AVS Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.
1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello all! I've been making some crazy steps into HD. I've exchanged sets at Best Buy 4 times! Samsung Slim, Sony xs955, Sony xbr960, and now the KLV-S32A10.


I loved the CRTs but they were HUGE and ALL had geometry problems. UGH. In my desperate plot to have a TV with sharp geometry I got the LCD.


The LCD is great. Small, sexy and with some coaxing it can do SD content pretty well. (It's no xbr960 in that area but serviceable) I do have a problem though. This is my first LCD TV and I have to tell you... Refresh rate is killing me. I understand this unit is supposed to have around 12ms and all I've read says that's a great speed to game with. With my Xbox though, the refresh is really getting to me.


Having a screen full of glorious detail is great, but when you lose that detail in a blurry movement, it all seems plain messy.


Is there something I am missing? Tons of people seem to game on LCD and few complain anymore.


-Is there some setting or anything I can do to help clear up this problem or at least help it?


-Is this totally normal even with a $2000 screen?


-Is the KDL-V32XBR1 supposed to be any better?


Thanks for any help guys!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,669 Posts
It depend what's causing the blurring. How do you have the Xbox hooked up? Is it going into the Component inputs? And, is the video in the Xbox Dashboard set to Progressive Scan?


Although a lot of what you describe can be caused by the panel, you could be talking about the Deinterlacing that's going on. Using Progressive Scan video will obviously get around the need for that.


The KDL-V32XBR1 is the latest model - I'd imagine they'll have made some improvements, yes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yes it's going component and yes the dash is in 420p. I've tested games in it's native res of 720p (Amped 2, Hulk Demo, Sims Busting Out) and they have the same problem: Blurry and sometimes jerky movement.


I'm hesitent to say it's the LCD's natural weakness, but to me it seems this level or blur would be upsetting to tons of gamers, not just me. I've been looking for some filter that's on by mistake or some optimization I can turn on.


This display is only a couple weeks old in the market so I was hoping it would be as fast as possible. I can't find any info on if the KDL-V32XBR1 is faster or if it's just like the XS and XBR CRT lines and simply has more imputs or toys with basically the same screen technology.


Any more imput would rule guys.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Also: I have cinemotion, black correction, and Noise Reduction off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,669 Posts
Jerky movement? That is very odd indeed. Of any problems an LCD can present, it shouldn't ever be dropping frames.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
What you are referring to is response time. Coming from CRT and moving to an LCD with a 12 ms response time, I immediately noticed the blurring that you are mentioning. I got used to it in no time but I still realize that the blurring is still there. You would probably even notice this with an 8 ms response time. Unfortunately, there are no LCDTVs that provide a response time on level with a CRT.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,323 Posts
I have the Westinghouse 37" 12ms connected through component and notice zero bluring on my monitor/TV. I did just change to componenet with the XBOX Hi Def pak and that really made a huge difference on cleaning up the picture as far as it being clear. But I notice no bluring at all.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by nascar24
I have the Westinghouse 37" 12ms connected through component and notice zero bluring on my monitor/TV. I did just change to componenet with the XBOX Hi Def pak and that really made a huge difference on cleaning up the picture as far as it being clear. But I notice no bluring at all.
All LCDTVs have blurring; you notice it when on-screen objects are in fast motion. Even though it may be subtle, it is clearly evident when transitioning from a CRT.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynn
Yes it's going component and yes the dash is in 420p. I've tested games in it's native res of 720p (Amped 2, Hulk Demo, Sims Busting Out) and they have the same problem: Blurry and sometimes jerky movement.
Does the jerky movement happen only in 720p games? It could be dips in framerate.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniels1994
Is there any blurring on fast action scenes when playing DVD's?
I find DVDs to be quite different, probably because of the 24 fps rather than 30 or 60 fps. Anyway, my experience with LCDTVs have shown that while games sometimes blur with small ghost trails behind on-screen objects, blurring in fast-action movie scenes is hardly noticeable where some details within on-screen entities can be a little more difficult to see.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSmith83
I find DVDs to be quite different, probably because of the 24 fps rather than 30 or 60 fps. Anyway, my experience with LCDTVs have shown that while games sometimes blur with small ghost trails behind on-screen objects, blurring in fast-action movie scenes is hardly noticeable where some details within on-screen entities can be a little more difficult to see.
This is exactly it. DVD's look great. Even high black ones like Sin City go without a hitch.


The main problem is the blur in games. Some games look great, but when you start moving fast it's a mess. I don't want to miss a shot from a helicopter at 115 mph because my $2000 TV can't keep up with me and leaves targets to be totally blurry.


I'm stuck in a rough spot too as the only other thing I can do is go to CRT again and start a battle with geometry again AND lose the ability to play in 720p. If there's nothing to do but get over the fact that it's there, I'm not sure how easy that will be for me.


I ADORE the clear and perfect picture on LCDs but can't stand the blur... There any hope at all in this situation? Hidden settings or anything? There an LCD that's fast enough to not have the prob?


Thanks a ton for your time!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by daniels1994
so the black levels great? sorry for being a pain
Seems to be yes. Older movies can be too dark with correction on. New stuff looks great.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,546 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Do connections have anything to do with it? Would say a VGA or HDMI connection (with X360) do better than component by demanding more or more directly controlling the screen?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynn
Do connections have anything to do with it? Would say a VGA or HDMI connection (with X360) do better than component by demanding more or more directly controlling the screen?
I find blurring to be equal across all connections (VGA, HDMI, and component). Give your set some more time and see if you can adjust to it. If not, you might want to try other LCDTVs, even though other expensive sets shouldn't be much better.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynn
Do connections have anything to do with it? Would say a VGA or HDMI connection (with X360) do better than component by demanding more or more directly controlling the screen?


Hey Cynn, how goes it? Well I know MSmith has the same set I have the Samsung LNR series. What MSmith is pretty much correct about the blurring, but there's something I need to pitch in. I use monster component cables for my xbox and have 480p,720p,1080i turned on in the dashboard as I'm sure you do as well. Here's the problem, 480p games look crappy almost across the board on a 720p native lcd. It's just the plain cold fact. But when I try all the 720p games on xbox there is a funny thing that happens. Most 720p games look really good, then when there is motion on CERTAIN 720p games there is a ever so slight blur like you describe. Amped 2 for instance has a very slight blur on the character when I move him back and fourth, but barely noticeable. I didn't notice any blurring on the Hulk demo. But there is a glimmer of hope.


I bought this lcd for the 360 mostly so when I saw a slight ghosting on a game or 2 in 720p I got a little bit worried. But then I put Soul Caliber 2 through a thorough test and I saw the light at the end of the lcd ghosting tunnel. I spent 2 to 3 hours testing Soul Caliber 2 with my nose an inch from the screen and every distance I could try and could not for the life of me find ANY ghosting or blurring that was happening in some other 720p games. So the verdict to me seems that hopefully if a game on the current xbox can run without blurring, than the 360 which is optimized for 720p will not have blurring. I'm starting to seriously believe that blurring lies some what on the game itself,in combination with hardware. Why else would there not be blurring on certain games?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,729 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by mukdweller
Hey Cynn, how goes it? Well I know MSmith has the same set I have the Samsung LNR series. What MSmith is pretty much correct about the blurring, but there's something I need to pitch in. I use monster component cables for my xbox and have 480p,720p,1080i turned on in the dashboard as I'm sure you do as well. Here's the problem, 480p games look crappy almost across the board on a 720p native lcd. It's just the plain cold fact. But when I try all the 720p games on xbox there is a funny thing that happens. Most 720p games look really good, then when there is motion on CERTAIN 720p games there is a ever so slight blur like you describe. Amped 2 for instance has a very slight blur on the character when I move him back and fourth, but barely noticeable. I didn't notice any blurring on the Hulk demo. But there is a glimmer of hope.


I bought this lcd for the 360 mostly so when I saw a slight ghosting on a game or 2 in 720p I got a little bit worried. But then I put Soul Caliber 2 through a thorough test and I saw the light at the end of the lcd ghosting tunnel. I spent 2 to 3 hours testing Soul Caliber 2 with my nose an inch from the screen and every distance I could try and could not for the life of me find ANY ghosting or blurring that was happening in some other 720p games. So the verdict to me seems that hopefully if a game on the current xbox can run without blurring, than the 360 which is optimized for 720p will not have blurring. I'm starting to seriously believe that blurring lies some what on the game itself,in combination with hardware. Why else would there not be blurring on certain games?
Hello mukdweller,

I agree with your Soul Calibur 2 statement. The funny thing is that after playing that game everything else seems to have much less accentuated blurring, I guess that I simply got used to it. I think Soul Calibur 2 is one of those games where you can't notice blurring because it has such vibrant colors and a seldom moving background. Either way whatever blurring there may be, the sharp, clear, and clean picture of LCD technology is excellent for HD gaming.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSmith83
Hello mukdweller,

I agree with your Soul Calibur 2 statement. The funny thing is that after playing that game everything else seems to have much less accentuated blurring, I guess that I simply got used to it. I think Soul Calibur 2 is one of those games where you can't notice blurring because it has such vibrant colors and a seldom moving background. Either way whatever blurring there may be, the sharp, clear, and clean picture of LCD technology is excellent for HD gaming.


I would like to rent one of the tony hawk games to see if I see any ghosting. I think most the tony hawk series is 720p. Back to your statement about fast moving backgrounds possibly causing ghosting, I'm not sure if that is the problem or not. The reason I say this is because if you just stand still on amped 2 and wiggle the stick back and fourth you can notice the ever so slight ghosting on your character, and there's no moving objects in the backgound. On the other hand I can crank the stick in all directions on Soul2 and not see one bit of ghosting. So I just don't know..... Well in any case I do know that I can't wait until my 360 gets into my game room!!


By the way MSmith, do you have xbox live? If you would like to play some time my GT is Bone Cell
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top