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I have narrowed down my search for budget speakers for my Yamaha Rxv-1300 to these 2 packages:


Axiom Epic 50:

Towers M50ti

Surrounds QS4

Centers VP100

Subwoofer EP175

$1567 CDN


Paradigm:

Phantom Towers

CC-170 Centre

ADP-170 rears

PDR10 sub

$1700-1800 CDN


Is it worth spending extra money for Paradigms. As I think Axioms look pretty good too and are cheaper. Any input will be appreciated.
 

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Kamal,


The price for the Epic 50 is $2166cdn. You listed the US price.


I have not heard the M50 or the Phantom Towers, but from the Paradigms and Axioms I have heard, I feel the Axioms offered better value.
 

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Any other opinions from anyone else who has compared these 2 brands? These 2 are at the top of my list right now. I have heard some Paradigms that another member here has, but unfortunately Axiom does not currently have anyone in the CO area willing to let others audition.
 

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i can help with this comparison. i own the paradigm cc-170, atoms, and titans, and also own axiom m2i bookshelf speakers. i think the axiom are easily the better speaker. i replaced the titan/cc-170 combination with three m2i's for the front of my home theater and the upgrade was definately worth it. i have heard second hand that axiom speakers actually compare really well to paradigm's studio series. what i know for sure though is that they're more accurate and refined than the paradigm performance series. i wouldn't hesitate to go with axiom over the paradigms you listed. im glad to help if you have any other question about these speakers.
 

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Hey Kaymal.... I dont want to hijack this thread but if your going to spend a bit on shipping why not through the Rockets into the consideration? Get both the Axiom and Rockets at the same time and A/B them then send back the one you like the least. Not that much in shipping if you consider that you will be living with these puppies for quite awhile. Sorry guys... I love Axiom and they are a great company... I just opted for the Rockets which are in the same price point.
 

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he lives in Canada. Rockets are made in China, he would pay an obscene amount of money once the Rockets pass thru customs. Made in the USA is subject to 14- 15% sales tax (depending on which province he lives), Any product imported that was manufactured outside the United States will be subjected with Sales Tax AND Duties. PLUS Brokerage fees that shipping company charges.


So yeah, that's what's keeping Canadians from importing the Rockets. If Mark Shifter had a warehouse in Canada, then that will be a new story. (Just like Amazon).
 

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I compared the two several months age and went with Axiom. I have the M-60 as fronts. I would also consider going with the larger Q-8 if your budget allows it. They sound great. I will tell you that the 175- as a bass is terffic for music but doesn't carry the bang you would expect from a sub during DVD playback. All in all , I'm very please with Axiom and their customer service too.
 

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If your busget is 1700 1800 you should be able to get the following (before tax)


4 Paradigm Mini Monitors $380 per pair 760

CC370 $350

PW 2200 12 inch sub. 800


$1900. These are the approximate prices I paid CDN but I have Monitor 7 fronts rather than 4 Minis. I did not buy EVERYTHING at once. I would think that you could get a dealer down to $1800 if you get the whole package.


I listed to the M 40s, M50s 60s and 80s. I did not like the 40s or 50s at all. The 80s rocked but were beyond my budget and amplification at the time. The 60s were also very nice but more expensive than what I bought.


Some people like the Dipole surrounds like the ADP or QS others like me prefer didrect speakers. I will say that dipoles are a poor value ($wise) becuse you are paying for extra drivers .


Your could probaly get down more in the $1500- 1600 reange if you SUBstitue PDR 12 for PW 2200. I think the PS series is crud.


Axioms are very nice I like them. I would not bother with the performance series Paradigms at your price point unless I HAD to have towers (WAFor something).


Regardless of what you get look elsewhere for a sub than axiom. It doesn't have to be Paradigm but the Axiom subs don't compare with many other similar $ subs.


I had a PDR 12 for a few years that was great for the $ but if it were me (and it was) I'd cut some $ somewhere to get the PW2200 especially with movies. Actually with the "NEW" PW2200 you might even find a deal on the series 2 Good luck.
 

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Don't go cheap now, because of your budget!


Buy what you can afford now, and then save up for the rest later. If you've got a $1800 cdn budget available now, then get the Axiom M60ti towers and the VP150 center channel. That's $1585 cdn. That get's you a long ways towards a REALLY kick butt HT setup. You'll still have $215 of your budget left to put into your surround speakers pot. Just save up another $435, and then you can order the QS8 surrounds. Then you can start saving for a Hsu sub.


Believe me, you'll only regret buying something you don't really want now. You'll never regret buying good stuff.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by spiffnme
Don't go cheap now, because of your budget!


Buy what you can afford now, and then save up for the rest later. If you've got a $1800 cdn budget available now, then get the Axiom M60ti towers and the VP150 center channel. That's $1585 cdn. That get's you a long ways towards a REALLY kick butt HT setup. You'll still have $215 of your budget left to put into your surround speakers pot. Just save up another $435, and then you can order the QS8 surrounds.


Believe me, you'll only regret buying something you don't really want now.
Here here!!! I absolutely love my M80ti's and would have been very upset (and had some serious buyers remorse) if I had gone the less expensive route. Buy what you can afford now, and save up for the rest later, you will not regret it! ;)
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by wuhoo
from what ive gathered, axioms are more warm and better suited to music. any idea how the rockets sound compared to axioms?
i don't believe anyone would classify axioms as warm. whether or not they are better suited for music is totally up to the individual.
 

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Quote:
Originally posted by spiffnme
Rockets are much more laid back than Axioms. Axiom's strong point is their clarity and detail.
i've heard both brands of speakers and would say without a doubt that Rockets are much warmer than the Axioms. While some feel the strength of the Axioms is it's superb clarity and detail, I feel that it's this strength that makes them harsh and bright sounding to my ears. so ultimately it will depend on the preference of the individual.


but this isn't a thread about axiom and rockets but rather paradigm and axioms so let's try to get this thread back on track...:)
 

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I actually auditioned the m60's with the studio 60's v2 a while back along with some other speakers. It's a bit of a long read, but it might be helpful:


Ok, it has been a good 4 weeks and the saga has finally come to an end. Sorry I haven't kept you guys updated, but I have finally, after countless demos, made my decision. As I mentioned earlier, I was running ascend cbm-170's all the way around in a HT setup. I used to do about 85/15 HT/music. The ascends were great for both mind you. I was happy with their neutrality and accuracy. The reason I wanted to upgrade was the fact that I wanted a bit more "heft" in my soundstage. I always had this feeling I was "missing something." FWIW, Ascend has recently introduced a new speaker, the cbm-340 that supposedly addresses this particular issue as well as supposedly being a bit more detailed. In any case, here are my thoughts... all audtioning was done with a hsu vft-2 sub on a denon 3803. i used suzanne vega's tom's diner to test detail of upper range frequencies. I find that female vocals are for me a good way to compare speakers. I also used the Nora Jones CD, Steve Winwood, and a little Alice DeeJay for good measure. For HT, I used the moulin rouge dvd scenes 9 and 14 (i think - it's the elephant medley). Also I used the THX demo dvd and the Gladiator DVD (first battle scene).

Before I start, please note, in no way am I an expert, I don't even know if the demo material I used is considered suitable for comparisons, it is merely indicative of what I like to listen to. Consequently, take these following observations with a grain of salt.


The paradigm studio 60's v.2 and the studio center were my very first audtion. I had them in black. They were the ones in veneer, very solidly built, but nothing stood out about their appearance; classic and nonassuming. Their sound was another story. I was impressed with their clarity and detail. They definitely filled the void of the ascends in terms of that "heft." They had a true full bodied sound. They imaged pretty well and mid range was clear and fast. These were defeinitely my second favorite. My wife also agreed. There was nothing that I could pickout that I really hated about these speakers. The moulin rouge scene 9 was were they really shined. I heard many quiet ambient sounds that I had not heard before in the midst of the song. These are great all around speakers and the center is one of the best I've heard.


The axiom 60's were next. I orginally had a problem with the left channel tweeter, but that was fixed promptly with a quick call to axiom. Their customer service is incredible. I had the 60's shipped within 2 days from canada to MD! They were meticulously double boxed. The M60's are built in a high quality laminate. They are still heavy at aroud 95lbs per pair which is comparable to the paradigms. I actually preferred the look of the axioms though. I don't know, something about that silver aluminum baffle on the midrange captured my eye. All the hype over axiom is for real. Now mind you, I didn't have the center for testing purposes, but I did do a good amount of stereo. The M60's are probably the most detailed. almost to the point that they are bright. Coupling it with a 3803 probably didn't help either. Their bass was very tight and punchie. During tom's diner, I definitely noticed the kkkkk and ssssss syndromes. I couldn't overlook this. i had to mess with tone control at this point to stifle some of the harshness. Listener fatigue definitely became an issue after a few hours. Note, I did let the speakers play continuously for about 96 hours straight to try and break in the speakers properly. It did get a little bit better (or my ears adjusted, whatever camp you're in) and I continued with other demo's. As I said, these speaker are very detailed. The soundstage was wide and deep. The mids were quick and accurate. In the end though, I think I would have chosen the paradigms over the axioms for both HT and music. The paradigms are a bit smoother and airer. There's a bit more separation and definitely less listener fatigue. The wife also agreed and up to this point wanted to keep the paradigms.


Ultimately though, I ended up not going with either. I happened to get a deal on a 5.1 package of energy veritas with 2.2's, 2.0c, and 2.0r's. They absolutely blew me away. I got them in a high gloss piano black finish. They are built incredibly meticuously. Built quality is definitely head and shoulders above the other two. Mind you though, these are monitors. I initially had my reservations because of this. I thought that smaller speakers simply couldn't reproduce the full bodied sound I was looking for. Not so. The 2.2's are pretty hefty at around 35lbs each which was more than double my 170's and they sounded like it. Maybe not quite as full as the towers, but I couldn't tell and I was really looking for it. they are built with a 1" metal dome tweeter, a 3" metal dome midrange and a 6.5" woofer. The forte of this line, is imaging. Even in stereo, I was hearing instruments front of me and I felt I could localize the depth of where the instruments were. Soundstage was competitive with the other 2. Listening to tom's diner, I felt the sound was right in between the axiom and the paradigm. Note though that the studio 60 and m60 are very close to begin with so the difference is slight, but defeintely noticeable i felt. The 2.2's were detailed and airy at the same time. They were accurate yet smooth. I know it sounds really cliche, but this is the best way I can describe it. HT has been awe inspiring. The center is a beast weighing in at around 50lbs. it's reproduction of human voices is amazing. i not only heard the voices, but i felt their breaths. during the moulin rouge songs, the tone of ewan megregor's voice during the crescendos literally made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. the rears only add to this envolping expereince. the cool thing about the rears is that you can switch from dipoles to bipole and it also has a corner switch which disables the woofer that is up against the wall to prevent any unwanted sounds due to reflections. I knew I had the right speakers when I totally forgot about demo and audtioning and i just experienced them. I dropped all the demo material and started just listening to everything I had and experiencing the sounds again for the first time. i noticed afterward, i had a big smile across my face... i had found my speakers.


FWIW, I have since gone way overboard and went with a dedicated 2 channel setup with the ref 1's at double the cost. Let me know if you have any other questions that I could be of assistance with.

Rob
 
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