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Discussion Starter · #1 ·



I played with the Dish 6000 in a Sears show room

during my lunch hour today. Actually changed

channels and aspect ratios - right there on the

show floor.



They had the 6000 (actually the JVC version)

somehow wired to three separate TVs. If

I changed the channel on the 6000, the picture

changed on all three TVs.



I really didn't pay attention to the HD channels

since I assumed that those would look great.


I wanted to see how the "partial stretch/zoom" mode

looked on a widescreen TV when converting a 4:3

SD source to a 16:9 display.



I'm not sure why - but I thought the quality

was poor - even for channels that I assumed

would look solid (like the HBO SD channels).


Someone on here posted something about one

of the echostar birds sustaining some damage

during a recent collision with a micro-meteor.


Perhaps that was a contributing factor ?


Or perhaps it was the splitter that sears was using

to divide one Dish 6000 between three TVs

(presumeably an analog splitter) ?



The pictures looked better when displayed

as native 4:3 (with grey bars or black bars

on the left and right). The "partial zoom/stretch"

definetly softened the image.


My gut feel is that these scaling operations

are very sensitive to the quality of the

original input. If the channel is greatly

compressed, the probability of a pleasing

"zoom" or "stretch" operation greatly decreases.



With this in mind, I'm wondering if a

8VSB ota broadcast is likely to produce

more pleasing results ? (sears didn't

even know they sell an 8VSB tuner)


Or do the ota broadcasters also compress

the hell out of their digital spectrum so

they can transmit oodles of subchannels ?



Apparently the magic of compression has

opened pandora's box. It appears that

everything being transmitted (by RF and

satellite) assumes that the viewing

audience has a 19" television.


I don't think my 55" screen is outlandishly

large. But I definetly feel like the

broadcasters are "dumbing" down the signal

at a point in time when large televisions

are leaping off the shelf.


And I'm not talking about about the small

amount of HDTV content. The SD channels

are looking worse and worse as more and

more of them are added...


Can't get that Springsteen song out of

my head... "57 channels and nothing

on" (or in my case, worth watching

on a monitor larger than 19")

 

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I have noticed many channels seem soft the past few days (probably the satellite problems). But the premium channels (like HBO) always seem to be less compressed than the other ones.


In my experience, the OTA digital transmissions are much less compressed than the stuff on the satellite. During the day here, ABC, CBS, and FOX upconvert and simulcast their analog channels over their digital feeds. These feeds are generally a high quality, although each station seems to have set a different "softness" setting.


I've often noticed how much the artifacts seem to compound. For instance, on the game show network (which seems to use a lot of compression over Dish) I can easily see big blocky artifacts, even when viewing on my old 27" direct view. But on the 55" Mits, it really compounds the problem when I stretch the picture, since those blocks get even bigger and the stretch mode seems to not smooth very well between pixels.


btw - I've noticed you seem to be seriously shopping for the Dish 6000 at Sears. That's where I bought mine, mainly because they matched the best price I could find on the internet ($350 for everything, including both dishes).


------------------

- Jeff
 

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In normal times, the terrestrial SDTV is better than satellite SDTV since most of the terrestrial broadcasters don't have anything else to broadcast so why bother compressing heavily?


Lately, the terrestrial SDTV has been way better than satellite but that is probably because of E* satellite problems.
 

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Apparently the magic of compression has

opened pandora's box. It appears that

everything being transmitted (by RF and

satellite) assumes that the viewing

audience has a 19" television.



Yep. A 100" screen size works well with DVD, but is useless for displaying DBS SD pictures which require a 40-70" screen to look decent. We need a way to vary screen size with the source quality without risking tube burn.
 

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I agree with Dagman, I found the OTA SD channels to be superior to the satellite SD. I dropped the locals shortly after I had the OTA module working.
 

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I agree also, ota sd is better. I have three comparisons with my panny 65wx50; cable, dss & ota. Locals are far superior in ota. Now,if we could get more locals on a predictable schedule we would be in heaven.

gebstr83
 
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