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Problems with Panasonic plasmas or not?

  • Own an S10 and HAVE had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Own a G10 and HAVE had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Own a V10 and HAVE had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Own an S10 and have NOT had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Own a G10 and have NOT had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Own a V10 and have NOT had problems

    Votes: 0 0.0%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
There are apparently numerous people with black levels rising or THX related issues with their 2009 Panasonic S1, G10, and V10 plasma sets. However there also seem to be plenty of posters with no issues at all. I was curious what the ratio is between those with problems and those without.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by robi1138 /forum/post/17891145


There are apparently numerous people with black levels rising or THX related issues with their 2009 Panasonic S10, G10, and V10 plasma sets. However there also seem to be plenty of posters with no issues at all. I was curious what the ratio is between those with problems and those without.

FYI, I don't think the S10 exists. I have 58" S1 and my black levels are the same.


Cheers,

Joe
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I meant S1
 

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heres my 50" S1 in a total dark room, pretty happy with the black levels so far. My set has 225 hours on it. The black letterbox bars above and below almost blend right in to the bezel. My tv is OCT 09 build date.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by robi1138 /forum/post/17891145


I was curious what the ratio is between those with problems and those without.

Well, your poll will not answer this question. Those with problems are more likely to respond, so you're not going to get any read on the ratio.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP /forum/post/17892722


Well, your poll will not answer this question. Those with problems are more likely to respond, so you're not going to get any read on the ratio.

And some people only come to AVS when they have a problem.
 

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I've only had my V10 for a couple of weeks but it looks great out of the box especially with the Oppo 83 I bought. Gregg Loewen will be making a visit by the end of the month to do his magic.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP /forum/post/17892722


Well, your poll will not answer this question. Those with problems are more likely to respond, so you're not going to get any read on the ratio.

Hmmm...so far it's (6) with problems and (25) without...so much for that theory.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by robi1138 /forum/post/17891145


There are apparently numerous people with black levels rising or THX related issues with their 2009 Panasonic S1, G10, and V10 plasma sets. However there also seem to be plenty of posters with no issues at all. I was curious what the ratio is between those with problems and those without.


Great thread!



Will help people who are considering buying a new panny.


Will help people who have a panny and wonder how pervasive some of these issues may be.


Though it is just a poll,

and some people may take it; some may not,

it is better than the proverbial nothing.
 

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I own a V10, voted "yes" on problems. By "problems" I mean the TV's insane ABL or auto-brightness or whatever it is that causes things to get brighter or dimmer whenever the TV decides it's necessary.


The most MADDENING cases are on animated shows like The Simpsons or The Cleveland Show where, with nothing else happening in the scene except for the animated character's mouth moving while they talk (which is a small fraction of the screen area), the ENTIRE SCREEN rapidly changes brightness level, going brighter and dimmer in sync with the movement of the mouth! I wish I could capture this on video so you could see how bad it is but I don't have a camcorder.


If I could get rid of that problem I'd be a whole lot happier with this TV. Anyone with a 54V10 who has not seen this problem must have the Contrast set below about 50. At any setting above about 60 this problem is easy to see and to reproduce. (I'm using Custom picture mode).
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldVinyl /forum/post/17897000


I own a V10, voted "yes" on problems. By "problems" I mean the TV's insane ABL or auto-brightness or whatever it is that causes things to get brighter or dimmer whenever the TV decides it's necessary.


The most MADDENING cases are on animated shows like The Simpsons or The Cleveland Show where, with nothing else happening in the scene except for the animated character's mouth moving while they talk (which is a small fraction of the screen area), the ENTIRE SCREEN rapidly changes brightness level, going brighter and dimmer in sync with the movement of the mouth! I wish I could capture this on video so you could see how bad it is but I don't have a camcorder.


If I could get rid of that problem I'd be a whole lot happier with this TV. Anyone with a 54V10 who has not seen this problem must have the Contrast set below about 50. At any setting above about 60 this problem is easy to see and to reproduce. (I'm using Custom picture mode).



Turn C.A.T.S off in the picture menu and it stops it from adjusting it for you.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Highlander /forum/post/17897058


Turn C.A.T.S off in the picture menu and it stops it from adjusting it for you.

Sorry, that does NOT fix the problem for me. I've played around with all the user settings over and over and there is no user setting that eliminates the problem EXCEPT to turn the Contrast way way down to the point where the picture is far too dim. I've posted about this issue in several other threads. The replies are about evenly divided between "That's just how plasma is" and "You need to turn off C.A.T.S." (or AGC). I also started a thread just to ask if it's possible to disable ABL in the service menu, and got no definitive responses.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldVinyl /forum/post/17897188


Sorry, that does NOT fix the problem for me. I've played around with all the user settings over and over and there is no user setting that eliminates the problem EXCEPT to turn the Contrast way way down to the point where the picture is far too dim. I've posted about this issue in several other threads. The replies are about evenly divided between "That's just how plasma is" and "You need to turn off C.A.T.S." (or AGC). I also started a thread just to ask if it's possible to disable ABL in the service menu, and got no definitive responses.

I've never had that issue, so I can't see how that's just the way plasma is. It sounds like something is faulty on the tv (sensor wise) and or board wise. I hope you can get this addressed and sorry for not being able to help you.


Regards,
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Highlander /forum/post/17897293


I've never had that issue, so I can't see how that's just the way plasma is. It sounds like something is faulty on the tv (sensor wise) and or board wise. I hope you can get this addressed and sorry for not being able to help you.


Regards,

I'm assuming you have a V10? Do you only watch Blu-ray, or do you also view HD TV shows?


Anyway I encourage every V10 owner to try this on your set and see what happens:


Turn the Contrast down very low, like say 30. Freeze on a bright image, like some kind of animated content or a beach scene or something having lots of bright content and little or no dark areas. Must be a fullscreen image too, not letterboxed or pillarboxed. Now start raising the Contrast level and see if there's a threshold where the screen suddenly gets darker instead of brighter. For example you might step from 75 to 76 and the screen gets darker. It appears that once you find that threshold, you've found the brightest overall level the TV will allow, regardless of the actual Contrast setting.


Now imagine the TV dynamically adjusting the image intensity based on what's happening on the screen.


Someone mentioned that the default Contrast setting of 100 in THX mode is ridiculous since any Contrast setting above 70 does not measurably impact the picture at all. Which begs the question for me, Why is the default Contrast setting maxed out at 100?


Also I've seen this problem on other Panasonic plasmas and Samsung plasmas on display at Best Buy. You might have to watch for it for a long time but eventually it happens on at least some other plasmas.


Yes I'm angry about this problem and I take every opportunity to mention it on the forum, in hopes that *someone* will post a fix for it like how to disable ABL in the service menus. I know I should contact Panasonic but I'm 98% sure they will say there is no problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldVinyl /forum/post/17897364


I'm assuming you have a V10? Do you only watch Blu-ray, or do you also view HD TV shows?


Anyway I encourage every V10 owner to try this on your set and see what happens:


Turn the Contrast down very low, like say 30. Freeze on a bright image, like some kind of animated content or a beach scene or something having lots of bright content and little or no dark areas. Must be a fullscreen image too, not letterboxed or pillarboxed. Now start raising the Contrast level and see if there's a threshold where the screen suddenly gets darker instead of brighter. For example you might step from 75 to 76 and the screen gets darker. It appears that once you find that threshold, you've found the brightest overall level the TV will allow, regardless of the actual Contrast setting.


Now imagine the TV dynamically adjusting the image intensity based on what's happening on the screen.


Someone mentioned that the default Contrast setting of 100 in THX mode is ridiculous since any Contrast setting above 70 does not measurably impact the picture at all. Which begs the question for me, Why is the default Contrast setting maxed out at 100?


Also I've seen this problem on other Panasonic plasmas and Samsung plasmas on display at Best Buy. You might have to watch for it for a long time but eventually it happens on at least some other plasmas.


Yes I'm angry about this problem and I take every opportunity to mention it on the forum, in hopes that *someone* will post a fix for it like how to disable ABL in the service menus. I know I should contact Panasonic but I'm 98% sure they will say there is no problem.

Did what you said but I don't have that problem. Picked a bright image and was able to crank Contrast to 100 on every picture mode without noticing a drop in white level...sounds like yours may be defective.


Btw, so far it's (9) with problems, (44) without
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by hplaceavs /forum/post/17896572


Great thread!



Will help people who are considering buying a new panny.


Will help people who have a panny and wonder how pervasive some of these issues may be.


Though it is just a poll,

and some people may take it; some may not,

it is better than the proverbial nothing.

Thank you
 

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You need a poll where people's names will be revealed, in order to avoid having people who do not even own Panasonic TVs, casting negative votes.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldVinyl /forum/post/17897000


I own a V10, voted "yes" on problems. By "problems" I mean the TV's insane ABL or auto-brightness or whatever it is that causes things to get brighter or dimmer whenever the TV decides it's necessary.


The most MADDENING cases are on animated shows like The Simpsons or The Cleveland Show where, with nothing else happening in the scene except for the animated character's mouth moving while they talk (which is a small fraction of the screen area), the ENTIRE SCREEN rapidly changes brightness level, going brighter and dimmer in sync with the movement of the mouth! I wish I could capture this on video so you could see how bad it is but I don't have a camcorder.


If I could get rid of that problem I'd be a whole lot happier with this TV. Anyone with a 54V10 who has not seen this problem must have the Contrast set below about 50. At any setting above about 60 this problem is easy to see and to reproduce. (I'm using Custom picture mode).

Hi NewOldVinyl,


I am experiencing something very similar on my 50G10 so I voted as I had a problem. What happens for me is on certain scenes say a bright face for example or walled backdrops maybe too, I'll see a brightness shift or flicker say on that bright face. I find it quite distracting & turning off CATS doesn't stop it though it may lessen it some.


I posted about it here too in the big G10 thread. It's funny though as sometimes it happens alot & others not so much so to get it looked at by a tech would be tricky I believe in order to get it to occur.


I too believe the set is limiting overall brightness or contrast & throttling the image in my case in that section of the screen. I can offer no fix of course but I thought it would help to know you are not alone in this.


Cam
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenland /forum/post/17898817


You need a poll where people's names will be revealed, in order to avoid having people who do not even own Panasonic TVs, casting negative votes.

It would take a serious loser to that...hopefully there aren't too many out there...hopefully.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOldVinyl /forum/post/17897364


I'm assuming you have a V10? Do you only watch Blu-ray, or do you also view HD TV shows?


Anyway I encourage every V10 owner to try this on your set and see what happens:


Turn the Contrast down very low, like say 30. Freeze on a bright image, like some kind of animated content or a beach scene or something having lots of bright content and little or no dark areas. Must be a fullscreen image too, not letterboxed or pillarboxed. Now start raising the Contrast level and see if there's a threshold where the screen suddenly gets darker instead of brighter. For example you might step from 75 to 76 and the screen gets darker. It appears that once you find that threshold, you've found the brightest overall level the TV will allow, regardless of the actual Contrast setting.


Now imagine the TV dynamically adjusting the image intensity based on what's happening on the screen.


Someone mentioned that the default Contrast setting of 100 in THX mode is ridiculous since any Contrast setting above 70 does not measurably impact the picture at all. Which begs the question for me, Why is the default Contrast setting maxed out at 100?


Also I've seen this problem on other Panasonic plasmas and Samsung plasmas on display at Best Buy. You might have to watch for it for a long time but eventually it happens on at least some other plasmas.


Yes I'm angry about this problem and I take every opportunity to mention it on the forum, in hopes that *someone* will post a fix for it like how to disable ABL in the service menus. I know I should contact Panasonic but I'm 98% sure they will say there is no problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camster /forum/post/17898887


Hi NewOldVinyl,


I am experiencing something very similar on my 50G10 so I voted as I had a problem. What happens for me is on certain scenes say a bright face for example or walled backdrops maybe too, I'll see a brightness shift or flicker say on that bright face. I find it quite distracting & turning off CATS doesn't stop it though it may lessen it some.


I posted about it here too in the big G10 thread. It's funny though as sometimes it happens alot & others not so much so to get it looked at by a tech would be tricky I believe in order to get it to occur.


I too believe the set is limiting overall brightness or contrast & throttling the image in my case in that section of the screen. I can offer no fix of course but I thought it would help to know you are not alone in this.


Cam

ABL can't be turned off. If you could, your tv would burst to flames when showing white screen.

42 incher draws 440watts on white screen, so it has at least 500w power supply. Without ABL, power consumption could be very much higher, maybe 800watts on white screen. That would need 1Kw power supply. I can only imagine how hot 65 incher would get without ABL.


I'm nowhere expert, but I try to explain ABL like it was explained to me:

Imagine a white screen, consuming 440watts. Then black object appears on screen. Power consumption drops. ABL detects it is dropping, so it adjusts the picture more bright. So the black stays black but white background gets brighter but power consumption stays the same. So when contrast is set high on plasmas, stars of night sky are many times brighter than for example picture of arctic on bright sunlight.


On european models, cinema-mode have standard contrast setting of 36 (out of 60). But anything over 36 there's no increase in brightness. Even when theres a black screen with one tiny white dot. Zero. But on completely white screen, the screen is still as bright as in Normal or Dynamic mode. Good news is there's no "floating whites" like other picture-modes when contrast is set (too) high. It must have been easier to panasonic just use same 0-60 scale than in other picture modes than just modify the scale to 0-36 just for cinema-mode (or 0-70 in THX on US models).


I think THX-mode in US is just like Cinema-mode in EU. Both are preventing floating whites. I'm not sure but I think THX mode in US is little bit odd, because I've heard it is dimmer than cinema-mode in EU. Should consume less power, but is not as suitable for daylight viewing.


...sorry my english.
 
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