[Drew_W]

 http://www.crestron.com/press_room/p...elease_id=1341


Seems like Crestron 'released' the app in September, but here we are in January and I can't find the thing on the iTunes store. Has it actually been released? ETA?

 

[GoGo Delicious]

Hi Drew,

Not yet.

 

[Drew_W]

Bummer. Do you happen to know of an ETA or do I need to get on the horn with Crestron on Monday?

 

[emcgrath]

Aha! That PROVES that HAI is better than Crestron. ;-)

Check out [email protected] in Itunes store.

Think we could get this thread up to 7 pages?.......

 

[SweetSpot]



Quote:
Originally Posted by emcgrath /forum/post/15521033


Aha! That PROVES that HAI is better than Crestron. ;-)

Check out [email protected] in Itunes store.

Think we could get this thread up to 7 pages?.......

There are already iPhone/iPodTouch control apps for Crestron developed by 3rd parties.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Drew_W /forum/post/15518612


Bummer. Do you happen to know of an ETA or do I need to get on the horn with Crestron on Monday?

It's supposed to be released in Jan'09 I believe.

 

[ks-man]

Is the app something that the Crestron programmer will have to set up (and spend a decent amount of time programming) or is it going to be pretty much plug (or download) and play?

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by ks-man /forum/post/15609950


Is the app something that the Crestron programmer will have to set up (and spend a decent amount of time programming) or is it going to be pretty much plug (or download) and play?

Your dealer will have to install it. It's the same as adding another touch panel. You will have to pay your dealer, BUT the app is FREE. Be happy you do not have Control4. Control4's iPhone app is $300.00 per iPhone, PLUS dealer install.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15610377


Be happy you do not have Control4. Control4's iPhone app is $300.00 per iPhone, PLUS dealer install.

And you think this is more expensive than a Crestron programmer adding a new touch panel to a program? I'd bet they come out to about the same.


BTW, the Crestron app is free, but it doesn't do anything by itself. It's simply a framework that will read in an XML file to build the buttons and their locations.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15612221


And you think this is more expensive than a Crestron programmer adding a new touch panel to a program?

It sure is!

The Control4 APP is $300.00 PER iPHONE PLUS dealer install of say $75.00. For a total of $375.00.

Now, we will be charging our clients $175.00 to install and configure the iPhone app on for their Crestron system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15612221


I'd bet they come out to about the same.

Like I said Control4's iPhone app is more expansive than Crestron iPhone/Touch solution. Control4's solution is MORE than DOUBLE of that for a Crestron iPhone/iPod Touch install when you take into account the cosy for dealer install.


If a Client has 2 or more iPhones or iPod Touches your looking at $600.00 or more JUST for the app from Control4.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15613324


Now, we will be charging our clients $175.00 to install and configure the iPhone app on for their Crestron system.

That is a little ambiguous. What does that mean? Is this so the ipod can control the room its in? Will it switch to operate any room? Please define the parameters of what $175 gets you.


I haven't actually done the Control4 IPOD interface yet, but if its like any other Control4 touch interface, a dealer will not actually need to install it. The IPOD will find the processor automatically. Once its connected, it will control any room in the house just by changing rooms, regardless of how the room is configured.


Unless you've made a huge reusable frame work for Crestron, which most people have not, you wont be getting that kind of functionallity for $175.00.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15614155


That is a little ambiguous. What does that mean? Is this so the ipod can control the room its in? Will it switch to operate any room? Please define the parameters of what $175 gets you.

It depends on what the client wants. Since we did the system programming for our clients we can easily configure it for one room or whole house since all of our clients already have at least one TP that handles whole house control.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15614155


I haven't actually done the Control4 IPOD interface yet, but if its like any other Control4 touch interface, a dealer will not actually need to install it. The IPOD will find the processor automatically. Once its connected, it will control any room in the house just by changing rooms, regardless of how the room is configured.

You need to educate yourself before you start talking. Here you are 100% WRONG. You do need a dealer to install it. Call any Control4 dealer and ask.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15614155


Unless you've made a huge reusable frame work for Crestron, which most people have not, you wont be getting that kind of functionallity for $175.00.

It's obvious you do not know a thing about Crestron programming. As I have stated above, all of our clients have at least 1 TP that can control the whole house. You can base the iPhone programming off that. You do NOT need to reprogram/reinvent the system.


Your lack of knowledge on Control4 and Crestron shows. You should have the facts before you spew non-sense.


As I stated before, Control4's iPhone app is more expensive than Crestron iPhone/Touch solution and that a FACT.


Control4's solution is MORE than DOUBLE of that for a Crestron iPhone/iPod Touch install when you take into account the cosy for dealer install. Also, if a Client has 2 or more iPhones or iPod Touches your looking at $600.00 or more JUST for the app from Control4.


I also got to thinking, the price I said we would do this for was $175.00 and that is for a remote install where we do not need to make a onsite visit. Remote access/web access is free for Crestron clients but for Control4 customers in order for you or your dealer to have remote/web access to your system, you have to subscribe to Control4's "4Sight" service which is $99 PER YEAR. Now, if a Control4 client does not have "4Sight" service they have to subscribe and pay an additional $99.00 PER YEAR in order to allow their dealer to log in remotely. So $99.00+$300+$75=$474.00. I am basing the $75.00 installation on the presumption that the Control4 client HAS 4Sight service. If a client does not have a "4Sight" subscription and the dealer HAS to drive out to the location the install will probably be higher.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15614390


You need to educate yourself before you start talking. Here you are 100% WRONG. You do need a dealer to install it. Call any Control4 dealer and ask.

Well I just check my Books Open email on the matter. That must make me a...yes a Control4 dealer. The Customer registers the license through their MyControl4 portal and the dealer simply enables it in the program. So no, a site visit is not necessary. 4sight allows for remote programming. Some dealers would charge for this. I'd wager a lot will do it gratis as part of the Control UI sale, as I would.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15614390


It's obvious you do not know a thing about Crestron programming. As I have stated above, all of our clients have at least 1 TP that can control the whole house. You can base the iPhone programming off that. You do NOT need to reprogram/reinvent the system.

So your current whole house TP is a 3.5" panel that needs excessive navigation drill down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15614390


Your lack of knowledge on Control4 and Crestron shows. You should have the facts before you spew non-sense.


As I stated before, Control4's iPhone app is more expensive than Crestron iPhone/Touch solution and that a FACT.

I just checked the Crestron beta folder to see if VTProe 3.9.16.01 Beta or Toolbox had iPod tools yet. Wait, that must make me a certified programmer.

What is your 'whole house' TP? Is it a large panel? If so, how can you say this will map down to the iPhone without reprogramming? Are you also providing a magnifying glass with that $175? The Crestron framework isn't even on iTunes yet. Do you have an Apple Enterprise Developers license to bypass App Store? How do you even know what the capabilities of Crestron's framework will be? I just went through my notes from Masters Class about the iPhone/Touch product and it's pretty limited on info. Do you have the VTProe Alpha that supports this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15614390


Control4's solution is MORE than DOUBLE of that for a Crestron iPhone/iPod Touch install when you take into account the cosy for dealer install. Also, if a Client has 2 or more iPhones or iPod Touches your looking at $600.00 or more JUST for the app from Control4.

You can repeat and place emphasis with CAPS all day long, it won't be true as FACT. Maybe its true for your installs, but it most certainly will not be true for a lot of Crestron dealers. C4 navigators all work the same for every C4 processor. It is simply not the case with Crestron since every programmer programs GUI differently while Control4 is always the same.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15614390


I also got to thinking, the price I said we would do this for was $175.00 and that is for a remote install where we do not need to make a onsite visit. Remote access/web access is free for Crestron clients but for Control4 customers in order for you or your dealer to have remote/web access to your system, you have to subscribe to Control4's "4Sight" service which is $99 PER YEAR. Now, if a Control4 client does not have "4Sight" service they have to subscribe and pay an additional $99.00 PER YEAR in order to allow their dealer to log in remotely. So $99.00+$300+$75=$474.00. I am basing the $75.00 installation on the presumption that the Control4 client HAS 4Sight service. If a client does not have a "4Sight" subscription and the dealer HAS to drive out to the location the install will probably be higher.

Have you ever set up a Control4 system before? The 4sight service is worth every penny. There is no need to configure any port forwarding on your router, or worry about DDNS. I would happily eat the cost for a year than deal with the head ache of being pulled off one job to go change something small on another. Again, you might have your installs down to where its a quick and easy job to add the iphone, but you cant speak for the entire Crestron community, which is what you are doing in essence.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


Well I just check my Books Open email on the matter. That must make me a...yes a Control4 dealer. The Customer registers the license through their MyControl4 portal and the dealer simply enables it in the program. So no, a site visit is not necessary. 4sight allows for remote programming. Some dealers would charge for this. I'd wager a lot will do it gratis as part of the Control UI sale, as I would.

Even if you do not charge a fee for install your Control4 client still has to pay $300.00 for the iPhone app +$99.00 per year for 4Sight, IF they do not have 4Sight already.


Let me ask you this. If your client does not have 4Sight and does not want to pay $99 per year for it are you going to charge him/her to go out and configure their system for FREE? I doubt it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


So your current whole house TP is a 3.5" panel that needs excessive nagivation drill down?

You need to learn how to read. NO WHERE in my posts, regarding the cost of Control4 vs Crestron iPhone app, did I EVER mention that my current whole house TP is a 3.5". What does that have to do with anything

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


What is your 'whole house' TP? It it a large panel? If so, how can you say this will map down to the iPhone without reprogramming?

A quick lesson. A "Digital Join" on a 8X, 4L, 4X or any Crestron TP will always be mapped to the same logic. For example, if "Digital Join 1" is mapped to "Volume_Control_Up" on a 8X. Then on every TP the "Digital Join 1" is "Volume_Control_Up". It's called consistency. I have personally added TP's to EXISTING Crestron installs I have done in as little as 20 min on average about 30-40 min.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


Are you also providing a magnifying glass with that $175? The Crestron framework isn't even on iTunes yet. Do you have an Apple Enterprise Developers license to bypass App Store?

I actually do. I also own one of the largest Xserve management companies in the US. We colocate and manage Xserve for some of the largest companies (Fortune 100) in the US. But thats a TOTALLY separate company and has nothing to do with this discussion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


How do you even know what the capabilities of Crestron's framework will be? I just went through my notes from Masters Class about the iPhone/Touch product and it's pretty limited on info. Do you have the VTProe Alpha that supports this?

If that is TRUE then your whole argument is in valid because you would understand that it does not take much to add a TP to and existing Crestron system. Also, let me clarify "Existing Crestron System". When I say "Existing Crestron System" I am talking about a system we installed and programmed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


Maybe its true for your installs, but it most certainly will not be true for a lot of Crestron dealers.

I NEVER said ALL dealers some dealers or even "a lot". UNLIKE you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615141


I'd wager a lot will do it gratis as part of the Control UI sale, as I would.

Maybe its true for your installs, but it most certainly will not be true for a lot of Control4 dealers. Sound familiar ? ? ?


Here are the Control4 FACTS. Tell me which one is NOT true.

1) Control4 iPhone app costs $300 PER iPhone/iPod Touch

2) Requires Control4 Dealer install.

3) Control4 Remote/Web Access, to allow C4 dealers access to clients system, runs $99.00 PER YEAR.

At MINIMUM it will run a Control4 client $300.00.

If they do not have 4Sight then $399.00

If their dealer charges for install (say $75.00) $474.00

All of the ABOVE are facts.


Crestron Facts.

1) iPhone app will be FREE.

2) Requires Dealer Install @175.00 THIS IS OUR CHARGE ONLY

3) Crestron Remote/Web Access, to allow Crestron Dealers access to clients system is FREE.


It will cost our Crestron clients $175.00 for a iPhone install where as it will cost your Control4 Clients $300.00 minimum and can be as high as $474.00


Again, If you do not charge a fee for a iPhone app install your Control4 client still has to pay $300.00 for the iPhone app + $99.00 per year IF they do not have 4Sight. Also, if your client does not have 4Sight and does not want to pay $99 per year for it are you going to charge him/her to go out and configure their system for FREE or for that matter give them 4Sight access for free?

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615240


Have you ever set up a Control4 system before?

Yes I have. In fact I also had Composer Pro. I use to program Control4 a long time ago (LONG STORY). Here is a screen shot of it running in Parallels on my Mac. See image below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615240


The 4sight service is worth every penny.

OMG that is a WHOLE separate thread on how the cost of 4Sight is a rip off. It should be free.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615240


Again, you might have your installs down to where its a quick and easy job to add the iphone

We do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615240


. . . .but you cant speak for the entire Crestron community, which is what you are doing in essence.

I never spoke for the entire Crestron Community. All I said is the iPhone app is $300.00 plus dealer install, where as Crestron's is Free. Actuallly what I said is

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/0


Your dealer will have to install it. It's the same as adding another touch panel. You will have to pay your dealer, BUT the app is FREE. Be happy you do not have Control4. Control4's iPhone app is $300.00 per iPhone, PLUS dealer install.

You are the one speaking for the Control4 Community.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15615240


I'd wager a lot will do it gratis as part of the Control UI sale, as I would.

Below is the image of Composer Pro running on my Mac under Parallels.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15615654


You need to learn how to read. NO WHERE in my posts, regarding the cost of Control4 vs Crestron iPhone app, did I EVER mention that my current whole house TP is a 3.5". What does that have to do with anything

You completely missed the point. Unless you are using a 3.5" screen for Whole House already, simply adding an iPod to do the same Whole House Functions will not map out like you say. Again, what TP are you using for Whole House? If its a large panel, are your buttons just really big or have you designed an intuitive layout that favors a large panel. Because just shrinking it down to a small screen like the IPOD is not doing anyone a favor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15615654


A quick lesson. A "Digital Join" on a 8X, 4L, 4X or any Crestron TP will always be mapped to the same logic. For example, if "Digital Join 1" is mapped to "Volume_Control_Up" on a 8X. Then on every TP the "Digital Join 1" is "Volume_Control_Up". It's called consistency. I have personally added TP's to EXISTING Crestron installs I have done in as little as 20 min on average about 30-40 min.

Thanks for schooling me Nick. I had no idea it worked that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15615654


I actually do. I also own one of the largest Xserve management companies in the US. We colocate and manage Xserve for some of the largest companies (Fortune 100) in the US. But thats a TOTALLY separate company and has nothing to do with this discussion.

Now that is irrelevant to the discussion unless you're telling me that you actually have your hands on some Crestron IPOD tools and have developed your intefaces already.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15615654


If that is TRUE then your whole argument is in valid because you would understand that it does not take much to add a TP to and existing Crestron system. Also, let me clarify "Existing Crestron System". When I say "Existing Crestron System" I am talking about a system we installed and programmed.

You answered the question from ks_man and unless his 'existing crestron system' was put in by you, how can you tell him he should be happy it will be less than Control4? You don't know how much someone else will be charging.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15615654



Here are the Control4 FACTS. Tell me which one is NOT true.

1) Control4 iPhone app costs $300 PER iPhone/iPod Touch

2) Requires Control4 Dealer install.

3) Control4 Remote/Web Access, to allow C4 dealers access to clients system, runs $99.00 PER YEAR.

At MINIMUM it will run a Control4 client $300.00.

If they do not have 4Sight then $399.00

If their dealer charges for install (say $75.00) $474.00

All of the ABOVE are facts.


Crestron Facts.

1) iPhone app will be FREE.

2) Requires Dealer Install @175.00 THIS IS OUR CHARGE ONLY

3) Crestron Remote/Web Access, to allow Crestron Dealers access to clients system is FREE.

I'll tell you which one is not true, and its the same one you've been hammering on this whole time, while being wrong about it. #1 is wrong. The Control4 app, like the Crestron app, is completely free while you keep saying it's $300. Both are free to download and install, but both will not do anything without some kind of assistance from a dealer. The C4 dealer must sell you a $299 license, and the Crestron dealer must spend labor on integrating the interface into the system which may or may not cost more than $300. It all depends on whose doing it.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15618138


I'll tell you which one is not true, and its the same one you've been hammering on this whole time, while being wrong about it. #1 is wrong. The Control4 app, like the Crestron app, is completely free while you keep saying it's $300. Both are free to download and install, but both will not do anything without some kind of assistance from a dealer. The C4 dealer must sell you a $299 license, and the Crestron dealer must spend labor on integrating the interface into the system which may or may not cost more than $300. It all depends on whose doing it.

Ok I will correct myself.


Here are the corrected Control4 FACTS. Tell me which one is NOT true.

1) Control4 iPhone app from the Apple Store FREE

2) License from Control4 to use the FREE iPhone App $300 PER iPhone/iPod Touch

3) Requires Control4 Dealer install.

4) Control4 Remote/Web Access, to allow C4 dealers access to clients system, runs $99.00 PER YEAR.

At MINIMUM it will run a Control4 client $300.00 for licensing.

If they do not have 4Sight then $399.00

If their dealer charges for install (say $75.00) $474.00

All of the ABOVE are facts.


Crestron Facts.

1) iPhone app from the Apple Store FREE.

2) License from Crestron to use the iPhone , unlike Control4, license is FREE.

2) Requires Dealer Install @175.00 (THIS WHAT WE WILL CHARGE OTHER Crestron dealers may charge MORE or LESS)

3) Crestron Remote/Web Access, to allow Crestron Dealers access to clients system is FREE.


Either way slice it or dice it Control4's iPhone license is STILL more expensive. You personally can not install a licensed Control4 iPhone app for less than $300.00 MINIMUM. Where as I will be able to install the Crestron licensed iPhone app for a Crestron Client for $175.00?


Bottom line fact is that Control4 charges a licensing fee for the app $300.00 Crestron doesn't.


As far as your quote below

Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15618138


You answered the question from ks_man and unless his 'existing crestron system' was put in by you, how can you tell him he should be happy it will be less than Control4? You don't know how much someone else will be charging.

You have NO idea about ks_mans situation or his system. It's not my place to comment about it either. But, what I said to ks-man was the following . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/0


Your dealer will have to install it. It's the same as adding another touch panel. You will have to pay your dealer, BUT the app is FREE. Be happy you do not have Control4. Control4's iPhone app is $300.00 per iPhone, PLUS dealer install.

Notice I NEVER said it was going to be less expensive than Control4. Notice I DID say "You will have to pay your dealer".

All I did was compare the price. Control4's Licensing of $300.00 to Crestrons Licensing of $0.00 PLUS installation on on both sides.

 

[TouchToBegin]



Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15618765


Notice I NEVER said it was going to be less expensive than Control4.

So you were implying that he should be happy he doesn't have Control4 for another reason? I missed that, sorry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoGo Delicious /forum/post/15618765


Bottom line fact is that Control4 charges a licensing fee for the app $300.00 Crestron doesn't.

This is 100% true. People should know though that the $300 equals instant whole house action, no matter who the dealer/programmer is while with Crestron its only cheap if the original programmer/integrator performs the task and even then only if they planned for it. That's a blanket statement about Crestron, of course there are exceptions to this.

 

[GoGo Delicious]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TouchToBegin /forum/post/15619058


So you were implying that he should be happy he doesn't have Control4 for another reason?

I only mentioned one. There are way to many reasons to list and this is not the proper thread.