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Lots of recent posts about 4K stick matching frame rate to content. I just wanted to point out that it's not just the content, but the streaming app has to support frame rate matching. Would be great if the stick could simply detect the content stream and match framerate, regardless of app.
I agree that this would be great. But on the other hand I also think that Amazon really did their best to encourage app developers to implement frame rate matching. They added a global switch for it in the system settings. There is no one available on Android TV. I guess Amazon thought that this way apps could add support for frame rate matching without the need to provide an option to enable/disable it within their own apps. Like they would have to do on Android TV, because there has to be a way to turn it on or off somewhere. As you can’t force frame rate matching upon all users as a default.

But unfortunately Amazon wasn’t rewarded for their effort. Maybe because app developers don’t want to have a separate Fire TV version of their app, but just use the same one as on Android TV. But in my opinion the app developers and Google (not providing a global switch in the Android TV settings) are more to blame here than Amazon.
 

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Anyone notice imdb quality on the fire stick 4K? I was watching knight and day with Tom Cruise and Cameron Diaz. The airplane scene was coming in at 9 megabits per second and it was hevc. 1080p. Has a very high bitrate for 1080p material. Looked very good. I didn't try the IMDb app on any other device so I don't know if the results would be the same.

Just sharing.

-T
 

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Anyone notice imdb quality on the fire stick 4K? I was watching knight and day with Tom Cruise and Cameron Diaz. The airplane scene was coming in at 9 megabits per second and it was hevc. 1080p. Has a very high bitrate for 1080p material. Looked very good. I didn't try the IMDb app on any other device so I don't know if the results would be the same.

Just sharing.

-T
No, haven't noticed, but good to know. How are you checking the bitrate and codec?
 

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No, haven't noticed, but good to know. How are you checking the bitrate and codec?
I was using the advanced options menu.

To get to that, hold down the select button for one second. then, while still holding down the select button, press the down button for 3 seconds. Release both buttons and press the menu button.

Then select advanced options from the pop-up menu. So you can also select x-ray to see how the stick is performing.

-T
 

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I was using the advanced options menu.

To get to that, hold down the select button for one second. then, while still holding down the select button, press the down button for 3 seconds. Release both buttons and press the menu button.

Then select advanced options from the pop-up menu. So you can also select x-ray to see how the stick is performing.

-T
As an alternative in case you have trouble with the key sequence, which some folks report having, you can dl and install the “Developer Tools Menu” app from the Amazon App Store.
 

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Lots of recent posts about 4K stick matching frame rate to content. I just wanted to point out that it's not just the content, but the streaming app has to support frame rate matching. Would be great if the stick could simply detect the content stream and match framerate, regardless of app.
I suspect the reason they don't do it this way is because you would perpetually miss the beginning of every single video. The system has no way of knowing the frame rate of the video until the video actually starts playing. Most TVs take a few seconds to sync to a new HDMI format.

A properly coded app can pull the headers of the video and set the correct framerate before actually starting playback. Roku uses the approach you're suggesting and it suffers from the problem I outlined. You also have other issues such as HDMI losing signal and resyncing all the time as commercials of various FPS begin and stop. Can get annoying very quickly on the Roku.

Amazon just needs to tighten their app approval process to force developers to implement correct framerate and color space switching. Those with enough leverage like Netflix will probably refuse to implement it anyway but that's on them. People need to complain to the content providers, not Amazon.
 

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I suspect the reason they don't do it this way is because you would perpetually miss the beginning of every single video.
Then just don't start displaying the stream until the stream comes in is analyzed, and framerate matched. A simple buffer should accomplish this. You would have a few seconds of black screen or spinning circle before the video starts playing from the beginning. Nothing would be missed.
 

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That's not how the APIs work. There are DRM issues. You also can't just buffer the data internally at the OS level without the apps control or you would have terrible input lag on remote control trick play. As a developer who deals with these issues I can assure you that having the app control it is the correct approach. You need to see Rokus implementation to see the pros/cons of that dumb implementation. This is why Netflix explicitly blacklisted their Roku app from this feature soon after it was added to the Roku OS. With their constant previews, trailers, etc. all switching framerates as you navigated the UI, it was a ****show. I do wish Roku had left it enabled in some advanced hidden menu for those who wanted to experiment. Also I believe Netflix eventually added account options to disable the auto playing videos so the feature would be less annoying today. Ideally Netflix would update their apps on all platforms to use the provided framerate switching APIs as they have done for Apple.
 

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Yes, app control would be better, but the solution I mentioned is theoretically possible (not familiar with all the limitations). Perhaps Roku's implementation was poor and it could be done better. Perhaps my recollection is poor, but I believe I've read that Nvidia Shield owners have no issues with framerate matching, regardless of app.
 

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Perhaps my recollection is poor, but I believe I've read that Nvidia Shield owners have no issues with framerate matching, regardless of app.
Unfortunately this is not the case. There is no gobal frame rate matching feature on the Shield TV. To quote myself from another thread:
There is an API on Android TV that allows apps to switch display modes. A few apps like Kodi or Plex use it to adjust refresh rate. But most apps, including the apps from all major streaming services, don’t support it. So using this apps you will get whatever is set as display mode in your Shield‘s settings.

So if you want to match frame rate on the Shield, you can adjust refresh rate manually by going to the Display settings or use one of those “hacks”:

- Nvidia’s frame rate matching beta feature

- The refresh rate app created by a Shield owner

- Or Kodi, if the video service you want to use is also available as a Kodi add-on. This will probably give you the best experience regarding automatic frame rate matching. But even if there is an add-on, there might be limitations. So things like 4K/HDR/DV/Atmos that are available with the dedicated app, might not be supported (yet) by the add-on.
The mentioned API is the same as on Fire TV, as FireOS is based on Android. And apart from Kodi, both other "solutions" won't work without issues in all apps, sometimes they don't work at all. So in the end, we are stuck in the same situation on Shield TV: As long as app developers don't implement support for frame rate matching within their apps, all "hacks" that try to do some sort of global switching on Android will stay a faulty mess.

Maybe you were thinking about Apple TV, which has probably the best implementation of frame rate matching, that also works in almost all major streaming apps (including Netflix). But even on ATV apps can decide to not support it. So for example the Youtube app on ATV does not. In addition, ATV only supports non-integer refresh rates, so it can do 23.976Hz but not 24Hz.

So the sad truth is that there is not one streaming device out there where frame rate matching will "just work" without issues and on all apps. But I have little hope that this will ever change in the future.
 

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For those unaware, you can force the FireTV into a 23.976 Hz mode globally via adb or via the remote backdoor (hold rewind and up buttons). You could in theory do this before starting an app that will stream 23.976 fps content. It looks like it only enumerates 23.976, 50.000, 59.940, and 29.970 so the less common non-broadcast timings like 24.000, 30.0000, and 60.000 will not be selectable with this method.
 

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For those unaware, you can force the FireTV into a 23.976 Hz mode globally via adb or via the remote backdoor (hold rewind and up buttons). You could in theory do this before starting an app that will stream 23.976 fps content. It looks like it only enumerates 23.976, 50.000, 59.940, and 29.970 so the less common non-broadcast timings like 24.000, 30.0000, and 60.000 will not be selectable with this method.
In this secret resolution menu on FTV, I've only seen integer-based refresh rates, namely 24 Hz, 25 Hz, 30 Hz, and 60 Hz. Are you saying these are actually non-integer refresh rates?
 

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In this secret resolution menu on FTV, I've only seen integer-based refresh rates, namely 24 Hz, 25 Hz, 30 Hz, and 60 Hz. Are you saying these are actually non-integer refresh rates?
I think these refresh rates are dependent on the display device. I get different options on a FTV4K on my 1080p Projector than I do on a FTV4K connected to my TCL 4K TV display. If I recall I get integer based rates on my 1080p projector and non-integer based options on TCL 4K display.
 

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This is interesting, but very odd.
Yes, and as ATV owner who sees those frame drops caused by this, it's very frustrating. There is a whole thread about this issue.
In this secret resolution menu on FTV, I've only seen integer-based refresh rates, namely 24 Hz, 25 Hz, 30 Hz, and 60 Hz. Are you saying these are actually non-integer refresh rates?
I'm pretty sure that the resolution cycling will only go through the non-integer modes. Unfortunately many devices show 24/30/60Hz on sceen, although it's actually 23.976/29.970/59.940Hz. One of the reasons many people don't even know that there is both out there.

But you can verify yourself if you enable the "System X-Ray" overlay in the developer tools menu:

This overlay will show you many informations, including the current display mode. The overlay will also distinguish between integer and non-integer rates (shown with 2 decimals). And if you also enable the "Advanced options" an additional window will pop up during video playback, where you can see infos like resolution and frame rate of the current video stream.

So the developer tools can be quite useful in some cases, and if you want a more comfortable way to bring them up, you can install this little app on your FireTV:
Amazon.com: Developer Tools Menu Shortcut for Fire TV: Appstore for Android
 

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Yes, and as ATV owner who sees those frame drops caused by this, it's very frustrating. There is a whole thread about this issue.

I'm pretty sure that the resolution cycling will only go through the non-integer modes. Unfortunately many devices show 24/30/60Hz on sceen, although it's actually 23.976/29.970/59.940Hz. One of the reasons many people don't even know that there is both out there.

But you can verify yourself if you enable the "System X-Ray" overlay in the developer tools menu:

This overlay will show you many informations, including the current display mode. The overlay will also distinguish between integer and non-integer rates (shown with 2 decimals). And if you also enable the "Advanced options" an additional window will pop up during video playback, where you can see infos like resolution and frame rate of the current video stream.

So the developer tools can be quite useful in some cases, and if you want a more comfortable way to bring them up, you can install this little app on your FireTV:
Amazon.com: Developer Tools Menu Shortcut for Fire TV: Appstore for Android
If you want to see the actual received stream data then you need to turn on “Advanced Options” rather than “System X-Ray”. It is the second toggle down when you open the Developer Tools Menu app. Just be aware that the Advanced Options overlay does not appear until you start playing something.
 

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For those unaware, you can force the FireTV into a 23.976 Hz mode globally via adb or via the remote backdoor (hold rewind and up buttons). You could in theory do this before starting an app that will stream 23.976 fps content. It looks like it only enumerates 23.976, 50.000, 59.940, and 29.970 so the less common non-broadcast timings like 24.000, 30.0000, and 60.000 will not be selectable with this method.
Thank you!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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If you want to see the actual received stream data then you need to turn on “Advanced Options” rather than “System X-Ray”. It is the second toggle down when you open the Developer Tools Menu app. Just be aware that the Advanced Options overlay does not appear until you start playing something.
Well, yes ... that's what I said. ;)
And if you also enable the "Advanced options" an additional window will pop up during video playback, where you can see infos like resolution and frame rate of the current video stream.
 

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Well, yes ... that's what I said. ;)
Sorry, I should have explicitly stated that my comment was not directed at you but at others reading these posts. I can’t tell you how often folks misinterpret that Sytem-X-ray overlay....honestly there should be a big caution note right above the overlay...🤣
 

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Sorry, I should have explicitly stated that my comment was not directed at you but at others reading these posts. I can’t tell you how often folks misinterpret that Sytem-X-ray overlay....honestly there should be a big caution note right above the overlay...🤣
No problem ... my post was long, so I thought you might have just missed it. :)

Yes ... there can be some confusion. So again (and not directed at you ;)) ...

System X-Ray: Current HDMI display mode of the device (including refresh rate)

Advanced options: Information about the current video/audio stream (including frame rate)
 
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