[Rigwald]

Hello!


I am looking to add audio to our pool area. I don't have a whole house audio system, so this will be a stand alone system.


I received a quote from one place, that was well over $3000, which is way over our possible budget.


I really don't know what is needed to make it happen. The quote suggested 4 speakers around the pool and 2 on the deck. They suggested Bose 251's. After doing some research, I found people like the Yamaha NS-AW390's at about 1/2 the cost.


I guess I am looking for advise as to what I really need. I don't understand amplifiers and how they go together with speakers and are separate from a receiver. (For example, how many channels needed, etc....). If need be, the pool speakers can suffice for listening on the deck. Budget is around $1000. I've attached a picture of a diagram showing the area affected.


If this isn't the right place for this post, I apologize. I am just trying to find good, honest advice.


Thanks!

 

[Rigwald]

Ok, let me ask this. The original quote included a 12 channel amp at ~$1250 (Niles Si-1230). For 6 speakers, do I need 12 channels? Doesn't each speaker use a channel?


They suggested the Onkyo TX-NR709 (for ~$650) as well. I would like a receiver that accepts USB (for media player input), but I don't really need a home theater system for the pool area. Anybody know of a stereo receiver that accepts USB?


Any other advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[kwkshift]

If you like the place you got the quote from, just go back to them and tell them your budget is about $1000. Then ask what they could do for that. The system will be cut down, but they may have a 2-part solution that will allow future growth so your system is the way you want it down the road.

 

[Rigwald]

I have, but I didn't get much from them other than "give me a call". I get the impression they want to strong sell me the big system and don't want to consider cheaper alternatives.

 

[tighr]

Is the original quote for $3000 including installation? This could explain parts of the high cost. Installation of six speakers with hidden wires would be quite costly if contracted out, and seems reasonable. Actually, for a fully installed system, that's very reasonable.


I'm looking at doing something similar for my pool/patio area, also in the four-six channel range, but was going to spec out the components myself (with advice from AVS).

 

[Chicagorep]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigwald /forum/post/20828277


Ok, let me ask this. The original quote included a 12 channel amp at ~$1250 (Niles Si-1230). For 6 speakers, do I need 12 channels? Doesn't each speaker use a channel?


They suggested the Onkyo TX-NR709 (for ~$650) as well. I would like a receiver that accepts USB (for media player input), but I don't really need a home theater system for the pool area. Anybody know of a stereo receiver that accepts USB?


Any other advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

They are probably going to bridge two channels to give you more power to each speaker. Niles amps and outdoor speakers are hard to beat. Their outdoor speakers have a life time warranty.

 

[Rigwald]

The quote was equipment only, not installation. For something that will be used during the summer only, 1-2 parties a season, etc... $3000+ is overkill. $1250 for the amp itself is out of the question. While the parts might be top notch, that doesn't mean they fit both the job and the budget.


Would something like this work? (I am trying to learn how to match things and understand the terminology.)

RX-V471 Receiver
Yamaha NS-AW390 x 4


Since the receiver has 5 channels, could each channel handle the main audio on a separate speaker or are the channels each different and devoted solely to surround sound creation?

 

[tighr]

To be honest with you, for a patio system you're not looking to get high quality 5.1 surround sound. The speakers are outside, so there is no "room" to fill with the ambiance of the audio. You're really just looking for an amp that can push outdoor speakers, and any $100 amp at Best Buy will do that. $1250 for an amp is overkill; most people don't even have that amp in their living rooms, where they DO expect 5.1 or 7.1 digital surround.

 

[Rigwald]

That's my thought about the $1250 amp. I just don't know enough to be able to know WHAT to look for in an amp to match up with the speakers. Thanks why I'm here.

 

[schan1269]

Bose speakers are WAY overpriced.


Granted my solution(last time I designed an outdoor area, which was 2 weeks ago) was this...

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_no...+xod65&x=0&y=0 (this is my favorite "go to" outdoor speaker...the price is right for the sound you get, and this is "per pair")

http://www.amazon.com/Harman-Kardon-...3601171&sr=1-1 (I really used one of these...it is a beast)


Their system was 8 speakers with an RS232 control from an existing indoor receiver(which you NEED TO ADD to your system)


You "could" get away with a standard 7.1 receiver running 6 channels(basically setting it up minus the center) and doing it permanently in "all channel stereo" mode.


So, if you were to buy 6 of those XOD65 and this...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Marantz-SR-7500-...ht_3169wt_1396


You would be well within your budget.


The ONLY limitation to running a single AVR in "all channel stereo" is the lack of individual volume all over the yard(which technically wouldn't be true, you could always lower/raise individual speakers, just like you would during "room correction")


This "contractor" you contacted, probably has these XOD65. They usually don't recommend the XOD65 cause they only make X dollars with them as opposed to the XXXX they make from the Bose 251.

 

[Rigwald]

Thanks Schan!


The speakers around the pool really wouldn't need to have separate volume control, so that isn't an issue.


So you are saying, that it would be possible to take a 5.1 or 7.1 home theater receiver and pump out to the speakers and still achieve stereo and not have some speakers with muted sounds due to "surround sound" settings? If so, I think that makes my life a little easier when trying to find something with a usb input.


I will go take a look at those speakers as well. Thanks for the advice!

 

[Rigwald]

After a lot of web searching and product reading, I think I got something that can work! (If not, please let me know.

)

Onkyo TX-NR609 Network Receiver

Onkyo UWF-1 Wireless Adapter (USB for access to network)


This gives me the opportunity for 7 channels of 100 watts at 8 Ohms (and it will handle 6 ohms if I understand the manual correctly):

Quote:
You can connect speakers with an impedance of between 6 and

16 ohms. If you use speakers with a lower impedance,

and use the amplifier at high volume levels for a long

period of time, the built-in amp protection circuit may be

activated.

Now the question of speakers. I don't know if this is too powerful for the Yamaha speakers. They are max 130 watt and 40 watt nominal . Is this a problem or am I misunderstanding something?


I haven't been able to find a lot of information on the Xod65's to be able to compare them to the others I have seen.

 

[schan1269]

Xantech makes good stuff, and they don't advertise. Their "advertisement" is the fact everything they make works.


Xantech's major claim to fame. They STARTED the entire idea of controlled AV equipment when hidden.


Anyway...


No you don't have anything to worry about with an NR609 and the speakers you chose.

 

[mshelby69]

I have ON-Q 100w speakers from Lowes. They are about $100.00. and a 2nd pair of Insignia™ - Simulated Rock Outdoor Speakers (Pair) 100w also about $100.00 they sound great. The only problem is I hook it up to my home receiver that I carry out to the pool every time I want to use it.


Can anyone suggest an outdoor receiver?

 

[underminded999]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mshelby69  /t/1354111/outdoor-audio-around-pool#post_22383727


Can anyone suggest an outdoor receiver?

I do not believe there is such a thing.  Any and all receivers/AVRs/Amps have electronix that do not do well outside of their optimal working environment, i.e. your Living Room.

 

Most people just run their outside speaker wires into the house, be-it in the LR, or somewhere else, to keep the AVR safe from the elements.  That is why many want an AVR that can be controlled via a tablet device, or some other control feature.

 

If you do plan on keeping your AVR/Amp outside, make sure it is not exposed to any moisture, and has a clean source of power.  Please also note, most AVR/Amps generate heat, which depending on the ambient outside temperate, may cause condensation within the unit.  This would be very, very bad for the unit, which is again, why most keep the actual unit inside the house.

 

[jdoostil]

why not just get a couple of Sonos Play 5s and call it a day?

 

[yaomizzle]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jdoostil  /t/1354111/outdoor-audio-around-pool#post_22391102


why not just get a couple of Sonos Play 5s and call it a day?

I approve this message


Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk 2

 

[arnyk]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigwald  /t/1354111/outdoor-audio-around-pool#post_20828277


Ok, let me ask this. The original quote included a 12 channel amp at ~$1250 (Niles Si-1230). For 6 speakers, do I need 12 channels? Doesn't each speaker use a channel?

Obviously 12 channels for 6 speakers is vast overkill.


To answer your question you could operate all six speakers from a single amplifier or receiver. If all you want is background music, you can probably run dozens of speakers from one receiver.

Quote:
They suggested the Onkyo TX-NR709 (for ~$650) as well. I would like a receiver that accepts USB (for media player input), but I don't really need a home theater system for the pool area.

The real truth is that a system like this would probably work well if it were mono.

Quote:
Anybody know of a stereo receiver that accepts USB?

You are going to irritate me if you ask questions like this that can be answered with a single simple Google retrieval. ;-) The other questions actually took a little knowledge to answer...


My retrieval was based on the three words: USB AVR receiver, and I got dozens of hits that stood up to further investigation. The lowest cost one that I found was a Yamaha RX 373 for less than $250. It would do everything that you need and far more.


Here what I think is going on. The labor and design time to actually install the speakers could turn out to be a bit costly. By packing in overpriced components, the proposal can be made to look more reasonable to a naive consumer because there is a better apparent balance between the the cost of the equipment and the cost of the installation.


Besides, with that beautiful pool, people are guessing that you aren't exactly living off of food stamps, if you catch my drift. ;-) Not that it hasn't happened. :-(

 

[arnyk]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mshelby69  /t/1354111/outdoor-audio-around-pool#post_22383727


Can anyone suggest an outdoor receiver?

I rather suspect that everybody who uses a receiver outdoors uses a indoor-rated receiver in an outdoor-rated enclosure.


Again this is just the first hit to a google retrival based on: outdoor equipment enclosure that yielded many usable hits:

http://www.amprod.us/t-outdoor_enclosures.aspx




The way you use home components in an enclosure like this is to get some shelves for about $50 each. Watch the depths! You've got height to burn!


As far as heat goes, on hot days you use it with the door open. On cool days, it probably won't matter unless you are blasting the speakers. I'm sure that there are outdoor rated cabinets with ventilation. Google is your friend!


You could easily fit a receiver and a Blu ray player in there for just playing music. You could store media. You'd need some underground rated AC wiring to bring power out to it. No matter what you choose, this will probably be the most expensive single component in your outdoor system.

 

[wishiwasfishing]

If you have yet to resolve your outdoor project inqusition...check out this incredible product:
www.outdooraudio.com