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You're room is kind of in that sweet spot where you could go either way. But remember, to dig deep with sealed subs you usually need to spend more because you will need to get enough power to make that extension noticeable. I would think you would need to consider going with dual sealed subs right off the bat. That said I would go with the 15V or V1500. Actually I would consider the V1800 as well.

Remember this, the vast majority of movie material is above 20Hz and the amount of material below 16Hz is probably below 1% and the amount of material below 12 Hz is even less. And to make matters worse, the lower the ULF the more power it takes for you to notice it. So the real question you have to ask yourself is how much are you willing to spend chasing the small amount of material below 16Hz? It's a matter of the law of diminishing returns. ;)
From what I've read on AVS, I don't have the funds, space or desire to go chasing single digits :D Does the 15" ported perform as well as multiple sealed above 15Hz? So you feel any pressurization effects at >=15Hz?

I don't listen at reference, Tom said I wouldn't notice any difference between 15V/V1500 and very slight with V1800. And V1800 in room extension is 17 vs 14 for V1500 (typo?).

This is a bit confusing because some of the most popular subs (Submersive, DSS) are sealed designs, never heard anyone say they lack anything.
 

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From what I've read on AVS, I don't have the funds, space or desire to go chasing single digits :D Does the 15" ported perform as well as multiple sealed above 15Hz? So you feel any pressurization effects at >=15Hz?

I don't listen at reference, Tom said I wouldn't notice any difference between 15V/V1500 and very slight with V1800. And V1800 in room extension is 17 vs 14 for V1500 (typo?).

This is a bit confusing because some of the most popular subs (Submersive, DSS) are sealed designs, never heard anyone say they lack anything.
If you don't listen at or anywhere near reference then the 15" subs would probably be fine for you. However, I don't listen at reference either but I set my sub trim pretty hot so my subs are approaching reference even though the speakers are less.

Are you considering going duals down the road?

I have seen posts where someone got two sealed subs from Seaton and was dissatisfied. Not because the subs were bad (Seaton makes awesome subs) but simply because he was used to the power of ported subs around the port tune and when he switched to sealed he missed the power of the ported.

Sealed subs are great but unless you have a small room you will most likely need to invest in powerful ones and possibly multiples depending on the situation and how much bass you want to experience. After all, in this case you are looking at a 15V/V1500 which are single 15" ported subs with a 725 watt amp vs. the S3000i which is a dual 15" sealed sub with a 1700 watt amp.
 

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That's good to know...Thanks basshead81!
Hey Marty get your mic here http://cross-spectrum.com/measurement/calibrated_umik.html

Herb calibrates all his mics with frequency response curves at 0°, 45° and 90° angles of incidence, and as BH mentioned down to 5 Hz. In the past he didn't include sensitivity parameters but now they come loaded with each mic so you don't have to go to the miniDSP site to get your sens factor.
@Jim, I think the V1800s are some of the best subs I've owned from the PSA line. They provide such tactile feel for me even on carpet over concrete, prior to them the original Triax was the only other sub to do that. You don't even know they're in the room as they just seem to disappear physically as I have no localization at all. They seem so cohesive with how well they play with each other, I don't consider them being large at all but they sound so much larger than they look.

I've spent more time listening to music lately, the sound of the bass seems to come from the speakers when listening to music, that's how well they integrate and the crossover to the subs is seamless. They seem to make any system sound expansive. With movies they can be very subtle and then explosive on demand with no overhang or lagging behind. The sound is there and gone just as fast, no residual leftovers. I don't know if that's what they call quick or what, that's a term I don't usually use though. I contribute their sound to the front end DSP programming that Tom and Jim configure into the amp modules.

I don't know if you remember when I tore down one of the 1800s and posted the pics, the combination of box (bracing) port design and the right amp that's tweaked for that box and driver is a recipe for success. Anybody could put a driver and big amp in a box and call it a subwoofer......It's coming up on a year that I've had them so that should tell you how much I like them. I have yet to bottom out the drivers even at ridiculous levels with no port chuffing as well. This may sound dumb but I like to demo the 1800s with gun shots, if a sub can produce a realistic sound of a gun shot I know it's a keeper.

My brother is a gun fanatic so I'm very familiar with how all types of hand guns and rifles sound and the 1800s make me feel like I'm at the range with my brother. Shooter is one of my favorite movies and John Wick as well. ;) I'm planning on a relocation of all my equipment in a 15' W x 29' L x 8' room and the setup will be well off the front wall (trying to sneak a PJ on that 15' wide wall) while the misses is visiting her grandson.;) Anyway I'm going to need some rear room reinforcement, maybe a V3600 would feel right at home back there, then I can see (hear) why you're so enthusiastic about having twins. I don't have any WAF or placement restrictions so I don't know if two more 1800s or a single 3600 would be easier to integrate.

I could get into many more reasons why I think the 1800 is the right sub for me but it's getting late and older people have to go to bed early, take care my friend. :)

Cheers Jeffrey
 

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Well, I think I may have talked myself (with help of course) into the v1800 over the v1500. I know moving up from the F12 to the V1500 would be a huge improvement I was unsure if it would still meet my needs. At least this way all the bass is there whether I use it or not at least its there.

My listening levels went from -35 to -30 when I started to -20 to -15 (rarely) now. I need to make sure there is enough bass there for my needs haha. If this doesnt work than my only option is a v3600i or the Cap1400. If I had the funds for either at the moment I would have probably picked the v3600i up. Just cannot swing that much cash right now.
 

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I am very confident that you will find the V1800 to be a very drastic upgrade over the f12. Sounds quality will improve since you are not likely to reach its output limits at -15MV.
 

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I ran my f12 about 6db hot. I doubt I will have to with the v1800, at least for most movies. Maybe a couple dB hot.

Sending the rythnik back today and once I get the refund I'll be ordering the v1800. Couple weeks without a sub will be tough.
 

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I believe Tom is implying for upgrading to a "I" which is a dual module 1700watt amp. However for a short stint there was a S3000 that I believe used a lower power Ice amp. So I am not sure if that is a possibility or not?
Good memory..:)

During the initial pre order stage for all of the ICE powered subs we actually had a S3000 and a S3000i. The former using one amp module. IIRC something like 17 of the initial 19 or 20 pre-orders were for the S3000i. After thinking about this for a bit we decided to drop the S3000 before launch(we upgraded all S3000 pre orders to *i* status at no charge).

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
 

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Well, I think I may have talked myself (with help of course) into the v1800 over the v1500. I know moving up from the F12 to the V1500 would be a huge improvement I was unsure if it would still meet my needs. At least this way all the bass is there whether I use it or not at least its there.

My listening levels went from -35 to -30 when I started to -20 to -15 (rarely) now. I need to make sure there is enough bass there for my needs haha. If this doesnt work than my only option is a v3600i or the Cap1400. If I had the funds for either at the moment I would have probably picked the v3600i up. Just cannot swing that much cash right now.
Did you consider dual V1500s or 15Vs? My policy is always to go dual if possible. That being said I think you will find the V1800 meets/exceeds your desires. The bar is LOW coming from the F12 (IMHO).
 

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Good memory..:)

During the initial pre order stage for all of the ICE powered subs we actually had a S3000 and a S3000i. The former using one amp module. IIRC something like 17 of the initial 19 or 20 pre-orders were for the S3000i. After thinking about this for a bit we decided to drop the S3000 before launch(we upgraded all S3000 pre orders to *i* status at no charge).

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Tom, is it possible to offer a 1 amp module ICE upgrade for the XS30s? Would/could it still be beneficial or a downgrade?
 

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Tom, is it possible to offer a 1 amp module ICE upgrade for the XS30s? Would/could it still be beneficial or a downgrade?
I am willing to bet that one ICE module is still better then the 850 watt bash amp. The ICE module is 725watts at 4ohm, but the research I did on B&O's website shows them being stable to 2.5ohms. Not sure If you could wire the XS30 drivers in Parallel and pull more power out of the ICE, but either way I would still think the ICE is Superior for sure!!
 

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From what I've read on AVS, I don't have the funds, space or desire to go chasing single digits :D Does the 15" ported perform as well as multiple sealed above 15Hz? So you feel any pressurization effects at >=15Hz?

I don't listen at reference, Tom said I wouldn't notice any difference between 15V/V1500 and very slight with V1800. And V1800 in room extension is 17 vs 14 for V1500 (typo?).

This is a bit confusing because some of the most popular subs (Submersive, DSS) are sealed designs, never heard anyone say they lack anything.
Well, it sort of circles back to our chat discussion. The big advantage for a vented design will be a large increase in system headroom from about 1/6th octave
 

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I ran my f12 about 6db hot. I doubt I will have to with the v1800, at least for most movies. Maybe a couple dB hot.

Sending the rythnik back today and once I get the refund I'll be ordering the v1800. Couple weeks without a sub will be tough.
I wouldn't be surprised if you used the same bass calibration for the new sub. Preferring a 6dB bump in the bass levels isn't going to directly correlate to the sub as much as simple listening preference.

The louder the master volume level the more having the V1800 6dB hot may begin to get annoying though. Just experiment and see what works best.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
 

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I ran my f12 about 6db hot. I doubt I will have to with the v1800, at least for most movies. Maybe a couple dB hot.

Sending the rythnik back today and once I get the refund I'll be ordering the v1800. Couple weeks without a sub will be tough.


I would love to have a listen once you receive this!
 

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From what I've read on AVS, I don't have the funds, space or desire to go chasing single digits :D Does the 15" ported perform as well as multiple sealed above 15Hz? So you feel any pressurization effects at >=15Hz?

I don't listen at reference, Tom said I wouldn't notice any difference between 15V/V1500 and very slight with V1800. And V1800 in room extension is 17 vs 14 for V1500 (typo?).

This is a bit confusing because some of the most popular subs (Submersive, DSS) are sealed designs, never heard anyone say they lack anything.
I have a room that is close to the same size, roughly 2700^3. I use dual Xs-15se, which makes me more than happy. However, my room is completely sealed. Since I've known that an S3000i and the V1500 share the same output at the V1500 port tune, I borrowed two more XS-15SEs from a friend and the difference from just two XS15SEs was tough to hear. Again, this is my room, and my desires in performance, but even at reference volume and action movies, 2x2 subs stacked in opposing corners the benefit was modest at best. However, everyone who's been over to my room has said it's really good.

I'd venture to say that if you don't listen at reference you'll also not see the gain from the S1500 to the V1500, in that size room.

That said I still think that the S3000i is the best serious sub for the money on the market today for most applications. There's very little it can't do extremely well. With dual S3000i you'll be chasing single digits; even if you didn't want to!
 

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Well that just sucks! Now the XV15se that's in my living room is screaming to be upgraded.
Hook, Line and sinker my friend.

I have said it before, Tom is a Marketing Genius (Evil Genius really). IMO, you cant get much better than such a glowing endorsement than from @basshead81 on these forums! Whatever discounts Tom gave BH will likely turn into profit many times over once PSA releases the upgrade. Due to upgrading the older model, it may be a somewhat short lived windfall (like the SE upgrades) but well played for sure. :cool:
 

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The S3000i’s price has been bumped up 100 bucks, since I purchased it. I’ll tell you all that it is worth more than the current retail price. It’s a sub that does everything really, really well. It competes on the music side about equally to my SB-13 Ultra as far as sound quality and detail (not an easy feat), yet provides more output at any frequency under 125 Hz. Because of that, it does so much more for movie LFE content than my SB-13 Ultra. These two subs are now equal in price, but not equal in overall performance. For those SB-13 Ultra fans (and I am certainly one, and always will be), the value of the S3000i is quite amazing. Adding to that is its size. While undeniably large compared to the SB-13, it is much smaller than one would expect for a dual-opposing 15-inch driver design.

A fellow AVS member ( @nalthien ) tested out two V1500 vs. two S3000i’s. He was very impressed with both for different reasons. His choice? The S3000i’s.
 
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