AVS Forum banner

4741 - 4760 of 29198 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
315 Posts
As Im very new to using HDR 4K films, I need some help with my NX9 please. ..... However Im not sure how to set the screen size for HDR, can someone help me please... Nigel

I have a Stewart Studio Tek 130 microperf curved scope screen of 145" diag. I use an Isco IIIL lens on a cineslide.

....

Is it just Picture Tone we move for a larger screen or do we also have to adjust dark/bright levels?
The manual also has settings for Tone, dark/bright levels for setting gamma when clipping point is 400, 1000, 2000, 4000nits, do I set for this or just leave it?

Your MP Screen has a bench-marked gain of 1.17 in the middle dropping to probably a little over 1.0 in the extreme corners due to the angle of view. However its a curved screen so you will have less drop off than a flat screen would. I would round that to 1.15 for the purpose of setting screen size. The lens also complicates things. so I would use your 16:9 size and assume that the scope size is much the same ballpark brightness (is it in SDR?) At the end of the day I would try +3 probably.

From my playing about, and this is not definitive yet, the adjuster is the same brightness changes as setting picture tone in manual. if you have a film that auto mapping has set to 0 and you use +3 then +3 picture tone seems to matches brightness. However I have found that the manual set tone map with the same settings as auto with picture tone = auto tone + adjustment has more contrast so this is not 100% the same thing.

Dark level seems to control the black clip point (I actually tried this with test patterns) 0 = 64.
White level seems to control the white clip point 0 = 2000. but I havn't had time to verify this.
Picture tone raises the gamma.

Setting the auto tone adjustment too high will result in a lose of saturation in the same way as using 2.2 vs 2.4 for SDR does; set this to the point where this does not happen. Note that it is currently fashionable for movies to be shot dark, even SDR version are dark and HDR could be a bit darker by intention. This makes setting this difficult, but do not immediately try to exactly match against the SDR version, the grading can be substantially different, but it should be ballpark in bright scenes.

most discs should be fine out of the box; and most titles that are missing metadata work ok with defaults for 1000nits. For a professional presentation I would be setting a manual tone map personally using the auto tone map values as a start point and setting at least the black clip point and picture tone to match brightness. White clip point is far less visible and very hard to set as there may only be a few seconds where it is hit if at all.

Remember, none of what I have said is definitive, this is my initial observations after 15 or so movies.

Edit: in HDR brightness levels in theory should all match from source and the tone mapping is just an optimization setting correct clip points from the media and using more or less compression above difduse white. However the reality is different. there are BADLY MASTERED discs out there where the brightest point is lower than the SDR version and aso discs which are super bright.

Most titles are OK; but you will be manually setting stuff from time to time even with auto mapping.

Same thing happens with SDR where some discs have raised black floor
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,795 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
315 Posts
What is the group's feeling regarding the video quality on the NX7/9 when comparing UHD/HDR movies via the physical Blu-Ray versus streaming from iTunes/Vudu with 100Mbps LAN (not WiFi) connection? Is it worth it to save money with the digital code if the audio codec is acceptable and the supplemental features on the disc(s) are unimportant?
I think it is perfectly acceptable for renting movies. Depends on your internet though. I get 20MB/Sec rates here in netflix for HDR (as shown in my router), I have seen lower average rates reported from others.

Netflix streaming for originals is really good. for third party its more of a mixed bag. Mostly BR is better but there are exceptions. iTunes is higher quality than Netflix, and has a vast library of 4K and HDR content that is not available on BR. For 4K/HDR titles I own on disc, I would sat 25% are substantially better than the iTunes versions, but some are pretty much the same unless you are into minutae. Audio is better on disc.

Online streaming quality improved a lot about 18 months ago and audio quality on iTunes is improved now over 6 months ago.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,582 Posts
I have this title and can provide some feedback once I get the RS2000 set up, hopefully over the weekend. It looked great on the RS600 in the velvet pit.
I thought that if anyone had this disk it would be you. Looking forward to see how it looks on the RS2000. Hope you really enjoy the RS2000 addition to your projector collection.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,757 Posts
This post has nothing to do with this thread, but it reaches all parties to whom it effects and that is the weather of extremes in Australia !
A searing heat wave and now severe flooding.
I'm going to assume that Javs, Woofer etc.and others are OK ???

Photos show Queensland with homes half under water.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
RS2000 is here
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,795 Posts
17 - 5 = 12 = DECEMBER
3 + 5 = 2018
4
0013 = 13TH UNIT IN BATCH

:wink:
Thanks for solving that riddle! So far my NX7 has performed in an entirely exemplary fashion, so I hope that holds true for all the others in my December "batch"!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Todd G.

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,798 Posts
haha I wish it was true though. He is not calibrating the camera , but the output he is calibrating the output and creating a custom color profile to his liking. A working semi/professional camera wont give you inaccurate colors.

Excerpt from the article:
"How to use custom profiles
Working as a travel photographer, I tend to make a custom profile for each location area. So if I am shooting in the Himalayan region of Ladakh in India, I'll create a profile, and if on the same trip I were to head to a completely different area, such as the lush state of Kerala in the South of India, then I would repeat the process."

if all he was doing was trying to achieve perfect colors he wouldn't need a different custom profile per location. In essence you dont need to calibrate a camera to see red differently in your bathroom vs your kitchen.

Also those color profiles only apply to JPEG outputs, if you are shooting RAW it doesnt matter really what profile is on your camera as long as your display is calibrated.
As a former professional photographer and as very recently retired digital photography retoucher for a local high end photographer, I have to add that there is a few things wrong with your rebuttal....

This DOES work for RAW and it is actually the prefer way to color profile a camera. The color profiles tell Lightroom what color shifts exist in your camera and since that those varies from one camera to another in the same exact brand and model, and also between one camera with different lenses, it is advisable to color profile each camera body with every single lens you have. A lens can create its on shifts in color that need to be corrected within Lightroom.

The photographer I retouched for would send me all his images with the first frame that included the Passport profile image with each single lens he used in that session AND another one if he changed his lights to a different brand since those created another level of shift. Before I retouched a single image I had a color profile created on at least 2 dozen images per session. Since Lightroom automates the process you only have to do it once and then all images are automatically profiled.

But wait, there's more.... I also demanded that he provide me with a color balance readout from each of his lights (he never shot natural light) and he had to use a calibrated color meter either a Sekonic color meter or our new favorite one, a Lumu Power color meter...by far the best color meter we had ever tested and easy to use since it uses your iPhone.

So, in order to calibrate your camera you need to do this:

Shoot the image of the Passport with the lens you plan to use and the Passport has to be under the lighting you plan on profiling. In our case here, you want to project a pure 100% white image to the Passport and take a properly exposed image that fills the frame. You can use the Passport to verify the color balance using the Passport's color balance scale if you don't want to use a color meter.

Then import the image into Lightroom and use the DNGProfileManager to import the RAW and create the profile. Now when you open your screen images you need to change your camera profile to the one created and it will fix any shifts that your camera, lens, and light source (the projector) have created. The results are absolutely mind blowing compared to the non-profiled ones.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
115 Posts
As a former professional photographer and as very recently retired digital photography retoucher for a local high end photographer, I have to add that there is a few things wrong with your rebuttal....

This DOES work for RAW and it is actually the prefer way to color profile a camera. The color profiles tell Lightroom what color shifts exist in your camera and since that those varies from one camera to another in the same exact brand and model, and also between one camera with different lenses, it is advisable to color profile each camera body with every single lens you have. A lens can create its on shifts in color that need to be corrected within Lightroom.

The photographer I retouched for would send me all his images with the first frame that included the Passport profile image with each single lens he used in that session AND another one if he changed his lights to a different brand since those created another level of shift. Before I retouched a single image I had a color profile created on at least 2 dozen images per session. Since Lightroom automates the process you only have to do it once and then all images are automatically profiled.

But wait, there's more.... I also demanded that he provide me with a color balance readout from each of his lights (he never shot natural light) and he had to use a calibrated color meter either a Sekonic color meter or our new favorite one, a Lumu Power color meter...by far the best color meter we had ever tested and easy to use since it uses your iPhone.

So, in order to calibrate your camera you need to do this:

Shoot the image of the Passport with the lens you plan to use and the Passport has to be under the lighting you plan on profiling. In our case here, you want to project a pure 100% white image to the Passport and take a properly exposed image that fills the frame. You can use the Passport to verify the color balance using the Passport's color balance scale if you don't want to use a color meter.

Then import the image into Lightroom and use the DNGProfileManager to import the RAW and create the profile. Now when you open your screen images you need to change your camera profile to the one created and it will fix any shifts that your camera, lens, and light source (the projector) have created. The results are absolutely mind blowing compared to the non-profiled ones.

All valid points but again you are not profiling your camera. You are profiling your display or print device. Are you uploading anything to your camera like a ICC? The answer is no.

So in theory the variations across most prosumer cameras and lenses (which lightroom already has profiles for) does most of the heavy lifting as far as lens and color profiles go. However you are changing things to your liking which may be visually pleasant but not necessarily color accurate unless all you are doing is taking a picture of a color profile card at a weighted lighting setup (5000K 6500K etc) and then making sure your display is calibrated to read the information that you expect from the reference card.

So if I shoot with a Sony A7RIII with a 85 1.4GM and you also do the same the variance in our RAW files will be negligible if any for a shot that is taken at the exact same camera settings. Do you disagree?

How you process the RAW and what you see on your screen and what someone else will see from the processed RAW on their screen while browsing the forum is a whole different story as it will vary on their display calibration and the output capabilities of their display device. I highly doubt anyone in here is looking for those differences to get a general idea on what the output of a projector looks like.
 

·
Vendor
Joined
·
26,593 Posts
To all those who got their JVCs today---give us your feedback!!!!!!!!! please :)
They are flowing now......

Thanks for solving that riddle! So far my NX7 has performed in an entirely exemplary fashion, so I hope that holds true for all the others in my December "batch"!
Nothing wrong with that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,810 Posts
Shoot the image of the Passport with the lens you plan to use and the Passport has to be under the lighting you plan on profiling. In our case here, you want to project a pure 100% white image to the Passport and take a properly exposed image that fills the frame. You can use the Passport to verify the color balance using the Passport's color balance scale if you don't want to use a color meter.

Then import the image into Lightroom and use the DNGProfileManager to import the RAW and create the profile. Now when you open your screen images you need to change your camera profile to the one created and it will fix any shifts that your camera, lens, and light source (the projector) have created. The results are absolutely mind blowing compared to the non-profiled ones.
This workflow includes “correction” of the light source, i.e., it “calibrates out” any deviations from D65 that the projector may have. If the objective is have the captured image accurately represent what the viewer of the projector sees, one could argue that the projector light source characteristics should not be calibrated out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,447 Posts
This post has nothing to do with this thread, but it reaches all parties to whom it effects and that is the weather of extremes in Australia !
A searing heat wave and now severe flooding.
I'm going to assume that Javs, Woofer etc.and others are OK ???

Photos show Queensland with homes half under water.
Australia is COLOSSAL in size. The flooding up in Townsville is a very small area way up north where barely anyone lives.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
214 Posts
Here are two sample videos... the first one is a sample of video with 8k eshift on. The second video is with 8k eshift off. You will notice a slight flicker in the first video, I’m guessing that’s the eshift doing its thing. This is not visible when viewing in real time. The camera can catch it though.

First video...

https://vimeo.com/315815153

Second video...

https://vimeo.com/315814908

Regards,

Yanki
 
  • Like
Reactions: aniv

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
So I finally installed my 130 inch XYscreens AT Soundmax screen, replacing a 106inch Elitescreen Cinegrey 5D.

I can finally experience the sharpness of the image that NX7 throws. With the Cinegrey, there were way too many artifacts / sparkles that the picture appeared blurred at times especially in high brightness scenes. Today I was able to see how 'clean' the image is.Watching Planet Earth 2 on Netflix, the image was breath taking.

One more thumbs up to NX7 ... but you need a good screen to really see what it can do!
 
4741 - 4760 of 29198 Posts
Top