[wrinklefree]

Plasma fans should head over to Twit.tv to hear the live broadcast of Home Theater Geeks. Todays guest is Pioneer's former plasma guru Josh Kairoff.


Josh theorizes about Panasonic's black level issue.


Link is here: http://live.twit.tv/

 

[mustangs1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinklefree /forum/post/18358307


Plasma fans should head over to Twit.tv to hear the live broadcast of Home Theater Geeks. Todays guest is Pioneer's former plasma guru Josh Kairoff.


Josh theorizes about Panasonic's black level issue.


Link is here: http://live.twit.tv/

What did he say?

 

[chillspace]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mustangs1 /forum/post/18358372


What did he say?

It's a live broadcast.

 

[mustangs1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by chillspace /forum/post/18358378


It's a live broadcast.

I was wondering if he already talked about it

 

[chillspace]

They're talking about it right now.

 

[jackal2001]

I heard somthing about the members here on this forum, then the are talking about stuff in the past.

Anyone hear anything about the Panny rising black level?


Who is asking the questions? He said he does calibrations for people.

 

[45rpm]



Quote:
Originally Posted by jackal2001 /forum/post/18358490


I heard somthing about the members here on this forum, then the are talking about stuff in the past.

Anyone hear anything about the Panny rising black level?


Who is asking the questions? He said he does calibrations for people.

They talked about black level, in general.

According to them, for most people, normal viewing condition is a dimly lit room not a completely dark room and in a normal viewing condition, .035 to .045 mll is acceptable.

 

[ClarkeBar]

Yeah, that's why Pioneer was shooting for .001.

Just like politicians, you can't trust anything anyone supposedly in the know says anymore.

 

[jackal2001]

I missed the good stuff if there was any. Nothing I saw was related to the black levels and panny. IF anyone can find a repost of this broadcast, let us know.

 

[Panaman88]

You guys won't shoot me for bringing up another non-scientific evaluation, I hope. Anyway today I was over at a buddy's house that has a Sony Trinitron CRT and I couldn't help but notice how the letterbox bars looked grayish (far from black) even at a quick glance. I just thought this was kinda suprising as I expected nothing but inky blacks from that model. I flipped through a few channels while there and then returned home to see that my panny actually had blacker bars than the Trinitron on the same source material.


This post is in no way meant to defend Panasonic and it current issues, however, it does make me wonder if that Trintron was dropping some black level with it's age. (It was an older model but I can't recall what year.)


Edit: I plan on investigating further with settings and such.

 

[XStanleyX]



Quote:
Originally Posted by 45rpm /forum/post/18358573


They talked about black level, in general.

According to them, for most people, normal viewing condition is a dimly lit room not a completely dark room and in a normal viewing condition, .35 to .45 mll is acceptable.

I'll bet he doesn't own a display with that mll. If he did he'd get rid of it quick.

 

[Audiotitis]



Quote:
Originally Posted by Panaman88 /forum/post/18358669


You guys won't shoot me for bringing up another non-scientific evaluation, I hope. Anyway today I was over at a buddy's house that has a Sony Trinitron CRT and I couldn't help but notice how the letterbox bars looked grayish (far from black) even at a quick glance. I just thought this was kinda suprising as I expected nothing but inky blacks from that model. I flipped through a few channels while there and then returned home to see that my panny actually had blacker bars than the Trinitron on the same source material.


This post is in no way meant to defend Panasonic and it current issues, however, it does make me wonder if that Trintron was dropping some black level with it's age. (It was an older model but I can't recall what year.)


Edit: I plan on investigating further with settings and such.

Was it in a moderately dark room ? CRT's wash out in light easily. I do not think the blacks of a CRT change over time. Or at least over several years.

 

[mustangs1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkeBar /forum/post/18358628


Yeah, that's why Pioneer was shooting for .001.

Just like politicians, you can't trust anything anyone supposedly in the know says anymore.

Thats a misquote, he was saying 35 ftl of brightness output.

 

[MountainMan10]



Quote:
Originally Posted by 45rpm /forum/post/18358573


They talked about black level, in general.

According to them, for most people, normal viewing condition is a dimly lit room not a completely dark room and in a normal viewing condition, .35 to .45 mll is acceptable.

I think you mean 0.035 to 0.045

 

[TV-Junky]



Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice /forum/post/18357568

"Men lie. Women lie. Numbers don't."

Numbers lie?


i see,you never read the roman called "Little Prince".


You are just a fanatic dreamer...nothing else


Calm down! Rest in peace and enjoy your Pioneer as I sad before...

and please: go!


Josh

 

[XStanleyX]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TV-Junky /forum/post/18358757


Numbers lie?


i see,you never read the roman called "Little Prince".


You are just a fanatic dreamer...nothing else


Calm down! Rest in peace and enjoy your Pioneer as I sad before...

and please: go!


Josh

He'll rest in peace when you go away.

 

[fahrenheit]

What Josh was saying about Pioneer's own voltage adjustments was interesting.

He said that they took a lot of time inspecting all three channels (RGB) usage individually and slowly increased voltage as subtly as possible so to be "invisible" to the end-user.

He speculated that Panasonic simply hadn't taken the same level of care with a more heavy-handed implementation.


Sounds reasonable.

 

[mustangs1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by TV-Junky /forum/post/18358757


Numbers lie?


i see,you never read the roman called "Little Prince".


You are just a fanatic dreamer...nothing else


Calm down! Rest in peace and enjoy your Pioneer as I sad before...

and please: go!


Josh

WTF??? You completely missed the boat on this post

 

[wrinklefree]



Quote:
Originally Posted by mustangs1 /forum/post/18358687


Thats a misquote, he was saying 35 ftl of brightness output.

Thats correct they were talking about ftL, or the peak white level brightness.


Here's some highlights of the podcast:


1. Josh says any decent Plasma manufacturer makes some kind of adjustments over time to compensate for picture wear.

2. ISF did a long term test with certain plasma sets (didnt say when) and found contrast ratio actually increased with age, as blacks got blacker.

3. He theorizes someone goofed at Panasonic but then brings up an interesting point. If certain components get swapped, typically some kind of counter needs to be "reset" or set so the components work in time sync together. Josh wonders how this is being dealt with at Panasonic.


The Pioneer service menu specifically states procedures on how to do this when certain parts are replaced. I wonder if the same goes for Panny's.


Anyway you should be able to download the podcast in 1-2 days at http://twit.tv

 

[mustangs1]



Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinklefree /forum/post/18358841

Thats correct they were talking about ftL, or the peak white level brightness.


Here's some highlights of the podcast:


1. Josh says any decent Plasma manufacturer makes some kind of adjustments over time to compensate for picture wear.

2. ISF did a long term test with certain plasma sets (didnt say when) and found contrast ratio actually increased with age, as blacks got blacker.

3. He theorizes someone goofed at Panasonic but then brings up an interesting point. If certain components get swapped, typically some kind of counter needs to be "reset" or set so the components work in time sync together. Josh wonders how this is being dealt with at Panasonic.


The Pioneer service menu specifically states procedures on how to do this when certain parts are replaced. I wonder if the same goes for Panny's.


Anyway you should be able to download the podcast in 102 days at http://twit.tv

102 days???