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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So, I bought the Acustimass (sp) 10 several years ago because it sounded decent and of course the name was well known. Truth is a friend bought some Klipsh speakers for a few hundered less and I thought they sounded as good if not better. Anyway, I figured that it was just an illusion since Bose were better from what I knew (very little actually) and I paid more.


Flash to the present and my getting a new reciever to replace an old Techniques. Since I bought a new LCD (Samsung 40" 530 (1080)) I wanted to go with the HDMI hookups. I have decided on the Pionner 1018 (sitting next to me in the box). After reading extensivley on these forums (mostly about the recievers) I have accepted that my original thoughts that Bose might not be the best were probably right...


So, now what? Bear with me, as I am pretty good at learing but still new to higher end Audio setups. From what I remember the Bose system has the 5 channel speaker outs into its qusi-sub. I assume it filters the lows out and then sends the rest off to the speakers.


So, what would your suggestions be for upgrading these? I would like to keep it in the 500$ range (would that allow for an "upgrade"?). I figure I would start with 2 bookshelves (would prefer small speakers with big sound) and a maybe powered sub. I could keep 2 of the Bose for the rears and I imagine the center. I guess I could use the Bose sub too but I am not sure how to wire it all up though. And of course the set up the Pio may be an issue all together. Another problem is I live in Alaska. To say supply up here is limited would be an overstatement! We have Best Buy but there stock is limited. Most likely I will be ordering online without being able to hear first (not ideal I know). Also, shipping is a killer. I saw some package deals for Polks I think for a 5.1 system for like 199$ but the shipping was $240!! So of course smaller is better.


I guess I am looking for some education as well as some recommendations. It will be used across the board from Blu rays, TV (occ via surround, usually i just use the TV though), and music. There seems to be a lot of knowledge on these boards and I am looking to open my horizons a bit beyond the Media and advertising monsters that mislead us. Thanks in advance!
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15427158


So, I bought the Acustimass (sp) 10 several years ago because it sounded decent and of course the name was well known. Truth is a friend bought some Klipsh speakers for a few hundered less and I thought they sounded as good if not better. Anyway, I figured that it was just an illusion since Bose were better from what I knew (very little actually) and I paid more.


Flash to the present and my getting a new reciever to replace an old Techniques. Since I bought a new LCD (Samsung 40" 530 (1080)) I wanted to go with the HDMI hookups. I have decided on the Pionner 1018 (sitting next to me in the box). After reading extensivley on these forums (mostly about the recievers) I have accepted that my original thoughts that Bose might not be the best were probably right...


So, now what? Bear with me, as I am pretty good at learing but still new to higher end Audio setups. From what I remember the Bose system has the 5 channel speaker outs into its qusi-sub. I assume it filters the lows out and then sends the rest off to the speakers.


So, what would your suggestions be for upgrading these? I would like to keep it in the 500$ range (would that allow for an "upgrade"?). I figure I would start with 2 bookshelves (would prefer small speakers with big sound) and a maybe powered sub. I could keep 2 of the Bose for the rears and I imagine the center. I guess I could use the Bose sub too but I am not sure how to wire it all up though. And of course the set up the Pio may be an issue all together. Another problem is I live in Alaska. To say supply up here is limited would be an overstatement! We have Best Buy but there stock is limited. Most likely I will be ordering online without being able to hear first (not ideal I know). Also, shipping is a killer. I saw some package deals for Polks I think for a 5.1 system for like 199$ but the shipping was $240!! So of course smaller is better.


I guess I am looking for some education as well as some recommendations. It will be used across the board from Blu rays, TV (occ via surround, usually i just use the TV though), and music. There seems to be a lot of knowledge on these boards and I am looking to open my horizons a bit beyond the Media and advertising monsters that mislead us. Thanks in advance!

Without getting into all the Bose bashing (which I have no doubt will follow), at least you've realized that Bose is primarily about marketing its name, and less about quality. However, the good news is, because of the same reasons you fell for it, the resale value on Bose products is fairly good. Because the cubes/acoustimass system is proprietary, and the crossovers are in the acoustimass module and are specific to the cubes, it would be a mistake to use any of the Bose speakers anymore. Try to sell off your system on eBay or Craigslist (forget audiogon; most of us that buy or sell on that site wouldn't touch Bose with a 10 foot pole). Then take your money and invest in the highest-quality pair of front speakers that you can afford. Look at internet-direct companies like AV123, SVS, HSU, Outlaw Audio, and others mentioned here. Many of those allow a 30-day in-home trial, but you may need to pay return shipping if you don't like them. Add on a sub, center, and surrounds as your budget allows.


You've seen the error of your ways, now you have a chance to make it right. Take your time, come here for advice/suggestions, and build yourself a system that will make you happy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I'll take a look at those you mentioned, thanks. I may just keep the Bose for my gym or garage, setup with the old reciever. If I eliminate the Bose entirely now it seems like I will not be able to find a comparable 5.1 system (starting from scratch) near my price range that would really be an "upgrade", or could I? Maybe I should wait until I have some more cash.


My plan was to buy two decent fronts. Then once finances allowed, get two better fronts and move the original purchases to the rear position. Not sure I can or should do that anymore. So what price range would get me a 5.1 system, yet still be a quality improvement over what I have? Any specific packages you'd recommend? I imagine the $500 mark for a 5.1 system is shy of what would be needed to see a noticable improvement, or not?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15428149


I'll take a look at those you mentioned, thanks. I may just keep the Bose for my gym or garage, setup with the old reciever. If I eliminate the Bose entirely now it seems like I will not be able to find a comparable 5.1 system (starting from scratch) near my price range that would really be an "upgrade", or could I? Maybe I should wait until I have some more cash.

You can, and obviously selling the Bose system would get you more cash. Do that first and then let us know what your real budget is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15428149


My plan was to buy two decent fronts. Then once finances allowed, get two better fronts and move the original purchases to the rear position. Not sure I can or should do that anymore.

That's a valid option, but even so it would be nice to know ahead of time how much you plan to spend in the long run. Planning is good, which is something people have been learning lately.


Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15428149


So what price range would get me a 5.1 system, yet still be a quality improvement over what I have? Any specific packages you'd recommend? I imagine the $500 mark for a 5.1 system is shy of what would be needed to see a noticable improvement, or not?

Here's a recent thread that resulted in several good suggestions in your price range (although it should be noted that speaker size was an important consideration):

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1101462


The Energy Take Classic 5.1 is a very safe choice, as it has been well regarded by many in the home theater community for years. However, if you can put up with larger bookshelf speakers, then for about the same cost you can build your own system based on the following components:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1138085354138
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/stf-2.html


The surprising Insignia NS-B2111 (which may be available at your local Best Buy) is a bargain for its level of quality, and the Hsu STF-2 sub will knock your socks off in comparison to the subs included with any of the small HT system packages (even the more expensive ones). This would be a rather cool system for its price tag, I must say.
 

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You can sell your Bose system for between $400 and $600 depending on condition. These are ebay researched prices. Because you are in Alaska you may not be able to get as much for it.


I would suggest, depending on your finances, you buy the front two speakers, sell your Bose and buy the center, rears and sub. Or buy the rear two, sell the Bose and then buy the front, center, and sub together. Work it out so you fold the Bose money back into your system, improve in increments if you need to.


A used pair of JBL L820s would make a great improvement over what you have now, but the best place to buy them, Harman Audio does not sell outside the 48. I'm sure you run into this all the time. You might contact them and see if they would be conducive to selling to you with an increased shipping price. Or perhaps someone you know could buy them for you and ship them to you.


There are plenty of individual sellers on ebay willing to ship to just about anywhere. You simply need to pay the shipping charges.


Whatever suggestions you get here will in all likelihood be a drastic improvement over the Bose speakers you now have. All you need to do is wade through all the suggestions and find something that fills the bill for you.


Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks you both for the more specific suggestions and links.


Robert - I had looked at the HSU stuff based on the prior suggestion. They have that STF-2 sub in a package with the "ventrilquist 6" speakers as surrounds ("performance 2" - hsuresearch.com/packages.html (won;t let me paste URL due to my low post count)). Any thoughts on how those would compare with the insignias? (I like that they are somewhat smaller too - but wouldn't want to lose out too much in quality just for a small footprint)


You think these would have a noticable difference over the Bose?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15427158


I saw some package deals for Polks I think for a 5.1 system for like 199$ but the shipping was $240!! So of course smaller is better.

Check out Amazon. They sell some great brand named speakers that offer free shipping. I have had a few thing shipped here to Hawaii for free. As an example, I purchased my plasma stand and it weighed a little over 100 lbs shipped. And Amazon picked up the tab on shipping, and I had it at my door step in 3 or 4 days via UPS, Gotta lv that Big River Co.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429044


Thanks you both for the more specific suggestions and links.


Robert - I had looked at the HSU stuff based on the prior suggestion. They have that STF-2 sub in a package with the "ventrilquist 6" speakers as surrounds ("performance 2" - hsuresearch.com/packages.html (won;t let me paste URL due to my low post count)). Any thoughts on how those would compare with the insignias? (I like that they are somewhat smaller too - but wouldn't want to lose out too much in quality just for a small footprint)


You think these would have a noticable difference over the Bose?

I think that going the insignia route will just leave you wanting more. Insignia speakers would be fine for a garage or exercise room, but not your main setup. Start with some strong towers from an Internet only company, and then add a sub, then a center, and then your surrounds as you get the cash to support building a decent setup. Throwing some hodge podge mess of low end speakers together will just result in you being in the same spot you are now in a short amount of time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Sorry for the rapid fire questions...


How would the Energy take 5 system compare to the HSU (ventriloquist) system? Circut city has the T5 system for $499 and from the quote says they'll ship it for $60 (the problem with shipping up here is most will only do it second day air. Thats why it cost a fortune. There are a few places that will do ground. Takes longer but major savings if they will).


Thoughts about those two? At this point I am thinking hard about the Take 5 system. Then once I move to the bigger house and resave some cash I can invest in two nice fronts and a better sub.


How does that sound? Seems from what I've read these will open up some of the mid's vs the Bose. Do you agree I will get a noticable improvement? I can drop $550, but not much more. (oh yeah, and FWIW, the living room area these are used in is only about 12x14).


ANother newbiw question (since Bose had all this). Assuming I go with the Take 5 (from Circut city), what type of speaker wire do you recommend (I read in the review they will not accept large gauge wire) and what do I need to get to hook up the sub (sorry for novice questions)?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429044


Robert - I had looked at the HSU stuff based on the prior suggestion. They have that STF-2 sub in a package with the "ventrilquist 6" speakers as surrounds ("performance 2" - hsuresearch.com/packages.html (won;t let me paste URL due to my low post count)).

The Hsu Ventriloquist system has gotten good reviews, but while I haven't auditioned it myself, I'm always suspicious about speakers that don't have tweeters (just full-range drivers), and I'm not wild about the idea of crossing over the satellites at 280 Hz (or whatever it is) to a larger center speaker. The resulting audio may be pleasing enough, but it's farther from what's actually in the soundtrack than I would prefer (i.e. sounds coming from the center speaker when they should be coming from other speakers).


For comparison, the Energy Take Classic 5.1 betters this system and most others of its class in this respect--using tiny speakers no less--but then you're stuck with the packaged subwoofer, which is OK but no competition for Hsu's subwoofers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429044


Any thoughts on how those would compare with the insignias? (I like that they are somewhat smaller too - but wouldn't want to lose out too much in quality just for a small footprint)

The Insignias have their limitations, but like any decent bookshelf speaker they should produce a more detailed, fuller sound than something like the Ventriloquist system, especially at the non-center positions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429044


You think these would have a noticable difference over the Bose?

Yes, but I suspect that's mainly because of the center speaker reproducing frequencies that are either missing in Bose systems or poorly reproduced by the bass module. Otherwise, the system is a lot like Bose systems, and the satellites may not sound much better on their own. Of course, any sub from Hsu would blow away Bose's bass module, but let's see if we can help you find better speakers than these.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmrowe /forum/post/15429095


I think that going the insignia route will just leave you wanting more. Insignia speakers would be fine for a garage or exercise room, but not your main setup. Start with some strong towers from an Internet only company, and then add a sub, then a center, and then your surrounds as you get the cash to support building a decent setup. Throwing some hodge podge mess of low end speakers together will just result in you being in the same spot you are now in a short amount of time.

Well, that certainly could happen, so this is a fair warning based on the experiences of many here. I had suggested the Insignias because I was trying to fit a fairly impressive subwoofer into a fairly limited budget, they're good for what they cost (in terms of soundstage, imaging, and dynamics, even if they lack high-end detail, refinement, and resonance characteristics), and might be available locally. I don't know whether IPT is going to become much pickier about audio quality over time, and it's all relative anyway, as most of us will upgrade eventually no matter where we start out.



It certainly would be helpful to have an idea of how much money one would be willing to spend over time, as opposed to just right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429186


Sorry for the rapid fire questions...

That's OK--apparently, I have nothing better to do than answer them while waiting for the new year to begin.


Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429186


How would the Energy take 5 system compare to the HSU (ventriloquist) system? Circut city has the T5 system for $499 and from the quote says they'll ship it for $60 (the problem with shipping up here is most will only do it second day air. Thats why it cost a fortune. There are a few places that will do ground. Takes longer but major savings if they will).

To recap, the Energy system is better in terms of speaker quality, since they are all two-ways and can be crossed over to the sub at 120 Hz (or maybe a bit lower). However, the Hsu package has a much better sub, hands down. This is why I would rather buy the speakers and sub separately based on whatever budget you specify--it gives you more options for better overall quality and value.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429186


How does that sound? Seems from what I've read these will open up some of the mid's vs the Bose. Do you agree I will get a noticable improvement? I can drop $550, but not much more. (oh yeah, and FWIW, the living room area these are used in is only about 12x14).

They both would be a noticeable improvement, but at the same time neither seems like a very long-term investment because of significant limitations. I'll mull over your situation and come back with additional suggestions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429186


ANother newbiw question (since Bose had all this). Assuming I go with the Take 5 (from Circut city), what type of speaker wire do you recommend (I read in the review they will not accept large gauge wire) and what do I need to get to hook up the sub (sorry for novice questions)?

In my opinion, just use any old 14 AWG copper wire if that will fit (otherwise use 16 AWG, which should be adequate for any length that you would ever have to use in this room). The sub will require an electrical outlet and a standard audio cable with RCA plugs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks for the input. Afraid the sale would end (in 15 mins here anyway) I dropped the bomb and went with the Energy setup. I figure if nothing else the SW will help a lot verse the Bose. Hopefully I will see a little more mid range stuff too. I can move the Bose to the gym.


Down the road I can make another investment in some more serious fronts and a better sub. By then hopefully I will be in a new house with more room and I can be a little more ambitious about the setup. Hopefully I can spend a little more (maybe a grand?) on just the main three (2 fronts and a better sub) and use the Energy 5's to create a 7.1 system.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429461


Thanks for the input. Afraid the sale would end (in 15 mins here anyway) I dropped the bomb and went with the Energy setup. I figure if nothing else the SW will help a lot verse the Bose. Hopefully I will see a little more mid range stuff too. I can move the Bose to the gym.

Well, like I said, it's a safe choice--regarding quality, it will improve on the Bose system in every way. It won't go as loud or sound as big as the Insignia speakers/Hsu subwoofer system I had suggested, but it should be enough for your current home theater room, and the surround speakers will be easier to mount. This is a very nice system from a reputable company--enjoy!


Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429461


Down the road I can make another investment in some more serious fronts and a better sub. By then hopefully I will be in a new house with more room and I can be a little more ambitious about the setup. Hopefully I can spend a little more (maybe a grand?) on just the main three (2 fronts and a better sub)

I was actually going to alternatively suggest that you start out with a pair of Ascend Acoustics CMT-340 SEs because they happen to be on sale right now--$70 off plus free domestic shipping (if Alaska is considered domestic) for a grand total of $498--and they fit within your current budget. Those who are rather serious about two-channel stereo may prefer to have large tower speakers that they can listen to without a subwoofer, but since you plan to use a subwoofer anyway, it would be more optimal to invest in the highest-quality large bookshelf or "mini-tower" speakers that you can afford. I'm a big fan of Ascend speakers myself, but there certainly are other worthy contenders for your wallet.
Enjoy your new system for the time being, and we'll eventually see what the future holds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15429461


and use the Energy 5's to create a 7.1 system.

That sounds like a plan, although unfortunately your receiver only has a single subwoofer crossover frequency that applies to all speakers (I believe), so some compromises will have to be made in the future (many people have to deal with this issue without losing too much sleep over it, so I think you'll be alright).


I should also point out that in home theater, it's usually the center speaker that gets the heaviest use and has the greatest effect (or is the main limitation) on the quality of presentation. We're all accustomed to thinking of the "fronts" or "mains" as the left & right front speakers only, which is obviously true in two-channel stereo playback, but in home theater it's the center first, followed by the left & right speakers (may be equal to the center sometimes depending on how a soundtrack is mixed), followed by the left & right surrounds, and finally the back surrounds; the subwoofer is a separate issue, but is usually considered just as important as the center (or even more so if you're a bass-head like many are
). Having a small center speaker (relative to the left & right fronts) means that a system is geared more toward the reproduction of 2.0- or 2.1-channel music than home theater. While there's nothing wrong with this, if you eventually want to raise your home theater experience to the same level, you'll need a center speaker that matches or exceeds the capabilities and quality of your left & right fronts. I'm not trying to drive you to bankruptcy
, I'm just telling it like it is so that you can budget and select components accordingly.


Good luck, and let us know how you're doing with the Energy system when you set it up.
 

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Tell your bose speakers that your going to the lake. Pull over and leave them on the side of the road then drive away before they chase you. +1 for upgrading from blows speakers though. Lots of good suggestions so far. Ill throw in a vote for psb b25 bookshelves that you can find good deals on from saturdayaudio exchange. A good budget sub would be a BIC H100. retails for about 250 with free shipping.
 

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Having read the really "sound" advice here, I still would recommend that you

don't run out and buy any of the suggested speakers here...listening is always a personal experience. That you tired of a Bose system is not a matter of being "suckered" in, but an educational experience. Don't beat yourself up. You could have tired of any number of speakers as you honed into your personal taste. Use the advice here to make an audition list with the final decision yours.

Be prepared to feel a need for change in later years as well. Everyone's hearing (and tastes) changes over time.
 

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IPT...I think you will enjoy your Take 5 system. I bought a take 5.2 system back in 2002 and still enjoy using this system very much. I am in the process of replacing them for some monitor audio RS6 (and its corresponding centre speaker) but I will keep my energy satellite speakers for the surround and use the 2 front satellite speakers as rear surround for a 7.1 system. Don't feel bad about the Bose, I learned alot coming to this site as well and always believe (in the past) that Bose was the "creme de la creme", so you were not alone. I think you will truly enjoy the sound of the take 5 system. The only think I recommend (and not sure what your room will look like) but try to put your subwoofer in the front with your sattelite speakers. Mine is in the back of the room and find that when I am listening to 2 channel music, the sound is AMAZING in the sweet spot where I set my system but if I move closer to the front of the room, the sub seems to fade away and don't have a well balanced sound.


Best of luck and happy listening!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thanks for all the info and ideas everyone. This place rocks. I will keep the info about the center and sub in mind. I didn't ever really give them that much thought but I am seeing that is apparently a mistake. Live and learn, live and learn. I'll let you'll know how the setup goes. Should get them next week.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
"a single subwoofer crossover frequency that applies to all speakers"


Can someone please elaborate on this (obviously I am new to this stuff)? My uneducated guess is that means the reciever has a filter that channels stuff at a specific frequency to either the mains or the sub (based on if it is above or below the pre set "crossover"). Is that even remotely close to what that means? What would another way a reciever handles this?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT /forum/post/15434602


"a single subwoofer crossover frequency that applies to all speakers"


Can someone please elaborate on this (obviously I am new to this stuff)? My uneducated guess is that means the reciever has a filter that channels stuff at a specific frequency to either the mains or the sub (based on if it is above or below the pre set "crossover"). Is that even remotely close to what that means? What would another way a reciever handles this?

Basically, you can set each class of speaker (e.g. Center, Front, Surround) in the system to be either "Large" or "Small" to reflect their ability to reproduce the bass content of their respective channels. Actual size is not important--Large simply means that a speaker (or set of speakers) can reproduce the entire bass range and Small simply means that it cannot. In practical terms, the receiver will filter out all of the bass below a specified crossover frequency from speakers set to Small, and reroute this bass into the subwoofer output, combining it with the bass from all of the other Small speakers as well as the LFE channel (which is boosted by 10 dB). This process is known as "bass management," which is intended to ensure that as much of the bass content is actually reproduced as possible, as well as to ease the strain on speakers to help keep the sound clean. Speakers that are set to Large skip this process and receive the full-bandwidth signals of their respective channels, whether they can reproduce all of the bass content or not. If a system does not have a subwoofer, then the front or main speakers must be set to Large, and they will receive all of the bass taken out of the Small speakers (this is how passive subwoofers are utilized, by the way). If all speakers are set to Large, then no bass management will take place. In most receivers, it is also possible to optionally send all of the collected bass content to both the subwoofer and the mains (if set to Large), but I think that's kind of nutty.


In typical home theater systems that have a powered subwoofer, which is most of them these days, ALL of the speakers, including large towers, should be set to Small because with rare exceptions they really can't reproduce the lowest frequencies--that's what the subwoofer is for. On a side note, you won't believe how much crap I got for saying blasphemous things like this back in the "early" days of home theater, and now it's common practice.
"My towers--my beautiful, gleaming towers--are LARGE, dammit! NOT pitifully small--beautifully LARGE, and that's how I'll set them in the receiver, by thunder!"
Something like that.



Anyway, the crossover frequency--the dividing line (actually a pair of opposing slopes) between what goes to the subwoofer and what stays in the speakers' audio channels--is fixed in some receivers (mostly old ones) and adjustable to some degree in others (newer ones). The best frequency to use depends in part on how low in frequency your speakers can go before their output dwindles. Generally, the lower the crossover frequency the better because higher frequencies are more easily localizable by the human ear, allowing people to detect sounds coming from the direction of the subwoofer, and you don't want the subwoofer reproducing the high bass range anyway because it will be relatively sloppy (obviously, it's designed to reproduce very low frequencies). In the case of movie theaters, typically a crossover of 80 Hz (the de facto industry standard) is used, as frequencies below 80 Hz are thought to be extremely difficult to localize. I and many others also use a crossover frequency of 80 Hz in our home theaters, and some people even go lower if their speakers can handle it. Systems with smaller satellites must be used with higher frequencies so that they can overlap with the subwoofer's range without losing audio. The Energy Take Classic 5.1, for example, should work fine with a crossover frequency of 120 Hz, which isn't too bad.


For comparison, the Bose satellites go no lower than 280 Hz, and the system manages to leave a gap anyway to show how well designed it is.
That's pretty bad--you get some muddy dialogue coming out of the bass module sometimes, as well as some missing audio all of the time. While the Hsu Ventriloquist's satellites are similarly limited, this system has a large, somewhat higher quality center speaker that covers the range from 80 Hz to 280 Hz so that the subwoofer doesn't have to. That's why it sounds better than the Bose system (aside from the subwoofer), but as you can tell by now, some localizable sounds that should be coming from the satellites come from the center instead. That's why it's called the Ventriloquist
, but I'd rather just have better satellites, myself.


Alright, now that you hopefully have an understanding of bass management, we can look at the issue of having speakers of different capabilities all using the same subwoofer crossover frequency (this is the issue to which I referred previously). If after upgrading your mains you stick with 120 Hz to fully accommodate your small Energy surround speakers, then that would be kind of a partial waste of having larger and better mains. And if you choose to lower the crossover frequency, then you would be opening a gap between what the surrounds can reproduce and what the subwoofer is reproducing for them. Frankly, I'm not sure how people usually handle such a dilemma. One way would be to buy a receiver that allows several different crossover frequencies to be specified, such as one for the center, one for the mains, and one for the surrounds. Another would be to buy larger surround speakers that can handle the same crossover frequency as the mains (if only barely). I detest dealing with such issues and others related to using different speakers (e.g. imaging, soundstage, panning, etc.), so I just use the same model of speaker all around.
Maybe when the time comes to upgrade, you could compromise a bit with a subwoofer crossover frequency of 100 Hz or something like that, which wouldn't be so bad.


I hope that I answered your questions somewhere along the way.
 

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Robert: thanks for the detailed explanation of crossover frequency.


This newbie is also looking to upgrade from my Bose setup, having just upgraded my AVR to an Onkyo 806 (from the older TX-DS555). Currently, I have 4 301's,a center (VCS-10), and no subwoofer. Curiously enough, it sounded better/fuller (read: bassier) when connected to my old Onkyo.


One of the threads I read talked about NHT Classic Three's. Do you guys concur? For the same price range, any other suggestions? I, too, will be using mainly for blu ray movies (50%), TV (30%) and gaming (20%). I appreciate your time and info. Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Robert - that's awesome. Thanks for taking the time and giving such a detailed answer. It made things much clearer for me.


I just want to clarify something from the last paragraph you wrote..


"If after upgrading your mains you stick with 120 Hz to fully accommodate your small Energy surround speakers, then that would be kind of a partial waste of having larger and better mains. And if you choose to lower the crossover frequency, then you would be opening a gap between what the surrounds can reproduce and what the subwoofer is reproducing for them."


So, if I understand you correctly the satalites do not reproduce stuff below 120hz (or 115hz according to the Energy website)? Thus if I got more tower like speakers that had a lower "frequency response" number, like 80hz, then the gap would be noticed on the surround (Take 5) speakers (from 80-115hz)?


One more, if I might. Looking at the Energy website I see the rather pricey V2.2i Bookshelf Speaker's frequency response is 40-20,000 hz. Assuming I had four of those, and a good sub would the crossover then be best set to 40hz?


Thanks again for mentoring us newbies
Hopefully this thread will be useful to many. Your last post should be archived or something, it was very descriptive and helpful.
 
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