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Exactly. Seeing HDMI 2.1 term used for marketing a 2.1 feature, when it’s still HDMI 2.0b is just a blatant move by the HDMI.org to hype HDMI 2.1 before it’s time. Now we start another period of dealer/consumer confusion. :)

See https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1516615699
I'm hoping they at least increase to 20 gbps from the 18 gbps in current HDMI 2.0 chips, because then HDR10 would work at 4K60 in 4:4:4, in other words, those features would be usable at the same time. Currently you have to drop to 4:2:2. A mere 10% HDMI bandwidth boost would allow 4:4:4 HDR10.

This would be a terrific boon for PC use and gamers too.

But, I agree that it's likely that the first batch of "HDMI 2.1" electronics only implement features and not bandwidth increases. We'll see.
 

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eARC's going to mean that receivers finally become audio devices. As long as a receiver has eARC I don't see the value of HDMI 2.1 because whatever TV you get will have the latest and you won't need to upgrade receiver just to keep up with video standards.
Exactly. For AVRs eARC is the most important HDMI 2.1 feature. The rest is nice to have but not essential.
 

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For HDMI eARC to work, you need that ALL the devices in the HDMI chain to support the eARC feature, regardless of the HDMI version (2.0/2.1).

1. TV - at this time there are no TV's with eARC (LG 2017/2018 OLED's/SUHD's are not true eARC devices - still using HDMI ARC with Dolby Digital Plus for sending Dolby Atmos to the AVR/soundbar)
2. AVR - there are several receivers from Denon/Marantz and now Yamaha that support HDMI 2.0b + eARC feature
3. Blu-ray, media player, HTPC, etc. - at this time there are no external players/sources with eARC

So, we are stuck with just a single device from the HDMI chain that supports this feature.

2018 will be a year of transition. LG has no eARC TV's for 2018, so only in 2019 we can expect eARC.
On the players front all is quiet...
 

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Yamaha will not market a product as HDMI 2.1 if its not!

It still does not carry all expected features of HDMI 2.1, but I'm sure it have the full hardware requirements for HDMI 2.1, such as bandwidth and pin configuration. Anything else can be implemented by firmware update...
 

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For HDMI eARC to work, you need that ALL the devices in the HDMI chain to support the eARC feature, regardless of the HDMI version (2.0/2.1).

1. TV - at this time there are no TV's with eARC (LG 2017/2018 OLED's/SUHD's are not true eARC devices - still using HDMI ARC with Dolby Digital Plus for sending Dolby Atmos to the AVR/soundbar)
2. AVR - there are several receivers from Denon/Marantz and now Yamaha that support HDMI 2.0b + eARC feature
3. Blu-ray, media player, HTPC, etc. - at this time there are no external players/sources with eARC

So, we are stuck with just a single device from the HDMI chain that supports this feature.
Wut? So if my HDMI route goes HTPC -> TV -> AVR, the HTPC must support eARC? Is there currently no way at all to send unmeddled-with audio from an HTPC, then?:confused:
 

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the HTPC must support eARC?
Yes, the source must support eARC, so the TV will know to route the audio part to the AVR, otherwise to route the audio to the AVR you will need to use the optical output of the TV or the classic HDMI ARC - so no lossless audio to AVR.
 

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Yes, the source must support eARC, so the TV will know to route the audio part to the AVR, otherwise to route the audio to the AVR you will need to use the optical output of the TV or the classic HDMI ARC - so no lossless audio to AVR.
Not that I know for sure, but are you sure about that?

I thought any HDMI device would send the high quality audio to the TV via standard HDMI and then the TV would send it to the receiver via eARC. That is what I assumed anyway. :confused:

Dan
 

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If you can plug in HDMI 2.1 directly to your display when use another HDMI 2.1 cable to forward the audio back to the AVR, that would be ideal, since you don't need 48 gbps for audio, only for video, and you could get by with 18 gbps + eARC and be future proof that way.

Use the TV or projector as the HDMI switch. With guaranteed no extra latency compared to routing it all through an AVR.

Of course you'll need a longer cable back from the display to the AVR, but since it's only 18 gbps it should be cheaper. Actually even 10 gbps would be fine, just for Atmos.
 

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Not that I know for sure, but are you sure about that?
I thought any HDMI device would send the high quality audio to the TV via standard HDMI and then the TV would send it to the receiver via eARC. That is what I assumed anyway. :confused:
Sorry for the bad news, seems that the eARC feature must be supported by the ALL devices in the HDMI chain, so YES, the sources MUST support eARC so that the TV will route the desired audio track back to the AVR/soundbar.

From the official HDMI Forum org website FAQ:
Q: Will the existing ARC-enabled products work with new products that use eARC?
A: Maybe. Manufacturers can produce products that are compatible with both eARC and ARC. However, eARC is not defined to be backwards compatible with ARC.
You can see that manufactures CAN add eARC to their classic HDMI 2.0 device, but only if they can (technically) and IF they want to do it (instead of manufacturing a new model).
 

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If you can plug in HDMI 2.1 directly to your display when use another HDMI 2.1 cable to forward the audio back to the AVR, that would be ideal, since you don't need 48 gbps for audio, only for video, and you could get by with 18 gbps + eARC and be future proof that way. .........
You do not need a HDMI 2.1 cable for the eARC feature. eARC works just fine with HDMI High Speed Cables with Ethernet - aka HDMI 2.0 cable with Ethernet.
 

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Sorry for the bad news, seems that the eARC feature must be supported by the ALL devices in the HDMI chain, so YES, the sources MUST support eARC so that the TV will route the desired audio track back to the AVR/soundbar.

From the official HDMI Forum org website FAQ:


You can see that manufactures CAN add eARC to their classic HDMI 2.0 device, but only if they can (technically) and IF they want to do it (instead of manufacturing a new model).
Source devices aren't "ARC enabled"...that's not a thing. They always send audio conventionally (with the video), and the TV routes it to optical or ARC, or in the future eARC.
 

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You do not need a HDMI 2.1 cable for the eARC feature. eARC works just fine with HDMI High Speed Cables with Ethernet - aka HDMI 2.0 cable with Ethernet.
Or even, perhaps, an eARC-only cable (no video). Hopefully that's possible, would be a nice option.

Then the final stage of evolution would be defining an eARC connector for non-TV devices to use.
 

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Source devices aren't "ARC enabled"...that's not a thing. They always send audio conventionally (with the video), and the TV routes it to optical or ARC, or in the future eARC.
Are you sure? Then why there are players that have 2 HDMI outputs, one is used for the video and the other for audio? The TV must discover and talk to each HDMI device, AVR, soundbar, blu-ray player. This "talk" is carried over the eARC channel, so everyone must talk eARC... See the attached graphic.

Or even, perhaps, an eARC-only cable (no video). Hopefully that's possible, would be a nice option.
Not really, we will just return to the SPDIF/TOSlink/Optical/HDMI ARC era. One cable/port for video, one for audio... No thanks.
 

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From 2012 every manufacturer most NOT specify anywhere on their product or package the version of the HDMI port, just the official name of that version:
- High Speed
- Super High Speed
- etc.

They can mark the features, like eARC, HDR, HLG, VRR, etc.

So, the RX-V385 is officialy a "HDMI High Speed with eARC" product.
 

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Source devices aren't "ARC enabled"...that's not a thing. They always send audio conventionally (with the video), and the TV routes it to optical or ARC, or in the future eARC.
This is what I thought. As far as I could tell ARC and eARC were only for when you wanted the TV to send the audio back down to the receiver.

Are you sure? Then why there are players that have 2 HDMI outputs, one is used for the video and the other for audio? The TV must discover and talk to each HDMI device, AVR, soundbar, blu-ray player. This "talk" is carried over the eARC channel, so everyone must talk eARC... See the attached graphic. (snip)
I thought that sources with two HDMI outputs were designed to get around limitations (especially video limitations) in receivers.
I used my dual HDMI output Blu-Ray player to send HD Master Audio to my receiver and video directly to the TV since the AVR wouldn't pass the video cleanly without distortion. Also, some receivers can't pass audio passively to the TV in standby mode so if you want to listen via TV speakers sometimes and via the AVR sometimes, you need the dual output from the source to both devices.
 

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Are you sure? Then why there are players that have 2 HDMI outputs, one is used for the video and the other for audio? The TV must discover and talk to each HDMI device, AVR, soundbar, blu-ray player. This "talk" is carried over the eARC channel, so everyone must talk eARC... See the attached graphic.
The discovery referred to in the chart is between the TV and AVR, specifically, what audio formats the AVR supports. In practice TVs don't rely on this, instead they have user settings for enabling DD/DTS/etc. But in theory it could allow automatic configuration.

Not really, we will just return to the SPDIF/TOSlink/Optical/HDMI ARC era. One cable/port for video, one for audio... No thanks.
We still need audio inputs. Nobody wants to deal with bulky HDMI cables and its terrible connector just for audio, right? So it's either use SPDIF forever, or come up with something modern...maybe eARC, divorced from HDMI, can be the new standard.
 

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The discovery referred to in the chart is between the TV and AVR, specifically, what audio formats the AVR supports. In practice TVs don't rely on this, instead they have user settings for enabling DD/DTS/etc. But in theory it could allow automatic configuration.
I do not see any reference in that chart that shows it's only about between TV and AVR...
Soooo, if you hook up the blu-ray player to the TV, the TV will wait until you will select the sound track and the format of that sound track, no? No talk between the player and the TV, huh? Maybe the TV does not know DTS, maybe does not support Dolby Atmos.... BUT YOU WILL SELECT THEM! Right....

We still need audio inputs. Nobody wants to deal with bulky HDMI cables and its terrible connector just for audio, right? So it's either use SPDIF forever, or come up with something modern...maybe eARC, divorced from HDMI, can be the new standard.
SPDIF is obsolete (no HD audio/lossless/3D sound) and will be maintained along analog inputs/outputs. In time it will disappear.
 
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