AVS Forum banner

281 - 300 of 1114 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,922 Posts
Maybe try Digital Projection International, I think I gave you an email and lens number a bit ago?
Hi, Brian. Thanks. I did reach out to them and spoke with someone who forwarded my request to see if the lens would be compatible with the Runco LS-10. That was a while back. I'll have to follow up with them, I guess.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,922 Posts
Just an observation: for great 3D on the Benq 9060 you must use anamorphic squeeze mode, with a A lens, so the whole chip is utilized.
Very happy with my 9060, but was disappointed w/ it's 3d. Slightly noisy, strange levels of depth, etc.
Utilizing the full array of the chip and A lens makes a night a day difference.
Smooth as silk, incredible dept.
Sean, now I wish I had mine still. :) BTW, I just saw that BB, on its website, has good prices on some of the older 3D blurays.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
74 Posts
MadVR could be used with BenQ 9060, but u have to use rec709...u cant chose dci-p3 profile if u dont send it HDR signal
That is what I was referring to, sorry for my lack of clarity.
but from many reviews ive read the vivid mode gamut coverage is the biggest so u can do a 3DLUT/p3 calibration for vivid mode and use that in MadVR .
I was not aware of that approach. Are the colors projected in UHD in this manner accurate?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
@Greyimporter Great advise and info thx, the suggestion was made entirely on the color saturation though, which is superior to everything in the residential market. 600 lumens of phlatlight led is suprisingly bright. I have to use 10fl for lights out movie watching, 16fl is squinting territory. And using the native gamut looks even brighter.

Ive been finding alot of content, especially anime and older games where the native gamut looks amazing and doesnt look unnatural despite being incorrect.
The Runco Q750i is good. I'd never describe 600lm as bright though. I'd consider it bright enough for a smaller white screen in a fully dark home theater. I'm sure Runco would have given it more juice if they could though.

It's always worth reminding ourselves that these lumen ratings from manufacturers only apply to a specific screen size (which is usually unspecified). Plus, it's usually before calibration... Runco were one of the few who stated how they measured. I remember reading when the Q750I came out that they'd used a 72" white screen. It made it sound a little pathetic (even though it wasn't and gave a nice image). Most people don't understand though and assume it's all like for like. The lamp power is usually more useful.

Someone using that "600lm" projector on a 180" gray screen would have a very different experience than someone using a 92" white screen.

For someone using a projector in a living room or large home theater, there is no such thing as too bright imo as long as it maintains color accuracy and has adjustable lamp power. You don't find people shielding their eyes from 20,000 lm dci projectors at the theater. It's just appropriate for the room and screen. We're also used to far brighter flatscreen TVs these days and people only seem to want more (brightness) for HDR and whatnot.

Unlike cheap business projectors, high end ones are able to maintain outstanding color precision at 3000-20,000 lumen+. They usually achieve the high brightness with multiple lamps which can be used together or individually depending on what you're doing.

Basically, more brightness = more versatility. You have fewer limits on screen size, screen color or room conditions. It's relatively easy to reduce excess brightness with darker screens, a lens iris, filters etc. There is very little you can do about too little brightness. It will always limit your screen size and dynamic range.

I found that you can often achieve a far better image using a high brightness projector on a darker screen too. E.g. I happened to be testing a black screen I'd made for a customer when I made this video showing my arcade guns to someone. The combo of the black screen + bright projector produced better blacks with the lights on than most people can achieve in a blacked out home theater:


You can see it on the 4:3 pillar box bars on the 16:9 projector. They're black like on a flatscreen tv because the screen is black.

I've always thought it's a mistake to evaluate projectors in isolation of screens. Being able to turn pixels full off is only half of what gives Oled TVs their amazing blacks and contrast. It's that their pixel grid is mounted over a jet black background. It's what makes blacks stay black even with the light's on. E.g my 77" lg oled with the blinds open:



If the Oled pixel grid was mounted over a white or light gray background... People here would be saying "Oled blacks suck, buy LCD instead". This problem is impossible to solve with low brightness projectors that are limited to white and light gray screens. Bright high end projectors let you use dark gray or black screens without suffering an unusable narrow viewing cone or crushed whites etc.

I have very high hopes for what's going to be possible with some of the latest 20,000 lm+ laser projectors.

I'm not convinced that led light sources have any value beyond avoiding the cost of bulbs. You want color to be accurate to the defined color space of the content. Going outside the chosen color space is a problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
181 Posts
Sean, now I wish I had mine still. :) BTW, I just saw that BB, on its website, has good prices on some of the older 3D blurays.
Ohhh, nice. Will definitely check them out. I was bringing them in from Amazon UK until the planes stopped.
Was not really into 3D until I saw the Martian using the A lens. Blew. Me. Away. ;-)
You're doing great! I miss my LS10, so we're even!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,786 Posts
Discussion Starter #287
It's not that 600 lumens is bright, as I gave the illuminance figure, needing to use 10fl with the LED projector where I use 16fl with the UHP projectors. I put off ordering a nd2 filter as long as possible hoping i'd adjust to the image, but it never happened, I kept having to reduce the contrast substantially to get a comfortable white level, and still needed low ambient light to offset brighter scenes or brighter parts of an image. Adding a nd2 filter to hit 10fl and being able to set the contrast correctly I finally hit a comfortable brightness level and watch with lights off. Bright content especially I need to use an even lower white point, i.e. 6-7fl to watch anime and with low ambient light, too bright for lights out.

I know there's alot of claims of LED light sources being brighter due to this or that, but months of using them corroborates those claims. At least the ones with high color light yield shown in the spectrograms which have the wide native gamuts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
The Runco Q750i is good. I'd never describe 600lm as bright though. I'd consider it bright enough for a smaller white screen in a fully dark home theater. I'm sure Runco would have given it more juice if they could though.



I found that you can often achieve a far better image using a high brightness projector on a darker screen too. E.g. I happened to be testing a black screen I'd made for a customer when I made this video showing my arcade guns to someone. The combo of the black screen + bright projector produced better blacks with the lights on than most people can achieve in a blacked out home theater

I installed 2nd gen Phat Leds in my Runco q750. I sourced from a LED dealer. They were used later in h9090 2nd gen Vivitek to give them extra lumens, they came out in 2014 at which point Runco gave up on LED so they were never implemented.
I did get a bump in brightness, but not as much as I hoped as q750 does not have newer LED drivers to take advantage of higher power output. I spoke with Runco eng., but he claimed it to be a lost cause. Anyways, would be nice to get 1K lumens out of q750 as it is the only thing it is missing.

I agree about the dark screen, CineGrey 3d works great with Runco, great ISF cert. screen providing inky blacks, but few more lumens would be helpful with it, so in bat cave white is the way to go with this pj.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
518 Posts
You want the LED models for sure then.

The Barco/ Projectiondesign FL32/35s will be the sharpest(best lens) but may bit a little noisy.

Also keep an eye out for the Digital Projection Cine LEDs or Vivitek H9090

What would you recommend as the largest screen for these two projectors? Is there any difference between the 1080p and 1200p versions of the FL32 other than resolution?

The Runco Q-750i gets high praise in this thread by their owners. How do the FL32s compare?


Does the 8-bit rather than 10-bit color processing for the fl32 affect their color vibrancy? (Projector Design's product sheet lists 30-bit, so I'm guessing Projector Central is mistaken)

Barco's website lists 30-bit, but Projector Central lists 8-bit for the Projection Design original. Is the Barco 30-bit, while PD only 24-bit? Or is Projector Central wrong?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,786 Posts
Discussion Starter #291
What would you recommend as the largest screen for these two projectors? Is there any difference between the 1080p and 1200p versions of the FL32 other than resolution? The Runco Q-750i gets high praise in this thread by their owners. How do the FL32s compare?
A 120" 1.1gain screen for the 600 lumen models would be 16fl.

Shouldnt be any difference aside from aspect ratio, one chip is 16:9 one 16:10

I listed some of the differences here
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post58991694

Summed up the fl32 has a significantly better lens, but no dynamic led dimming, is 100-200 lumens brighter, and has louder fan noise. Native contrast is 1500:1 on the fl32 and 3500:1 on the q750i, and the q750i has dynamic contrast ranging from 15-20k.


Does the 8-bit rather than 10-bit color processing for the fl32 affect their color vibrancy? (Projector Design's product sheet lists 30-bit, so I'm guessing Projector Central is mistaken) Barco's website lists 30-bit, but Projector Central lists 8-bit for the Projection Design original. Is the Barco 30-bit, while PD only 24-bit? Or is Projector Central wrong?
The Vivitek H9090 and Sim2 Mico40 can accept 1080p60 rgb full 12bit, the q750i(manufactured 2009) couldnt(but could do 1080p23 12bit), so I think it may just be an age issue for 10bit processing at 60hz. I dont think projectorcentral is right, in any case these projectors have the smoothest gradients I've ever seen and are devoid of banding, even lower quality content with madvrs processing and debanding function.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,922 Posts
A 120" 1.1gain screen for the 600 lumen models would be 16fl.

Shouldnt be any difference aside from aspect ratio, one chip is 16:9 one 16:10

I listed some of the differences here
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post58991694

Summed up the fl32 has a significantly better lens, but no dynamic led dimming, is 100-200 lumens brighter, and has louder fan noise. Native contrast is 1500:1 on the fl32 and 3500:1 on the q750i, and the q750i has dynamic contrast ranging from 15-20k.




The Vivitek H9090 and Sim2 Mico40 can accept 1080p60 rgb full 12bit, the q750i(manufactured 2009) couldnt(but could do 1080p23 12bit), so I think it may just be an age issue for 10bit processing at 60hz. I dont think projectorcentral is right, in any case these projectors have the smoothest gradients I've ever seen and are devoid of banding, even lower quality content with madvrs processing and debanding function.

What is the lens diameter on the Mico 40?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28,794 Posts
A 120" 1.1gain screen for the 600 lumen models would be 16fl.

Shouldnt be any difference aside from aspect ratio, one chip is 16:9 one 16:10

I listed some of the differences here
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post58991694

Summed up the fl32 has a significantly better lens, but no dynamic led dimming, is 100-200 lumens brighter, and has louder fan noise. Native contrast is 1500:1 on the fl32 and 3500:1 on the q750i, and the q750i has dynamic contrast ranging from 15-20k.




The Vivitek H9090 and Sim2 Mico40 can accept 1080p60 rgb full 12bit, the q750i(manufactured 2009) couldnt(but could do 1080p23 12bit), so I think it may just be an age issue for 10bit processing at 60hz. I dont think projectorcentral is right, in any case these projectors have the smoothest gradients I've ever seen and are devoid of banding, even lower quality content with madvrs processing and debanding function.
I had a Vivitek H9090 in my room for a month or two. Had it to play with, back when I had an RS600. The H9090 was a nice projector, but needed more lumens. For 16:9 sports on my low gain AT scope screen, I prefered the H9090 over my JVC. For movies, the JVC had the edge, due to it's better contrast, but brighter scenes looked at least as good as the JVC, even with a little less brightness.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,786 Posts
Discussion Starter #294
What is the lens diameter on the Mico 40?
The glass is ~2.75", the shroud is like 4"

I had a Vivitek H9090 in my room for a month or two. Had it to play with, back when I had an RS600. The H9090 was a nice projector, but needed more lumens. For 16:9 sports on my low gain AT scope screen, I prefered the H9090 over my JVC. For movies, the JVC had the edge, due to it's better contrast, but brighter scenes looked at least as good as the JVC, even with a little less brightness.
That's about how I'm setup. I use the H9090 for lights on, high adl content, youtube, cartoons, whose line ;] The Mico 40 for movies, quality tv/anime. The H9090(or q750i) is a nice projector, but the upgrades in the Sim2 Mico or TruVue Vango models make for a substantially nicer image. The water cooled leds and gamma corrected led dimming make for a nearly unnoticeable dynamic contrast. The difference in the lenses is significant, the Mico is much sharper(virtually undetectable chromatic aberration, i.e. pixel perfect like an emissive display) and has a much higher contrast look to it. I typically don't use any sharpening tools, but the built-in luminance transient improvement/detail enhancement, or using madvrs sharpening can make certain digitally photographed content look insanely 3 dimensional, it's wild. Recently watched The Witcher and ended up leaving the sharpening on through the whole season.

I also always start with matched gamuts, but it's also been interesting trying the native gamut for certain bt709 content. The native gamut is bt2020 red, between p3 and bt2020 for green, and you can push the secondaries way out to the limits of human vision(GLORIOUS CYAN). Animated stuff it can look really really cool without looking incorrect. It doesn't work on most live action content, but for some it can, I was watching Star Trek Enterprise and the native gamut somehow worked without affecting skin tones. Something about the very saturated native output of the leds really fights ambient light better too, i guess like using vivid tv modes in big box stores?. Just pumping up the brightness a bit and using the native gamut I was able to watch star trek(a mostly lower adl show shot on super 35) in high ambient light without the image washing out anywhere near as much as you'd expect(really good DLP shadow detail as Kris pointed out ;] Not quite the contrast of a VA panel, but honestly comparable to an IPS panel, which I think says something in regards to projection in high ambient light, very watchable.

I don't want to it to seem like I'm diminishing the JVCs though, it's some of the best performing LCD technology available. An excellent response time with overshoot compensation, shocking low adl contrast, and in low lamp modes has good 5-10% adl contrast as well. It's only in high lamp and/or the 2160p models that high adl(bright scene color contrast)/ansi(haloing) suffers. I've only seen brief demos of the nx7 but it wasn't a distracting quality and hardly noticeable in most content. It just simply looks like LCD, and DLP, especially 3chip and rgb solid state sequential, has a window like quality and video(motion/that 10microsecond black to white) rendering perfection that stands alone in modern display technology until microled and will stand along in projection for some time. Which is why it's a bummer to see the same contrast arguments over and over. Current DLP objectively has poor contrast, and if more people championed the actual strengths of the technology(electrostatic modulation of a mirror) and clamoured for a 2chip sequential rgb laser(if possible) we might have a chance of seeing the technology actually have higher contrast in less then 10 years.

@MDesigns The graph I posted is pretty accurate, the native, 1% adl, and ansi measurements were made by owners/reviewers and I extrapolated the rest of the curve based on how DLP contrast typically performs, i.e. very flat.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post59224148
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
The glass is ~2.75", the shroud is like 4"



I don't want to it to seem like I'm diminishing the JVCs though, it's some of the best performing LCD technology available. An excellent response time with overshoot compensation, shocking low adl contrast, and in low lamp modes has good 5-10% adl contrast as well. It's only in high lamp and/or the 2160p models that high adl(bright scene color contrast)/ansi(haloing) suffers. I've only seen brief demos of the nx7 but it wasn't a distracting quality and hardly noticeable in most content. It just simply looks like LCD, and DLP, especially 3chip and rgb solid state sequential, has a window like quality and video(motion/that 10microsecond black to white) rendering perfection that stands alone in modern display technology until microled and will stand along in projection for some time. Which is why it's a bummer to see the same contrast arguments over and over. Current DLP objectively has poor contrast, and if more people championed the actual strengths of the technology(electrostatic modulation of a mirror) and clamoured for a 2chip sequential rgb laser(if possible) we might have a chance of seeing the technology actually have higher contrast in less then 10 years.

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post59224148
Yep, that's exactly how I feel. "It simply looks like LCD" When I look at shimmering water on DLP it looks like real water, it does not look that way on LCOS and others. Why? Not sure. But my eyeballs say so. I would never watch a Wimbledon final on LCD either...

There might be hubris on part of Texas Instruments to say DLP is good enough the way it is, but in some ways it is. I agree, it would have been nice for them to push it forward, but we can always dream :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28,794 Posts
The glass is ~2.75", the shroud is like 4"



That's about how I'm setup. I use the H9090 for lights on, high adl content, youtube, cartoons, whose line ;] The Mico 40 for movies, quality tv/anime. The H9090(or q750i) is a nice projector, but the upgrades in the Sim2 Mico or TruVue Vango models make for a substantially nicer image. The water cooled leds and gamma corrected led dimming make for a nearly unnoticeable dynamic contrast. The difference in the lenses is significant, the Mico is much sharper(virtually undetectable chromatic aberration, i.e. pixel perfect like an emissive display) and has a much higher contrast look to it. I typically don't use any sharpening tools, but the built-in luminance transient improvement/detail enhancement, or using madvrs sharpening can make certain digitally photographed content look insanely 3 dimensional, it's wild. Recently watched The Witcher and ended up leaving the sharpening on through the whole season.

I also always start with matched gamuts, but it's also been interesting trying the native gamut for certain bt709 content. The native gamut is bt2020 red, between p3 and bt2020 for green, and you can push the secondaries way out to the limits of human vision(GLORIOUS CYAN). Animated stuff it can look really really cool without looking incorrect. It doesn't work on most live action content, but for some it can, I was watching Star Trek Enterprise and the native gamut somehow worked without affecting skin tones. Something about the very saturated native output of the leds really fights ambient light better too, i guess like using vivid tv modes in big box stores?. Just pumping up the brightness a bit and using the native gamut I was able to watch star trek(a mostly lower adl show shot on super 35) in high ambient light without the image washing out anywhere near as much as you'd expect(really good DLP shadow detail as Kris pointed out ;] Not quite the contrast of a VA panel, but honestly comparable to an IPS panel, which I think says something in regards to projection in high ambient light, very watchable.

I don't want to it to seem like I'm diminishing the JVCs though, it's some of the best performing LCD technology available. An excellent response time with overshoot compensation, shocking low adl contrast, and in low lamp modes has good 5-10% adl contrast as well. It's only in high lamp and/or the 2160p models that high adl(bright scene color contrast)/ansi(haloing) suffers. I've only seen brief demos of the nx7 but it wasn't a distracting quality and hardly noticeable in most content. It just simply looks like LCD, and DLP, especially 3chip and rgb solid state sequential, has a window like quality and video(motion/that 10microsecond black to white) rendering perfection that stands alone in modern display technology until microled and will stand along in projection for some time. Which is why it's a bummer to see the same contrast arguments over and over. Current DLP objectively has poor contrast, and if more people championed the actual strengths of the technology(electrostatic modulation of a mirror) and clamoured for a 2chip sequential rgb laser(if possible) we might have a chance of seeing the technology actually have higher contrast in less then 10 years.

@MDesigns The graph I posted is pretty accurate, the native, 1% adl, and ansi measurements were made by owners/reviewers and I extrapolated the rest of the curve based on how DLP contrast typically performs, i.e. very flat.
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/24-digital-hi-end-projectors-3-000-usd-msrp/3095572-older-high-end-dlp-led-2.html#post59224148
Did not like the TruVue Vango, but I am sure that is because of setup. I was excited to see this projector at CEDIA. The manufacturer had it set up with exaggerated colors.Look cartoonish. I was disappointed. Would have loved to have seen it calibrated properly.

The first time I saw a JVC RS4500, the first thought that came to my mind was: "This looks like a DLP with good contrast." I feel the same way about an RS3000.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,786 Posts
Discussion Starter #297 (Edited)
Yep, that's exactly how I feel. "It simply looks like LCD" When I look at shimmering water on DLP it looks like real water, it does not look that way on LCOS and others. Why? Not sure. But my eyeballs say so. I would never watch a Wimbledon final on LCD either...
I think it's quantifiable.

First, the use of a mirror directing light instead of passing through a layer of polarizing liquid crystal.

Second is the pixel response, when every single pixel changes state at the exact same rate, even full black to white, at approximately 10microseconds. Occassionally I've seen the assertation that it's irrelevant due to the length of a 24p video frame, or our eyes can't see that compared to say the 5ms response time of lcos, however, the USAF ran a study that concluded that pilots could consistently not only detect a 1ms frame flash of an aircraft, but identify the aircraft as well. So say with LCD when you have some pixels taking 1ms to change state from gray to gray, and some at 5ms from black to white, it gives a less than solid perception of video rendering. And I can't stress that enough, video rendering, not static images, images in motion, video... XD

Last has to do with pixel response as well. Overshooting. Due to the voltage drive, when the pixel changes state with LCD, it doesn't immediately hit the correct value, often overshooting the correct value and takes an amount of time to settle to the correct value. Some manufacturers implement compensation, which typically ends up causing slight undershooting, but will avoid bright ghosting in motion of dark scenes. OLED is subject to overshooting as well, though it's been refined over the last few years and isn't as severe as it once was.

DLP on the other hand works on electrostatic attraction(stax headphones anyone?), and moves the mirror to the exact correct position instanteously.

The top graph is uncompensated LCD overshooting, the bottom is compensated but shows undershooting


There might be hubris on part of Texas Instruments to say DLP is good enough the way it is, but in some ways it is. I agree, it would have been nice for them to push it forward, but we can always dream :)
As it is now, getting good contrast on DLP is a matter of very expensive optics. Look at the Lumis, 6k:1 native contrast, 3k:1 at 10%adl, 25k+ dynamic contrast(with both a dynamic iris and lamp dimming), $15,000 in glass. And that's about as good as it's going to get until new designs are implemented(2chip/2tir prism).


Did not like the TruVue Vango, but I am sure that is because of setup. I was excited to see this projector at CEDIA. The manufacturer had it set up with exaggerated colors.Look cartoonish. I was disappointed. Would have loved to have seen it calibrated properly
Ya, more often then not using the native gamut with bt709 content looks distractingly incorrect. Aside from just saturation values being incorrect, luminance values are drastically incorrect, and it can be downright uncomfortable to look at. That's a shame though because the vango(like the mico) is as perfect as you're going to get for single chip dlp. That gamut is finally useful now though with uhd content too, really before their time those projectors. If I recall correctly the vango wasn't astronomically priced(less than the mico anyway), so at todays cost would probably be a competitive option. Especially with hdr support, if it could accept rec2020 and the dynamic dimming was tuned to dynamic tone mapping, you'd have a very nice option

The first time I saw a JVC RS4500, the first thought that came to my mind was: "This looks like a DLP with good contrast." I feel the same way about an RS3000.
I think the 2160p imager really benefits lcd/lcos in terms of sharpness. Whereas the good single chip led dlp is pixel perfect so resolution is more a factor of seating distance and less of a determing factor for sharpness with projection. No misconvergence, no chromatic aberration, no haloing, and oversharpening causes little to no ringing.

I feel like I remember prototype LCD a while ago that had a faster response, maybe even sub 1ms black to white, but I think they couldnt overcome massive overshooting at that speed so it got shelved and I havent heard of any breakthroughs in the technology since.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,922 Posts
The first time I saw a JVC RS4500, the first thought that came to my mind was: "This looks like a DLP with good contrast." I feel the same way about an RS3000.
If you can sell me one for the price I paid for my current pre-owned Runco, maybe I'll consider it. :p

No, but seriously, I've seen the RS3000/NX9, and Lcos/LCD does not --and cannot-- look just like a DLP. DLP and Lcos have a very distinctive look to each technology. To my eyes, Lcos images look kind of chalky and air-brushed (just watch the final fight scene in Avengers: End Game on an Lcos and then watch it on one of these high-end DLPs). It's mainly because of that look that I came back to DLP from having owned a JVC NX7. DLP, has ...well... that DLP look...glossy, high ANSI contrast, different appearance to its line precision (especially single chip), outstanding motion for projection --especially the three chippers. And with this three chipper (having over 21,000:1 on/off contrast on tap), I never even felt like I needed more.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Interesting BDHT. It very well may be the pixel response and LCD overshooting.

I 100% agree motion rendering is what DLP excels at and for my eye balls it is extremely important.
I can live with lesser contrast, but can't live with blurry motion for example.
All the LCD motion drive gimmicks have helped, and people often argue here on the forum that it's no longer an issue differentiating the technologies, I disagree.

That's why I like simple tests such as shimmering water or fire, they tell me tons about the things I care about in the image. Haloing, colour gradient, motion rendering. Hard to fake the realism as they are such familiar images in our brains.

The problem is I can't just pull out my light meter, measure, divide and come up with a ratio that extrapolates the quality of the image I am seeing.

There is a fairly well defined relationship between contrast ratio and quality of the image.
Everyone has a number in their head they are comfortable with.
What is the sufficient pixel response time of the imager that creates reference level motion rendering? I don't have hard numbers I can throw around, but I do know when I see it.

Still, I am with you on the 2160p LCos imager, it has made a perceptual difference. It's a cleaner image overall, although it still suffers from motion stability when compared to DLP.

I have not seen RS4500 as per Mike's comments, but I am sure the optics on that unit take it to another level from my NX5. Would love to track down one of those lenses on Ebay and slap it on.
 

·
Guest
Joined
·
867 Posts
DLP on the other hand works on electrostatic attraction(stax headphones anyone?), and moves the mirror to the exact correct position instanteously.
That exact correct position being either full on or full off. DLP mirrors rapidly flick on and off to fool the eye into seeing shades. And single chip projectors rapidly create sequential red, green, blue images to fool the eye into seeing a full color image. How DLP works to create a image is far from natural. That it works at all is a amazing.

Three chip DLP is said to create better images in part because it has more time to make each shade and does not rely on sequential color.
 
281 - 300 of 1114 Posts
Top