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Maybe Tom can answer this but I wonder what small sub placed near field would work best with a low tuned sub? I wonder if a sealed would match better than a high tuned ported?
 

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Would anyone in this thread help me with MultEQ app and the subwoofer curve, please?
 

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I’d love to see your REW for a single sub. I’m seriously thinking of going with a single TV3612. It’s such a good deal now that the preorder discount for the TV1812 is over.

For what it is worth, I have a single TV36 ipal with a very open floor plan and on a concrete floor. My theater is in my living room and it only has three walls and open to the rest of the house. So I need something large to pressurize the room (I have about 8,000+ cf of open space). Adding a second sub isn't much of an option due to the layout of the room.

Bottom line, my single TV36 ipal is amazing. Even with just a single TV36 I get great mid bass tactical feel to my chest and awesome ULF shaking of my chair. I get very good response in all listening positions but I'm sure it would be better with a second sub. I do not have REW, a miniDSP and I do not use the eq software (YPAO) on my Yamaha AVR as I don't like how it sounds post calibration. Are there nulls and peaks, most likely yes. Would another sub or a miniDSP and REW make the room sound better, probably. But the sound is so awesome as is that I'm completely and utterly happy with my setup. But that's just me in my room.
 

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I’️d love to see your REW for a single sub. I’️m seriously thinking of going with a single TV3612. It’️s such a good deal now that the preorder discount for the TV1812 is over.

For what it is worth, I have a single TV36 ipal with a very open floor plan and on a concrete floor. My theater is in my living room and it only has three walls and open to the rest of the house. So I need something large to pressurize the room (I have about 8,000+ cf of open space). Adding a second sub isn't much of an option due to the layout of the room.

Bottom line, my single TV36 ipal is amazing. Even with just a single TV36 I get great mid bass tactical feel to my chest and awesome ULF shaking of my chair. I get very good response in all listening positions but I'm sure it would be better with a second sub. I do not have REW, a miniDSP and I do not use the eq software (YPAO) on my Yamaha AVR as I don't like how it sounds post calibration. Are there nulls and peaks, most likely yes. Would another sub or a miniDSP and REW make the room sound better, probably. But the sound is so awesome as is that I'm completely and utterly happy with my setup. But that's just me in my room.
That’s awesome! Luckily I’m on a wood floor over a basement so even my current subs shake the floor. I can’t imagine what that would do!
 

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I had time to experiment with different sub orientations today. Attached is what I think is the "best" one as it has the highest SPL from 20 to 100Hz. My only concern is with the nulls above 100Hz. There are some positions that don't have those nulls but they have some other minor nulls below 100hz.


Does this one look OK?


PS: I get it about the ambient "noise" now and how critical it is. I thought I had some positions that were flat down to around 18Hz but they would appear and disappear. Then I figured out that when my AC was running, i got "lower extension" and when the AC shut off, the lower extension went away. Talk about aggravating. Lesson learned. Keep AC off when testing.
 

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I had time to experiment with different sub orientations today. Attached is what I think is the "best" one as it has the highest SPL from 20 to 100Hz. My only concern is with the nulls above 100Hz. There are some positions that don't have those nulls but they have some other minor nulls below 100hz.


Does this one look OK?


PS: I get it about the ambient "noise" now and how critical it is. I thought I had some positions that were flat down to around 18Hz but they would appear and disappear. Then I figured out that when my AC was running, i got "lower extension" and when the AC shut off, the lower extension went away. Talk about aggravating. Lesson learned. Keep AC off when testing.
It will depend on where you crossover to your mains and surrounds. I am able to crossover at 80 hz for all of them so I don't worry about above 100 very much but if your crossover is say 100hz or even 120hz for your surrounds then it is something to keep working on for a smoother response beyond 100hz.

Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk
 

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It will depend on where you crossover to your mains and surrounds. I am able to crossover at 80 hz for all of them so I don't worry about above 100 very much but if your crossover is say 100hz or even 120hz for your surrounds then it is something to keep working on for a smoother response beyond 100hz.

Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk

here is a different orientation smoother above 100Hz shown with the previous plot. There is a definite reduction in output
 

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here is a different orientation smoother above 100Hz shown with the previous plot. There is a definite reduction in output
 

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If you are crossing over at 100hz you are probably going to get a better blend with your other speakers with the second position. You are getting higher peeks by 3-5 db with option 1 but it looks like overall 20 to 100hz the responce of option 2 has a smaller +/- variance. Also if you are going to be doing any bass eq with Rew and a dsp or even in your AVR, it is going to cut those peeks off anyway. I like option 2 better.

Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk

Food for thought. Thank you. Maybe some other opinions will roll in.
 

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Food for thought. Thank you. Maybe some other opinions will roll in.
The sub was probably just a couple feet further away from the mic. That lowers SPL due to distance.
 

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I use the app on my iPad to limit what Audyssey does. All tuning is done via a MiniDSP HD.

As a result my sub curve is unaffected Audyssey on/off
Are you using the MulEQ Filter Frequency Range tab in the app to set a 20Hz limit on the sub woofer channel? I didn't realize that disabled EQ for that channel. I was planning on having to do an inverse EQ on the output of the minidsp for the crowsons.
 
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The sub was probably just a couple feet further away from the mic. That lowers SPL due to distance.

I have about 12 different measurements but they are all within about 2' of each other. I pointed the sub in each direction (north, south, east, west) and took left, right and center located measurements. There was very little change in peaks due to moving the sub closer or further from the mic. The only peak changes came from turning the sub.


I mean, the sub gain is only at 9 and there is a ton of headroom. If the slightly lower output is a better choice I think that should be fine.



Is the 2nd one your vote too?
 

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I have about 12 different measurements but they are all within about 2' of each other. I pointed the sub in each direction (north, south, east, west) and took left, right and center located measurements. There was very little change in peaks due to moving the sub closer or further from the mic. The only peak changes came from turning the sub.


I mean, the sub gain is only at 9 and there is a ton of headroom. If the slightly lower output is a better choice I think that should be fine.



Is the 2nd one your vote too?
Hmm... I'd probably do sweeps with L, then C, then R at both locations and see which gives you the best combined response.....and go with that. Because otherwise they are probably close enough that whichever gives you the best integration is likely to work best.
 

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Hmm... I'd probably do sweeps with L, then C, then R at both locations and see which gives you the best combined response.....and go with that. Because otherwise they are probably close enough that whichever gives you the best integration is likely to work best.

with audyssey enabled?
 

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Are you using the MulEQ Filter Frequency Range tab in the app to set a 20Hz limit on the sub woofer channel? I didn't realize that disabled EQ for that channel. I was planning on having to do an inverse EQ on the output of the minidsp for the crowsons.

If you have Crowson’s or any TR device the way you tune the subs is different. The Crowsons need a flat signal unaltered and they get their own tuning specific to TR devices. How many subs do you have?
 
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Tuesday night I was lucky enough to have Tom send an email letting me know my 2 TV18's on pre-order were ready to be picked up. Wednesday afternoon my son and I drove the 1.5 hours in my wife's Honda Pilot to pick up the new additions to my living room home theater system. Tom was as nice a guy as everyone on this thread has stated. He took about a half hour to give us a tour his shop, introduce his guys and talk about what and how they build and test these subs. It was obvious that Tom is just having fun building subs. I have a feeling if I could put him on rewind and visit with him 5 years ago or 10 or 20 I would find the same guy, building subs, listening to subs and enjoying building something that is provides awesome performance at a fair price. And beyond what he does for the audio enthusiasts, the jobs and the work that his business create, are clearly a source of pride for his impact on the community. As we left Tom gave us some shirts and an honest thank you for my business (these are my first product of his). My son who just graduated from high school hadn't really said a word during the tour other than "Mom is going to kill you" when he saw the size of the TV18's and a muffled "holy ****" looking at a TV36 got in the car and said "that is the most chill dude, so obvious he loves what he does". Great time for a kid at his point in life to see what work can be if you decide to do what makes you happy. We did notice he is a Browns fan so it's not all roses in Tom's life though. ;)



Anyway, I set the subs up Wednesday night but no tuning, just cleared my miniDSP HP, plugged them in, set room size at mid (2500sq ft, semi-open layout) and gain at 9:00 so the family could use the system until I could spend some time dialing them in. I did have to move one sub due to WAF as this is our living room and while I did show her how much bigger beyond my previous 12" sub these were going to be with a tape measure, in person, this is a BIG sub for a living room. Friday night I finally was able to spend some time with REW. I left the room size at mid and set the gain to 11:00 before starting. In the picture below you can see the natural response curve and EQ w/ house curve for my 12 year old Mirage S12 (ported, 300W) and for the new TV18's. I am very happy with the results so far!



Today I will be able to spend some time with music to get an actual impression of the sound and later I am going to figure out this BEQ stuff. As you can see there was not much point in BEQ with my old sub but I have a feeling it is going to become a big part of movie nights. :)
Appreciate you taking the time to post impressions cptkarl. All we need here is more room and more cabinets and the fun would really start..:)

But, as you noted, it's really just a bunch of guys having a good time. I'm very fortunate.

Tom V.
Team Power.
 

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The TV42 is phenomenal for music and movies. Coming from Rythmik FV25HPs I find the ipal even better for music (which is no small feat) and the ULF and midbass is just wicked. My room is a bit smaller at 3200 cubic feet and I am probably moving away from my dual TV42s to a single TV42 behind the MLP. I never thought I would say it but 2 of these monsters is too much for my room.
The 21 inch IPALs are a thing of beauty. I'd love to wax poetic about what a genius I am with regards to the TV42ipal's sound quality but when the starting point is a couple of 21ipals...it really just falls into place. Some gauge woofer quality by weight. I mean, there may be *some* merit to that(not much in a vacuum). But we need to understand, B&C isn't using the much more expensive Neodymium magnets because they liked the Matrix. It is a way to get extraordinary motor capabilities while keeping the overall weight DOWN. If the 21 ipal had standard ferrit stuff? I mean, 110-120 pounds(?) or so....per woofer.

And as far as "big woofer" = slow. Snake oil bs!

You can go to funk and get superlative 21 and even 24 inch designs. Same with dgage.

And I'm sure, right now, there are 30-32 inch designs in the works. Who knows where we'll be in 2-3-4 years? 40inch? 50?

One thing AVS has taught me---someone builds it and someone is crazy enough to buy it.

Tom V.
Team Power.
 

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The TV42 is phenomenal for music and movies. Coming from Rythmik FV25HPs I find the ipal even better for music (which is no small feat) and the ULF and midbass is just wicked. My room is a bit smaller at 3200 cubic feet and I am probably moving away from my dual TV42s to a single TV42 behind the MLP. I never thought I would say it but 2 of these monsters is too much for my room.
The 21 inch IPALs are a thing of beauty. I'd love to wax poetic about what a genius I am with regards to the TV42ipal's sound quality but when the starting point is a couple of 21ipals...it really just falls into place. Some gauge woofer quality by weight. I mean, there may be *some* merit to that(not much in a vacuum). But we need to understand, B&C isn't using the much more expensive Neodymium magnets because they liked the Matrix. It is a way to get extraordinary motor capabilities while keeping the overall weight DOWN. If the 21 ipal had standard ferrit stuff? I mean, 110-120 pounds(?) or so....per woofer.

And as far as "big woofer" = slow. Snake oil bs!

You can go to funk and get superlative 21 and even 24 inch designs. Same with dgage.

And I'm sure, right now, there are 30-32 inch designs in the works. Who knows where we'll be in 2-3-4 years? 40inch? 50?

One thing AVS has taught me---someone builds it and someone is crazy enough to buy it.

Tom V.
Team Power.
I can’t help but wonder if another 21” model is in the works? Maybe a single driver low tuned or sealed?
 

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The 21 inch IPALs are a thing of beauty. I'd love to wax poetic about what a genius I am with regards to the TV42ipal's sound quality but when the starting point is a couple of 21ipals...it really just falls into place. Some gauge woofer quality by weight. I mean, there may be *some* merit to that(not much in a vacuum). But we need to understand, B&C isn't using the much more expensive Neodymium magnets because they liked the Matrix. It is a way to get extraordinary motor capabilities while keeping the overall weight DOWN. If the 21 ipal had standard ferrit stuff? I mean, 110-120 pounds(?) or so....per woofer.

And as far as "big woofer" = slow. Snake oil bs!

You can go to funk and get superlative 21 and even 24 inch designs. Same with dgage.

And I'm sure, right now, there are 30-32 inch designs in the works. Who knows where we'll be in 2-3-4 years? 40inch? 50?

One thing AVS has taught me---someone builds it and someone is crazy enough to buy it.

Tom V.
Team Power.
I stumbled upon this recently in the car audio world. They be coming soon enough.

https://gpcaraudio.com/deaf-bonce-db-832neo-32-subwoofer/
 
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