AVS Forum banner

581 - 600 of 676 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
808 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
Is anyone having trouble switching into 4K HDR sources with the Envy in the middle?

I am having a whole bunch of issues. From Envy on standby, I can switch into a 4K HDR source (e.g. Xbox One X) and play 4K HDR content (e.g. Netflix) with no issue. I can then switch into Apple TV 4K which per the Envy setup guide is set up for 4K SDR and play 4K HDR content with no issue.

However, if I then try to switch back to a 4K HDR source (e.g. Xbox One X), I get a "no signal" message. Switching back to a 4K SDR source (e.g. Apple TV 4K) does not cause any issues. If I put the Envy on standby and switch the Envy on again, I get the home page of the 4K HDR source (i.e. Xbox One X) and can then play any 4K HDR content with no issue.

I very much doubt it is the cables as I have no issue switching to and from the same 4K HDR sources and playing 4K HDR content both directly from the Marantz 8805 AVP, and also via the Envy (the latter provided I first put the Envy on standby and switch it on again).

Seems more like an Envy HDMI handshake issue.

Any feedback from other Envy users would be most appreciated!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,269 Posts
For such issues, could you please contact your dealer for support, or alternatively [email protected]? It's not efficient to handle such issues via forum. FWIW, Ric told me that in the majority of similar support cases the cables are at fault, but nobody wants to hear that. Every user always believes that the cables are fine, and Ric has to ask very nicely each time for the user to try a different cable. That said, it's not always the cables, sometimes it's Envy's fault (or the AVR's fault), and we're actively working on improving the handshake stability further. HDMI is a b***, though, so it's not an easy task to make HDMI handshaking work perfectly in every situation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
374 Posts
For such issues, could you please contact your dealer for support, or alternatively [email protected]? It's not efficient to handle such issues via forum. FWIW, Ric told me that in the majority of similar support cases the cables are at fault, but nobody wants to hear that. Every user always believes that the cables are fine, and Ric has to ask very nicely each time for the user to try a different cable. That said, it's not always the cables, sometimes it's Envy's fault (or the AVR's fault), and we're actively working on improving the handshake stability further. HDMI is a b***, though, so it's not an easy task to make HDMI handshaking work perfectly in every situation.
What cables do you recommend?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
For such issues, could you please contact your dealer for support, or alternatively [email protected]? It's not efficient to handle such issues via forum. FWIW, Ric told me that in the majority of similar support cases the cables are at fault, but nobody wants to hear that. Every user always believes that the cables are fine, and Ric has to ask very nicely each time for the user to try a different cable. That said, it's not always the cables, sometimes it's Envy's fault (or the AVR's fault), and we're actively working on improving the handshake stability further. HDMI is a b***, though, so it's not an easy task to make HDMI handshaking work perfectly in every situation.
I have contacted the local dealer and am looking forward to hearing from them on a resolution to the problem.

Frankly, I would have no issue changing cables if that would solve the switching problem. All my cables are currently exposed and being tested, and swapping them out would be no problem. Having said that I doubt this is a cable problem. The AVP without the Envy switches all sources perfectly, and the issue resolves itself with existing cables if I put the Envy on standby and power up again.

BTW, I am using certified UHS 8k 2 metre cables except from the Envy to the projector which is a 15m 8k AOC tested successfully with the 3080 and the LG CX (4K 120p 10 bit).

Looking forward to the dealer reverting with a solution.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,269 Posts
Yeah, it sounds like this being a cable issue isn't overly probable, but it never hurts to quickly test it, just to rule out one potential cause of the issue.

I've had good experiences with relatively cheap HDMI 2.1 cables. Nothing special. Important is to not go too short, 2m sounds perfect. Too short HDMI cables are actually "bad", surprisingly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
392 Posts
However, if I then try to switch back to a 4K HDR source (e.g. Xbox One X), I get a "no signal" message. Switching back to a 4K SDR source (e.g. Apple TV 4K) does not cause any issues. If I put the Envy on standby and switch the Envy on again, I get the home page of the 4K HDR source (i.e. Xbox One X) and can then play any 4K HDR content with no issue.

Any feedback from other Envy users would be most appreciated!
I saw a similar issue recently and it involved either ATV 4K or NVIDIA Shield TV Pro, I don't remember for sure. When I saw the "no signal" message I walked out of the room to check that the device was on and the AVP was set to the proper input, which took maybe 30 seconds. When I came back into the room, the device was now displaying through the Envy, and I hadn't done anything. I chalked it up to a very slow handshake and didn't investigate further. Maybe try giving the "no signal" message 30-60 seconds before you do any restarts and see what happens.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
According to wikipedia, this is what DLSS internally uses/requires:

Envy doesn't have access to this data, so DLSS can't be used.
Thanks for the reply.

I was reading the product outline on page one and it said the video up-scaling was AI-based, so was interested if it was using DLSS as it uses a Nvidia RTX 3080 GPU.

So I gather most people use this processor for movie up-scaling and tone mapping, but how is it for up-scaling RGB Chroma computer graphics and game consoles? Does the Extreme up-scaling have end-to-end 4:4:4 signal processing and does it support 8K60 RGB output using Display Stream Compression (DSC)? I understand it supports a paid upgrade 2.1 HDMI output, will there a similar upgrade for 2.1 HDMI input planned for later?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
I watched a couple of movies with my Envy now.
... and I love it!!! :)

But I have a question: I would like to determine the peak nits of my VW760. For that purpose, I would like to have a video file that is a 100% white picture full frame. Where can I get such a file?

I guess the file should be SDR, am I right? For the peak nits measurement, I think, the Envy shouldn't do any tone mapping (that is why I assume it should be an SDR file). However, during the measurement the signal should go through the Envy, since I am using a 3D lut specifically generated for my VW760 (was done by a professional calibrater).

Any suggestions where I can get this 100% white file?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
808 Posts
... or is it as simple as just playing a youtube white screen video?
It´s even simpler - your Envy has a built-in white test image. You can open the test pattern menu with a long press on the menu button (top right button).
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mike_WI

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
It´s even simpler - your Envy has a built-in white test image. You can open the test pattern menu with a long press on the menu button (top right button).
Cool! Thank you very much!

I hope that I get the X-rite sensor in the next days, just ordered it via Amazon.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,269 Posts
So I gather most people use this processor for movie up-scaling and tone mapping, but how is it for up-scaling RGB Chroma computer graphics and game consoles? Does the Extreme up-scaling have end-to-end 4:4:4 signal processing and does it support 8K60 RGB output using Display Stream Compression (DSC)? I understand it supports a paid upgrade 2.1 HDMI output, will there a similar upgrade for 2.1 HDMI input planned for later?
Upscaling for RGB works just fine. Both Extreme and Pro have full 4:4:4 processing.

As far as I know, the Nvidia Ampere GPUs do support DSC, but to my knowledge, there are no displays on the market today which support DSC just yet. Even the current 8K displays reportedly don't support DSC. So I don't really know for sure if Nvidia's DSC output will work well in real life. Implementing completely new features like this is sort of an adventure for HDMI companies. Yes, there's a spec, but HDMI is very difficult to do right, so HDMI companies often do "plugfests" where all the companies meet and test compatability of their devices. Since there are no DSC displays yet, I've no idea how Nvidia even tested their DSC implementation. That said, since Nvidia GPUs (and AMD GPUs) are probably the only devices on the market right now with DSC support, probably future DSC displays will use Nvidia/AMD GPUs to test their implementation, so it's likely that DSC displays will work with Nvidia/AMD GPUs just fine. But let's wait and see. What I can say is that I've just implemented 4K 120fps 10bit RGB support for Envy Extreme (only the 3080 version, obviously). It works fine with my new LG G1 OLED. So that means 8K 30fps 10bit RGB should work fine as well, even without DSC. However, for 8K 60fps RGB we would need DSC.

All that said, Envy has too high latency (video delay) to be useful for gaming, unfortunately. And this is unlikely to change.

The Envy Extreme already has an HDMI 2.1 output today. The Envy Pro does not yet. There will be a paid upgrade for the Pro to get an HDMI 2.1 output in the future, same for older Extreme models which still have an HDMI 2.0 output. We also do plan do have an HDMI 2.1 input port at some point (at least in the Extreme), but we don't know yet when this will be available. Frankly, HDMI 2.1 is much more useful on the Envy output side, so we're not in a hurry to add it on the input side. The only thing HDMI 2.1 is really useful for on the input side would be gaming, IMHO, and as mentioned above, Envy is not useful for gaming, anyway. So HDMI 2.1 on the input side can wait...

I watched a couple of movies with my Envy now.
... and I love it!!! :)
Yey, I sure like to hear that!!

It´s even simpler - your Envy has a built-in white test image. You can open the test pattern menu with a long press on the menu button (top right button).
The test pattern menu can be assigned to one of the colored buttons (either short press or long hold). I think a long press on the menu button (as you say) worked in previous firmware builds to open the test pattern menu, but I think it no longer works (?) in the latest firmware.

In measuring peak luminance with a lux meter, what should be the distance between the sensor and the screen?
I've no idea, hopefully someone else can answer that.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
808 Posts
The test pattern menu can be assigned to one of the colored buttons (either short press or long hold). I think a long press on the menu button (as you say) worked in previous firmware builds to open the test pattern menu, but I think it no longer works (?) in the latest firmware.
Ah, that could well be - actually, i took the information from the Envy manual. So i guess that needs a rewrite. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,866 Posts
I am noticing some lip sync issues with some of Envy’s later FWs, where I need to set my MX170 to 110ms (using Nvidia Shield Pro). Sometimes it needs additional ms tweaking. So the Envy auto- lip sync detection is not dead on as usual. Anyone else noticing this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
186 Posts
I am noticing some lip sync issues with some of Envy’s later FWs, where I need to set my MX170 to 110ms (using Nvidia Shield Pro). Sometimes it needs additional ms tweaking. So the Envy auto- lip sync detection is not dead on as usual. Anyone else noticing this?
I do have occasional lipsync issues, which seem to vary from source to source. Unfortunately my Monoprice HTP-1 pre/pro does not currently have auto lipsync (which is a feature I miss with the Envy in the chain). I have reached out to Monoprice a couple times about this being implemented via a future firmware update, but I have never heard anything back.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
I had to comment how much I appreciate the geometry correction just added. I have a Sony 885 with the Panamorph DCR lens and am at the minimum throw 1.4 distance. I get some barrel distortion and it’s always bothered me. I can say for the first time it’s gone and I just love it. Previously I had to zoom the image to match the top and bottom of the screen and use the projector’s masking to cut off the sides of the image or use the Envy’s same masking. This just seemed to magnify the barrel distortion and always annoyed me. The process was very simple and for the first time I have no image overspill and crisp edges! Not sure just how many people are annoyed by this, but for me it’s almost worth the cost of the entire unit for just this feature.

On a slightly less positive note I am resorting to rack mounting my Extreme. Right now it’s on the shelf out of my rack since it takes a 5U spot. The fan noise is starting to become annoying especially after I just calibrated my Trinnov and I’m listening to more music. I frequently don’t have the projector on with music, but occasionally for concert music I do. Just wish the Envy was smaller and less noisy. Not a big deal, but I have to move my 2 power conditioners/surge protectors out of the rack to make room for the Envy and reposition them with a non-rack mount option. By placing the Envy in the rack it will cut the fan noise to almost none. Just not excited spending the day moving the power cords around in the rack. The rack fans already blow, but I’m used to that white noise. Either way I’m super happy with it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
I had to comment how much I appreciate the geometry correction just added. I have a Sony 885 with the Panamorph DCR lens and am at the minimum throw 1.4 distance. I get some barrel distortion and it’s always bothered me. I can say for the first time it’s gone and I just love it. Previously I had to zoom the image to match the top and bottom of the screen and use the projector’s masking to cut off the sides of the image or use the Envy’s same masking. This just seemed to magnify the barrel distortion and always annoyed me. The process was very simple and for the first time I have no image overspill and crisp edges! Not sure just how many people are annoyed by this, but for me it’s almost worth the cost of the entire unit for just this feature.
Yes, the geometry correction works really well on my 3.8 metre diagonal wide curved scope screen. Setting it up is a little frustrating as the arrow pushes are not very responsive but as Madshi said this is a once off process so not too much of a pain. Now waiting for NLS and 3D....:)
 
581 - 600 of 676 Posts
Top