.

For my HT setup I had a whole house surge protector and then a Surge-X at the HT rack.
My prior Panamax UPS (mainly for projector) had battery die and I pulled out of the system.

I would consider a Lumagen matching rack sized power supply. But wouldn't want to overspend on it.