Paradigm Reference Signature Sub 25
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Yea 3000 watts sustained with a peak of 7500 watts. 3in Peak to Peak. Retail of $3999.
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/12/09...ips-dives-dee/
Doesn't look too bad either.
On the site they say due to the powerful nature of this sub, the grill is not removable.
http://www.paradigm.com/en/reference...-4-20.paradigm
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/12/09...ips-dives-dee/
Doesn't look too bad either.
On the site they say due to the powerful nature of this sub, the grill is not removable.
http://www.paradigm.com/en/reference...-4-20.paradigm
Yes when I originally posted I thought the sub had already been released.
Interesting /dev/null!! I did not notice that the sub was not servo controlled until you mentioned something about it, I just assumed that it was!
Paradigm emailed me the PDF spec sheets for the SUB-25 and PBK-1.
Some tid bits:
-4 horsepower
-125 db output
-accurate to 9Hz
-it has no power transformer, (big transformers are heavy but the sub still weighs 114 pounds) the output stages are directly connected to the power line.
-37 pound magnet and a 3" peak to peak travel on the woofer
-new redesigned beefier cabinet construction
-up to ten positions can be measured with the perfect bass kit
-the PBK™ applies Correction to Peaks (modes) and Dips (anti-modes)
Anyways it looks very promising (especially with the perfect bass kit) and I am seriously thinking about buying one along with the PBK-1 without even hearing the system, or should a guy wait for the servo controlled version to come out?
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I would be upgrading from my current Servo-15 (which I love) and I would definitely run 240V to the new Sub 25.
I don't think Paradigm will mind me attaching the PDFs.
s
SUB-25_PDS.pdf 337.373046875k . file
PBK1_PDS.pdf 389.1513671875k . file
Interesting /dev/null!! I did not notice that the sub was not servo controlled until you mentioned something about it, I just assumed that it was!
Paradigm emailed me the PDF spec sheets for the SUB-25 and PBK-1.
Some tid bits:
-4 horsepower
-125 db output
-accurate to 9Hz
-it has no power transformer, (big transformers are heavy but the sub still weighs 114 pounds) the output stages are directly connected to the power line.
-37 pound magnet and a 3" peak to peak travel on the woofer
-new redesigned beefier cabinet construction
-up to ten positions can be measured with the perfect bass kit
-the PBK™ applies Correction to Peaks (modes) and Dips (anti-modes)
Anyways it looks very promising (especially with the perfect bass kit) and I am seriously thinking about buying one along with the PBK-1 without even hearing the system, or should a guy wait for the servo controlled version to come out?
I don't think Paradigm will mind me attaching the PDFs.
s
SUB-25_PDS.pdf 337.373046875k . file
PBK1_PDS.pdf 389.1513671875k . file
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They kinda screwed up on the power requirements... That should read 20 amp circuit on a 220v line, and a 30amp circuit on a 110v circuit..
"Due to the incredibly high power and tremendous output the SUB 25's grille is non-removable."
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Give me a freakin break..
"Due to the incredibly high power and tremendous output the SUB 25's grille is non-removable."
Read up a bit, and you'll know why.
Looking at the previous Paradigm Signature sub's performance, this sub has to be a lot better to be able to compete with ID sub's performance like the SVS PB13 Ultra, Epik Conquest, and etc.
9Hz doesn't mean it will have usable output at 9Hz. No single commercial subwoofer can reproduce a 9Hz tone at usable volume (110dB). It also doesn't say whether it is flat to 9Hz, which is impossible without EQ. It can be 15dB down at 9 Hz, which is not so "good".
Read up a bit, and you'll know why.
Looking at the previous Paradigm Signature sub's performance, this sub has to be a lot better to be able to compete with ID sub's performance like the SVS PB13 Ultra, Epik Conquest, and etc.
9Hz doesn't mean it will have usable output at 9Hz. No single commercial subwoofer can reproduce a 9Hz tone at usable volume (110dB). It also doesn't say whether it is flat to 9Hz, which is impossible without EQ. It can be 15dB down at 9 Hz, which is not so "good".
If it can be flat down to 9hz, which I'm hoping for, it will be amazing. I don't think they'd advertise 9hz DIN, with a 15hz roll off. I could be naïve, but that would make them look pretty foolish, especially if its going to be reviewed. I'm hoping for these to be honest numbers because I want a sealed sub that's really good for home theater. This is why I keep looking at the jl audio subs. But I'll wait to listen to it and hope some reviews are available by magazines and members like Craigsub. Here's hoping all that power will help those numbers be accurate. Just imagine if it achieves 9hz at -3db!
There are a few ways to look at this:
1. Simple physics will tell you that is impossible. No single 15'' driver in a sealed enclosure can be -3dB at 9Hz without massive EQ boost at the low end.
2. They don't tell you anything about its 9Hz capability. They just said it can reach 9Hz. A 1'' tweeter can produce 9Hz, but at what SPL?
3. What if it's -3dB at 9Hz at 50dB? A subwoofer need to produce 110dB at 9Hz for useable 9Hz output. I can tell you that by rough estimate, it will take at least 5 SUB25 to produce 9Hz at 110dB.
I'm sure the SUB25 will be a fantastic sub, but the price/performance ratio is nowhere near ID sub's. I'm not even sure if it can outperform the SVS PB13 Ultra, an example of an excellent ID sub.
There are a few ways to look at this:
1. Simple physics will tell you that is impossible. No single 15'' driver in a sealed enclosure can be -3dB at 9Hz without massive EQ boost at the low end.
2. They don't tell you anything about its 9Hz capability. They just said it can reach 9Hz. A 1'' tweeter can produce 9Hz, but at what SPL?
3. What if it's -3dB at 9Hz at 50dB? A subwoofer need to produce 110dB at 9Hz for useable 9Hz output. I can tell you that by rough estimate, it will take at least 5 SUB25 to produce 9Hz at 110dB.
I'm sure the SUB25 will be a fantastic sub, but the price/performance ratio is nowhere near ID sub's. I'm not even sure if it can outperform the SVS PB13 Ultra, an example of an excellent ID sub.
I think if your room is the size of my bathroom, it could be possible.... but in my 8200^3 room - I don't care what 15" your running, it aint ever gunna be enough.
I call BS on Paradigms marketing hype...
Good Call....
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I think if your room is the size of my bathroom, it could be possible.... but in my 8200^3 room - I don't care what 15" your running, it aint ever gunna be enough.
I call BS on Paradigms marketing hype...
Quote:
Originally Posted by croseiv /forum/post/15446142
I'll keep my dual Ultras!![]()
Good Call....
I think it will out perform the ultra 13, but the price will keep the ultra ahead in most eyes. I was really considering getting the ultra 13, but I'm really set on getting a sealed sub. I just like the sonic qualities. At the same time I love movies, and feeling that super deep bass beat my body up. This is why I'm so excited about this sub. I wonder if I'm the only one. Hopefully not. I love paradigm speakers, and I hope they can produce a world class sub. Although my dream theater would have triad inroom platinums. But, I can't afford those now.
A superbly designed ported sub, like the PB13, will sound as good, if not better, than a sealed sub.
Read this. Read through all if you want, but post 1, 7, and 9 are the most significant.
http://www.***************.com/fusio...d/138686/tp/1/
Read this. Read through all if you want, but post 1, 7, and 9 are the most significant.
http://www.***************.com/fusio...d/138686/tp/1/
That link also shows you how good a sealed sub can be (re: JL113). I think this is more of what Paradigm has its sights set on. With the PBK, it has the potential of sounding extremely good in real world situations with good ease of setup too. I'm looking forward to seeing what this sub can do, the high voltage option is kind of intriguing, it's definitely a new innovation that maybe inspire other sub makers to do the same.
That link also shows you how good a sealed sub can be (re: JL113). I think this is more of what Paradigm has its sights set on. With the PBK, it has the potential of sounding extremely good in real world situations with good ease of setup too. I'm looking forward to seeing what this sub can do, the high voltage option is kind of intriguing, it's definitely a new innovation that maybe inspire other sub makers to do the same.
Thanks for the link. It was a really good idea. I wonder if they got together again for the eq, same position, treated room test. From what I read though, it seems that the price was the final ticket to victory. Output and quality were almost the same between the f113 and the pb13. Output going to to the ultra and quality going to the fathom, and the quality is what I'm interested in. I've been in a room with 4 subs and the output was great, but it wasn't as tight as I'd like. But I will say that svs did do a fantastic job with that sub. The amp needs to be replaced from the sounds of it. I would like to hear one properly set up. If anyone in the Toronto, GTA area is willing to let me audition it in their home, I'll bring the wine(or beverage of choice).
Question. Let's say the SUB 25 can't do 9hz at 110db, but it does at 100db. Are there any subs that can do that? I'm just asking. I haven't done any measurements to know. With all that power available and a 3 inch excursion, don't you think that would help its chances?
Thanks for the link. It was a really good idea. I wonder if they got together again for the eq, same position, treated room test. From what I read though, it seems that the price was the final ticket to victory. Output and quality were almost the same between the f113 and the pb13. Output going to to the ultra and quality going to the fathom, and the quality is what I'm interested in. I've been in a room with 4 subs and the output was great, but it wasn't as tight as I'd like. But I will say that svs did do a fantastic job with that sub. The amp needs to be replaced from the sounds of it. I would like to hear one properly set up. If anyone in the Toronto, GTA area is willing to let me audition it in their home, I'll bring the wine(or beverage of choice).
Question. Let's say the SUB 25 can't do 9hz at 110db, but it does at 100db. Are there any subs that can do that? I'm just asking. I haven't done any measurements to know. With all that power available and a 3 inch excursion, don't you think that would help its chances?
The only bad thing about that review is that they tested the PB13 in 10Hz mode. 15Hz mode is SVS's best mode because it gives up 1-2dB output above 20Hz for 10dB more output in around 15Hz range. GP tests have shown that the 10Hz mode gives 0.5Hz more extensive at a huge loss of output. GP tests show that the PB13 have about 6dB more output than the F113 starting below 40Hz.
Truthfully, while the F113 is a "better" music sub, the difference is splitting hairs. Unless you really listen for it, you won't tell a difference.
100dB at 9Hz is impossible as well. It might barely exceed 100dB at 20Hz at best. It will produce 90-92dB at best at 9hz.
Dbuudo07, don't worry about this 9Hz stuff, it won't matter. If you have a sub that can do 15Hz and up really well, then you're done. For true 10Hz stuff, you must go DIY (IB subwoofers). The return is not worth it IMO since there is barely any content with 10Hz.
The only bad thing about that review is that they tested the PB13 in 10Hz mode. 15Hz mode is SVS's best mode because it gives up 1-2dB output above 20Hz for 10dB more output in around 15Hz range. GP tests have shown that the 10Hz mode gives 0.5Hz more extensive at a huge loss of output. GP tests show that the PB13 have about 6dB more output than the F113 starting below 40Hz.
Truthfully, while the F113 is a "better" music sub, the difference is splitting hairs. Unless you really listen for it, you won't tell a difference.
100dB at 9Hz is impossible as well. It might barely exceed 100dB at 20Hz at best. It will produce 90-92dB at best at 9hz.
Dbuudo07, don't worry about this 9Hz stuff, it won't matter. If you have a sub that can do 15Hz and up really well, then you're done. For true 10Hz stuff, you must go DIY (IB subwoofers). The return is not worth it IMO since there is barely any content with 10Hz.
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