[Billie]

For those who want high end speakers at bargain price, read this...

http://www.iar-80.com/page103.html

 

[NKOTB]

That gave me a headache...

 

[DJ_JonnyV]

Yeah, I agree. Even though I have an Evolution setup in my main system, and love to read good reviews about them (who doesn't about their equipment?), that article was starting to get annoying real quick. Whoever wrote it must've been trying to use every fancy word in the dictionary.

 

[John Robert]

Not sure how much credibility I would put in a review from a website that advocates "Von Gaylord Legend" interconnects at $975 per 1m pair...


John

 

[quadriverfalls]

Geesh...... What a LOAD of C***. That guy must have been paid by the word. I've NEVER seen anyone so verbose and stuck on themselves.


I'll give him credit for one thing though.... I'm gonna run right down to my HT system immediately and see if my drivers are mis-behaving. If they are.... I'm going to send them to the 27 HZ corner!

 

[drew1021]

Whoever wrote that needs to go back to English class! I agree it was quite painful to read, I got through the first paragraph and that was it.

 

[NKOTB]

I thought it was well written for an academic, but even dissertations are kind enough to include an abstract and summary findings... Yeah, I from the Readers Digest/ Cliff's notes generation... What can I say? In short, I was strongly considering the M6's for my own new set-up. Now, I perceive them as fundamentally flawed, with a set-up work-around, that if done to precision, yields great sound for one listener. I'm just not that selfish in my HT. I think I'll take a speaker that has flaws that I don't know about and sounds about the same for all my friends - my ignorance will be my bliss.

 

[tonygeno]

Quote:

Originally posted by NKOTB In short, I was strongly considering the M6's for my own new set-up. Now, I perceive them as fundamentally flawed, with a set-up work-around, that if done to precision, yields great sound for one listener. I'm just not that selfish in my HT. I think I'll take a speaker that has flaws that I don't know about and sounds about the same for all my friends - my ignorance will be my bliss.

You would actually make a decision on a speaker purchase based on that review? Wow.

 

[NKOTB]

Well, it has changed my perception, a bit... And you know, like it or not, perception is reality on the showroom floor. I do recognize there may be little legitimacy to it, but that was an awful lot of effort, with balanced complements, just to smear a speaker/company. I do like the speakers... I just listened to them last week. I'll probably go back this week and listen again - to hear the noise, and to share the article with the dealer so he's prepared to respond to it - such as it presents itself. And if nothing else, to flip them & toe em' in @ 20 degrees, so I can experience sonic nirvana ;-). By the way, lesser reviews have swayed more expensive decisions than mine. I will corroborate with my own ears further before ultimately deciding.


David

 

[Billie]

Quote:

Originally posted by NKOTB I thought it was well written for an academic, but even dissertations are kind enough to include an abstract and summary findings... Yeah, I from the Readers Digest/ Cliff's notes generation... What can I say? In short, I was strongly considering the M6's for my own new set-up. Now, I perceive them as fundamentally flawed, with a set-up work-around, that if done to precision, yields great sound for one listener. I'm just not that selfish in my HT. I think I'll take a speaker that has flaws that I don't know about and sounds about the same for all my friends - my ignorance will be my bliss.

---i thought this article give some people some knowledge about speaker design(if one inclines to learn)...yeah, it is so damn long and more like a speaker course than review. all in all, i think the review agrees that the nht evo's are great speakers at bargain price.

 

[NKOTB]

Could be...

 

[tonygeno]

Here are the final three paragraphs of the above mentioned review:

Quote:

Then, when you finally factor in the low price of the Evolution system, you have here an outstanding bargain, making the Evolution a strongly recommended loudspeaker system for anyone on a budget. It's especially recommended for those of you who like a mellow loudspeaker sound (you could easily make the M6 brightly aggressive instead, but that creates other problems, such as foreign spurious colorations and degraded spatial imaging). The W1 subwoofer also merits special recommendation as a very good general purpose subwoofer for use with other brands of satellites. Because the price of the W1 and X1 is so low, you can easily afford to put multiples of the W1 all around your room (even one at each satellite location), which will give you much better bass than the merely one or two more expensive competing subwoofers that you could get for the same total cost. Our hope here is that NHT could introduce a slightly modified X1 crossover that would have a gentle corner at 27 Hz and a user defeatable option for its subsonic filter, in order to allow you to hear the W1 at its true intrinsic best capability. It's rare to find such thoughtful, thorough engineering in a loudspeaker system, even among the ranks of perfectionist high end loudspeakers, and NHT deserves special praise for giving you all this sophisticated engineering at such a bargain price.

The reviewer's (J. Peter Moncrieff, I assume) frame of reference is multi-kilobuck systems. The operative words here are "high-end" and "budget". This, to me, is a rave. Chacun a son gout.

 

[John Robert]

"Chacun a son gout"


"Each to his own taste" for you non-academics...

 

[Alimentall]

Quote:

Originally posted by NKOTB Now, I perceive them as fundamentally flawed, with a set-up work-around, that if done to precision, yields great sound for one listener. I'm just not that selfish in my HT. I think I'll take a speaker that has flaws that I don't know about and sounds about the same for all my friends - my ignorance will be my bliss.

Get over it. ALL speakers are fundamentally flawed, some more than others. Ignorance isn't bliss, it leads to excessive spending on electronics, cabling, room correction etc trying "eliminate" or compesate for those flaws you didn't know about. There are $100K/pr speakers that are fundamentally flawed. The flaws in the Evolution speakers are easy to live with and don't annoy or cause reckless spending on electronics or costly placebos.


Or you could just buy Bose - that's the poster speaker for the "ignorance is bliss" crowd.

 

[Tex-amp]

Quote:

Originally posted by NKOTB Well, it has changed my perception, a bit... And you know, like it or not, perception is reality on the showroom floor. I do recognize there may be little legitimacy to it, but that was an awful lot of effort, with balanced complements, just to smear a speaker/company. I do like the speakers... I just listened to them last week. I'll probably go back this week and listen again - to hear the noise, and to share the article with the dealer so he's prepared to respond to it - such as it presents itself. And if nothing else, to flip them & toe em' in @ 20 degrees, so I can experience sonic nirvana ;-). By the way, lesser reviews have swayed more expensive decisions than mine. I will corroborate with my own ears further before ultimately deciding. David

You could look at Ascend Acoustics since The $ensible Sound's review that compared them to the M6 and found them very close except at high volume. I'd think stepping up to the new 340 from Ascend would take care of that is still be half the price of the M6s. I just got the 340s and the step up from the 170s I've had for two years is impressive.

 

[Alimentall]

He also thought the M6s were as good as speakers that cost $5500/pr, so I guess there's just no differences between speakers any more.

 

[tonygeno]

Quote:

Originally posted by Tex-amp You could look at Ascend Acoustics since The $ensible Sound's review that compared them to the M6 and found them very close except at high volume. I'd think stepping up to the new 340 from Ascend would take care of that is still be half the price of the M6s. I just got the 340s and the step up from the 170s I've had for two years is impressive.

It's very dangerous to do an if A is almost equal to B then C is which better than A will be better than B comparisons when it comes to sound. The Ascend 340 is a very different design than the M6 (2-way vs 3-way, ported vs sealed among others). The best thing to do is listen and decide which one you prefer and whether that preference is worth the extra money (if you prefer the more expensive speaker).


Re the Sensible Sound, I would take any of Ferstler's reviews with several tons of salt for the A vs B vs C reason among others.

 

[tonygeno]

Quote:

Originally posted by Alimentall Get over it. ALL speakers are fundamentally flawed, some more than others. Ignorance isn't bliss, it leads to excessive spending on electronics, cabling, room correction etc trying "eliminate" or compesate for those flaws you didn't know about. There are $100K/pr speakers that are fundamentally flawed. The flaws in the Evolution speakers are easy to live with and don't annoy or cause reckless spending on electronics or costly placebos. Or you could just buy Bose - that's the poster speaker for the "ignorance is bliss" crowd.

Joel: what do you think about the alternative positioning/wiring that the article proposed? I've never thought the M6 sounded bright, but I've often wondered what the M6 would sound like with the tweeter outboard. I'll have to give it a try.

 

[NKOTB]

Al,


"Get over it. "


--Luckily, I am over it.


"ALL speakers are fundamentally flawed, some more than others."


--You are correct, they are all "flawed" in one way or another...



"Ignorance isn't bliss, it leads to excessive spending on electronics, cabling, room correction etc trying "eliminate" or compensate for those flaws you didn't know about."


--I'm not so sure which is more blissful, not knowing and being happy, or knowing and spending resources in a pursuit, that at some point, renders diminishing returns - don't get me wrong, I do it too, In fact the M6's may, in that light, be a better choice - since we now know all the "issues" and can most efficiently address them - But then what would we do? Be happy?


"There are $100K/pr speakers that are fundamentally flawed. The flaws in the Evolution speakers are easy to live with and don't annoy or cause reckless spending on electronics or costly placebos.


--True... Maybe so... Hopefully I won't notice the "noise" when I listen to them again, lest I be reckless and placeboed.


" Or you could just buy Bose - that's the poster speaker for the "ignorance is bliss" crowd."


True... I hadn't thought about that... No! Alas, I cannot. As my particular "bliss" is comprised of an accepted measure of ignorance AND the belief that, with enough information, I can adequately evaluate strengths and weaknesses and choose the bundle of compromises that are most acceptable to me. You never know... I may find I like resonance @ the noted frequency... ;-) It would be interesting to set them up as described and see what new basket of compromises we end up with.


Better yet, if there is any merit to the findings, NHT could maybe engineer the "issues" away, and sell them as the perfect, non-DSP'd, infinitely flexible speaker - But then they would have to stop calling them the Evolutions & call them something like Analog Perfection... (nice ring to it)


Really ya'll, can I get a hug now?


David

 

[Alimentall]

Quote:

Originally posted by tonygeno Joel: what do you think about the alternative positioning/wiring that the article proposed? I've never thought the M6 sounded bright, but I've often wondered what the M6 would sound like with the tweeter outboard. I'll have to give it a try.

I suppose I could try it. I don't think it makes sense and would guess that it would widen the soundstage, but would make for a dip in the upper mid/lower treble and probably sound a little "phasey" and weird. I imagine you'd have to be exactly between the speakers too.