[Tom Bley]

Then we need to bombard Oblivion's director's email, Facebook and Twitter account..........

Yes but, Oblivion doesn't need the director. It needs someone at Universal that knows what the H3ll they are doing. I'm glad I watched Oblivion on UHD first this past weekend. I thought it wasn't bad and watched it in HDR I thought the colors looked great but, the real fine detail just didn't seem to be there. It also didn't help that I read that Kris Deering thought the same earlier in the week. I then Put in LUCY uhd hdr and holy crap was that good! The colors just popped and the extra fine detail was incredible. My favorite uhd to show off this projector followed by the Revenant. So, Universal got Lucy right!

 

[HTPCat]

I know this has been covered before, but I'm having a hard time finding it. My Integral will be here tomorrow.

Should I put it between my Sammy 8500 and Marantz 7702mkII, or between the AVP and my RS600? Or will it matter? I'm primarily looking to use it to knock 4:4:4 to 4:2:0. But, I might try forcing SDR as well at some point.

I dont think it matters, just put it where it is the most useful. In my case, i have it after the denon and before the jvc because i can use a 10' hdmi cable to the hdfury and then a 20' hdmi cable to jvc with the fury hidden in my false wall behind the AT screen.

 

[millerwill]

Very OT, but I just watched 'Midnight Special' BD on my RS600 tonight: interesting plot, and great scenery--and an amazing workout for my Seaton SubMesive, really took advantage of the output down to 16Hz.

 

[orbitzboy]

RS500 - no luck

Just unboxed my brand new RS500. Installed it onto my ceiling, turned it on, and no picture. Light turns green, lens door opens, fan turns on, waits about 30 seconds with no picture. Lens door then closes and the lamp (amber) and warning light flash sequentially, then just the lamp light continuously flashes with both the standby and warning lights on. Looked up the codes, seems to be the lamp. I unscrew the lamp door, unscrew the lamp, reinstall the lamp, same behavior.

Did I get a bad lamp on my brand new projector? Can it be anything else? Can't call for help until the morning. I was looking forward to a late night of tweaking and watching movies!


Alex Zoghlin

 

[Tom Bley]

Just unboxed my brand new RS500. Installed it onto my ceiling, turned it on, and no picture. Light turns green, lens door opens, fan turns on, waits about 30 seconds with no picture. Lens door then closes and the lamp (amber) and warning light flash sequentially, then just the lamp light continuously flashes with both the standby and warning lights on. Looked up the codes, seems to be the lamp. I unscrew the lamp door, unscrew the lamp, reinstall the lamp, same behavior.

Did I get a bad lamp on my brand new projector? Can it be anything else? Can't call for help until the morning. I was looking forward to a late night of tweaking and watching movies!


Alex Zoghlin

That sucks, can you try and unplug it for a minute then plug back in and fire it up? Sounds like you already tried re-seating the lamp. Not sure what else to tell you. Could be the lamp DOA.

 

[millerwill]

Just unboxed my brand new RS500. Installed it onto my ceiling, turned it on, and no picture. Light turns green, lens door opens, fan turns on, waits about 30 seconds with no picture. Lens door then closes and the lamp (amber) and warning light flash sequentially, then just the lamp light continuously flashes with both the standby and warning lights on. Looked up the codes, seems to be the lamp. I unscrew the lamp door, unscrew the lamp, reinstall the lamp, same behavior.

Did I get a bad lamp on my brand new projector? Can it be anything else? Can't call for help until the morning. I was looking forward to a late night of tweaking and watching movies!


Alex Zoghlin

Sounds like what happened with my RS600. After turning it off, waiting for cool down, and then turning it back on, it came up. This continued for several months, and I finally sent it in for service, which fixed it; but a pia.

 

[orbitzboy]

That sucks, can you try and unplug it for a minute then plug back in and fire it up? Sounds like you already tried re-seating the lamp. Not sure what else to tell you. Could be the lamp DOA.

Thank you for the super fast response!

Yes, read the manual, and tried the "alternate" method (unplug, wait, plug back in) first before messing with the lamp.

I have a little video of the process - it all happens in less then thirty seconds: https://photos.google.com/share/AF...?key=YVJMeGVCZ0xUYWUwc1FseEFTWW1GT1lndHBtWXNR

I guess I'll get a good night sleep.


Alex

 

[stevenjw]

Lots of posts in the Master List of 4k HDR Titles thread claiming that Universal botched the Oblivion UHD with a 2k to 4k upscale that has less detail than the regular Blu Ray.

Oblivion was not on my order list because as I said earlier, I'm staying away from most 2K DI UHD-BDs for this very reason.

 

[henrich3]

I know this has been covered before, but I'm having a hard time finding it. My Integral will be here tomorrow.

Should I put it between my Sammy 8500 and Marantz 7702mkII, or between the AVP and my RS600? Or will it matter? I'm primarily looking to use it to knock 4:4:4 to 4:2:0. But, I might try forcing SDR as well at some point.

The K8500 won't do 4:2:2 or 4:2:0. If you put the Integral into a mode with a chroma subsampling of less than 4:4:4, the player will switch to RGB. To answer your original question, connect the Integral between the Sammy and your AVR.

A better use of the Integral is to disable HDR. After it's disabled you'll need to adjust some player settings to get a good SDR image. Go into the player's Picture Mode menu when it's playing a UHD/HDR film, then select User. You'll need to adjust both the Contrast & Brightness to get a good image. If you want to ballpark those settings, pop in the UHD movie Lucy if you have it. Bright detail in the cliffs behind the first Lucy at the beginning of the film will be lost (crushed into white) unless you lower the Contrast. Shortly thereafter there's a black screen that says "1%" while Morgan Freeman's character talks. Raise the Brightness until the black level starts to rise, then back it down. Note the settings & exit the menu. The player should retain those settings for future discs. Note that those settings won't be correct if you play non-HDR content, so you'll need to switch the settings back for Blu-rays or DVDs. (Or just use another Blu-ray player for those discs.)

SDR looks much better than HDR on the JVC pj's. In HDR the black level is lousy and the contrast is poor. In SDR the blacks are excellent & the highlights are brighter. The auto-iris works in SDR. The SDR image isn't perfect since disabling HDR clips the HDR highlights versus tone mapping them. Despite that, it's still a better overall image.

 

[alebonau]

The K8500 won't do 4:2:2 or 4:2:0. If you put the Integral into a mode with a chroma subsampling of less than 4:4:4, the player will switch to RGB. To answer your original question, connect the Integral between the Sammy and your AVR.

A better use of the Integral is to disable HDR. After it's disabled you'll need to adjust some player settings to get a good SDR image. Go into the player's Picture Mode menu when it's playing a UHD/HDR film, then select User. You'll need to adjust both the Contrast & Brightness to get a good image. If you want to ballpark those settings, pop in the UHD movie Lucy if you have it. Bright detail in the cliffs behind the first Lucy at the beginning of the film will be lost (crushed into white) unless you lower the Contrast. Shortly thereafter there's a black screen that says "1%" while Morgan Freeman's character talks. Raise the Brightness until the black level starts to rise, then back it down. Note the settings & exit the menu. The player should retain those settings for future discs. Note that those settings won't be correct if you play non-HDR content, so you'll need to switch the settings back for Blu-rays or DVDs. (Or just use another Blu-ray player for those discs.)

SDR looks much better than HDR on the JVC pj's. In HDR the black level is lousy and the contrast is poor. In SDR the blacks are excellent & the highlights are brighter. The auto-iris works in SDR. The SDR image isn't perfect since disabling HDR clips the HDR highlights versus tone mapping them. Despite that, it's still a better overall image.

I dont know.... perhaps its my relatively small screen size... but am loving HDR on my jvc ! :kiss:

 

[Mike Garrett]

Just unboxed my brand new RS500. Installed it onto my ceiling, turned it on, and no picture. Light turns green, lens door opens, fan turns on, waits about 30 seconds with no picture. Lens door then closes and the lamp (amber) and warning light flash sequentially, then just the lamp light continuously flashes with both the standby and warning lights on. Looked up the codes, seems to be the lamp. I unscrew the lamp door, unscrew the lamp, reinstall the lamp, same behavior.

Did I get a bad lamp on my brand new projector? Can it be anything else? Can't call for help until the morning. I was looking forward to a late night of tweaking and watching movies!


Alex Zoghlin

Pull lamp and then reseat the lamp and see if that solves your problem.

 

[alebonau]

about one hour to go in superman man of steel uhd...I am indeed liking this even more ! the 3D audio is stunning ! PQ is actually quite impressive actually ... particularly the space scenes etc and even on earth... there are sections where the grain haters will be doubling over and retching...am talking about for instance the initial farm scene at sun set and the grainey noisey skyline.... or at the oil rig scene again when they re in the boat and looking at the skyline. some of this am sure must be due to conversion as a little similar as in mad max and san andreas which we know was conversion related. in anycase didnt bother me toooooo much and an enjoyable watch...about an hour to go... cant wait to get back to it

 

[orbitzboy]

Pull lamp and then reseat the lamp and see if that solves your problem.

Thanks for the thought. Tried reseating it a couple of times. The company I purchased it from has already offered to return it, and reship a new projector. If it's just the bulb, I'd rather go that route to avoid having to deal with removing, and installing it back on the ceiling.

Oh well.

 

[henrich3]

I dont know.... perhaps its my relatively small screen size... but am loving HDR on my jvc ! :kiss:

The benefit of a high dynamic range image is that you have a much larger intra-scene dynamic range than you do with SDR. The black level and average scene brightness should remain the same for both SDR & HDR, but the max luminance should be dramatically brighter with HDR imagery. If you're viewing an indoor movie scene with no specular highlights, for example, the scene brightness should be the identical for SDR & HDR.

Those HDR benefits are available if you're viewing a FALD LCD display. A JVC pj, on the other hand, can't do that. Although the black level should be the same in HDR mode, it's not on the JVC's. If you switch to High Lamp mode to see the brighter HDR highlights, that harms your black level. The fact that the JVC auto-iris is (mis)programmed to stay wide open for HDR content makes a fade to black look like you're watching an inexpensive LCD projector instead of a Brutal Contrast Monster.

HDR light levels reach 1000 nits or more, but how bright is a JVC pj? 70 nits is probably in the general ballpark (70 nits = 20 foot-lamberts). SDR content is graded for 100 nit displays, so how can you hope to accomodate 1000 nit HDR content on a 70 nit display?

Normally a JVC would be calibrated so that SDR content takes full advantage of the JVC's limited light output. If you send the JVC HDR imagery, it will lower the 100 nit white point to make room for the HDR highlights. That results in a dim image. If you try to make the image brighter by increasing the Contrast, you end up clipping more and more of those HDR highlights. The end result is that your average brightness is lower, you've clipped most of the HDR highlights, and your black level is poopy.

Given the problems that JVCs have displaying HDR content, I feel that sending it tone mapped SDR will offer the best image possible. Barring a tone mapping solution (eg. Radiance Pro), sending your JVC a clipped SDR image can still look excellent if the player's Contrast & Brightness settings are properly adjusted.

 

[Craig Peer]

The benefit of a high dynamic range image is that you have a much larger intra-scene dynamic range than you do with SDR. The black level and average scene brightness should remain the same for both SDR & HDR, but the max luminance should be dramatically brighter with HDR imagery. If you're viewing an indoor movie scene with no specular highlights, for example, the scene brightness should be the identical for SDR & HDR.

Those HDR benefits are available if you're viewing a FALD LCD display. A JVC pj, on the other hand, can't do that. Although the black level should be the same in HDR mode, it's not on the JVC's. If you switch to High Lamp mode to see the brighter HDR highlights, that harms your black level. The fact that the JVC auto-iris is (mis)programmed to stay wide open for HDR content makes a fade to black look like you're watching an inexpensive LCD projector instead of a Brutal Contrast Monster.

HDR light levels reach 1000 nits or more, but how bright is a JVC pj? 70 nits is probably in the general ballpark (70 nits = 20 foot-lamberts). SDR content is graded for 100 nit displays, so how can you hope to accomodate 1000 nit HDR content on a 70 nit display?

Normally a JVC would be calibrated so that SDR content takes full advantage of the JVC's limited light output. If you send the JVC HDR imagery, it will lower the 100 nit white point to make room for the HDR highlights. That results in a dim image. If you try to make the image brighter by increasing the Contrast, you end up clipping more and more of those HDR highlights. The end result is that your average brightness is lower, you've clipped most of the HDR highlights, and your black level is poopy.

Given the problems that JVCs have displaying HDR content, I feel that sending it tone mapped SDR will offer the best image possible. Barring a tone mapping solution (eg. Radiance Pro), sending your JVC a clipped SDR image can still look excellent if the player's Contrast & Brightness settings are properly adjusted.

I love my Brutal Contrast Monster, which my HD Fury allows me to have with some of the benefits 4K UHD. The cheap LCD look HDR brought to the table wasn't cutting it in my book - especially watching The Revenant. But I've always liked having my cake and eating it too.

Keeping my Oppo BDP103 so I can switch back and forth with the Blu Ray vs the 4K UHD version has been helpful too. I'm not going to get rid of my Oppo any time soon.

 

[Ted99]

I love my Brutal Contrast Monster, which my HD Fury allows me to have with some of the benefits 4K UHD. The cheap LCD look HDR brought to the table wasn't cutting it in my book - especially watching The Revenant. But I've always liked having my cake and eating it too.

Keeping my Oppo BDP103 so I can switch back and forth with the Blu Ray vs the 4K UHD version has been helpful too. I'm not going to get rid of my Oppo any time soon.

If/When dynamic metadata is implemented in HDR 10, will this problem with lowering white levels for 1000 nit HDR content help with the JVC's rendition of HDR? Anyone know if dynamic metadata can be added to the RS500/600 by firmware update? I'm expecting my AVS B-stock RS600 next week and enquiring minds want to know.

 

[henrich3]

I love my Brutal Contrast Monster, which my HD Fury allows me to have with some of the benefits 4K UHD. The cheap LCD look HDR brought to the table wasn't cutting it in my book - especially watching The Revenant. But I've always liked having my cake and eating it too.

Keeping my Oppo BDP103 so I can switch back and forth with the Blu Ray vs the 4K UHD version has been helpful too. I'm not going to get rid of my Oppo any time soon.

I keep my Oppo 105 for Blu-rays and use my Brightness & Contrast modified Phillips BDP7501 exclusively for UHD. That way I don't have to fiddle with settings changes viewing HD & UHD content on the Phillips. Despite the clipping problem, well mastered UHD content like Lucy looks excellent in SDR on my BCM!

 

[henrich3]

If/When dynamic metadata is implemented in HDR 10, will this problem with lowering white levels for 1000 nit HDR content help with the JVC's rendition of HDR? Anyone know if dynamic metadata can be added to the RS500/600 by firmware update? I'm expecting my AVS B-stock RS600 next week and enquiring minds want to know.

The fundamental problem of trying to display 1000+ nit content on a 70 nit pj would not be resolved with dynamic metadata.

The best we could hope for would be a firmware update that improved the auto-iris function in HDR, and better tone mapping for the Gamma D setting. JVC has known about our complaints in these areas for several months now and there's no indication that a FW update to improve these is forthcoming. That being the case, SDR is the way to go IMO...

 

[HTPCat]

I keep my Oppo 105 for Blu-rays and use my Brightness & Contrast modified Phillips BDP7501 exclusively for UHD. That way I don't have to fiddle with settings changes viewing HD & UHD content on the Phillips. Despite the clipping problem, well mastered UHD content like Lucy looks excellent in SDR on my BCM!

Have you had enough time with the Philips to give a review or at least the pros/cons vs. Samsung? I dislike navigating the Samsung when going from UHD disc to streaming, not being able to retrieve picture settings menu unless playing a disc, etc. Thinking I might keep the Samsung and get a Philips and use the Samsung for streaming only until a better combined option comes around.

 

[krichter1]

The K8500 won't do 4:2:2 or 4:2:0. If you put the Integral into a mode with a chroma subsampling of less than 4:4:4, the player will switch to RGB. To answer your original question, connect the Integral between the Sammy and your AVR.

A better use of the Integral is to disable HDR. After it's disabled you'll need to adjust some player settings to get a good SDR image. Go into the player's Picture Mode menu when it's playing a UHD/HDR film, then select User. You'll need to adjust both the Contrast & Brightness to get a good image. If you want to ballpark those settings, pop in the UHD movie Lucy if you have it. Bright detail in the cliffs behind the first Lucy at the beginning of the film will be lost (crushed into white) unless you lower the Contrast. Shortly thereafter there's a black screen that says "1%" while Morgan Freeman's character talks. Raise the Brightness until the black level starts to rise, then back it down. Note the settings & exit the menu. The player should retain those settings for future discs. Note that those settings won't be correct if you play non-HDR content, so you'll need to switch the settings back for Blu-rays or DVDs. (Or just use another Blu-ray player for those discs.)

SDR looks much better than HDR on the JVC pj's. In HDR the black level is lousy and the contrast is poor. In SDR the blacks are excellent & the highlights are brighter. The auto-iris works in SDR. The SDR image isn't perfect since disabling HDR clips the HDR highlights versus tone mapping them. Despite that, it's still a better overall image.

Yeah but the defect on the Samsung in SDR output verified by Doug Blackburn & Joe Kane makes me stay with HDR until they fix it (lesser of two evils IMO).

I hope Jason (Zombie) gets his Panny soon and reports back a positive experience over the Samsung (I'll switch I think to bridge my time to when the Oppo is released). Where is Jason's review of Oblivion!?