[Mark Hinton]

Have always owned top of the line Denon receivers including the 5800. Contemplating the 5803 upgrade, but also decided to look around while I was at it. Have seen very little here about the 49TX, but it appears to have some very favorable reviews including the ones attached below and like the 5803 is THX Ultra2 certified. It also stacked up very well vis-a-vis the 5800 in the Sound & Vision lab testing actually producing a better all channels driven power measurement than the 5800 which carries the higher power rating on paper.


Appreciate any thoughts on the 49TX vs. 5803. Is the 5803 the hands down way to go or is the 49TX a serious and viable contender for anyone considering the 5803?

http://www.dvdphd.com/reviews/pionee...x_review.shtml

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/pdf...ioneer_lab.pdf


Mark

 

[bitkahuna]

5803 has more s-video type video inputs and 2 sets of surround analog (7.1 I think) inputs vs 1.


I have a 49TX and I'm blown away by it, especially the automatic EQ/delay/gain feature (MCACC) which has made my speakers sound better than I imagined possible. This is the 49TX's key feature over the 5803 I believe.


But they're both terrific receivers.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Hinton Have always owned top of the line Denon receivers including the 5800. Contemplating the 5803 upgrade, but also decided to look around while I was at it. Have seen very little here about the 49TX, but it appears to have some very favorable reviews including the ones attached below and like the 5803 is THX Ultra2 certified. It also stacked up very well vis-a-vis the 5800 in the Sound & Vision lab testing actually producing a better all channels driven power measurement than the 5800 which carries the higher power rating on paper. Appreciate any thoughts on the 49TX vs. 5803. Is the 5803 the hands down way to go or is the 49TX a serious and viable contender for anyone considering the 5803? http://www.dvdphd.com/reviews/pionee...x_review.shtml http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/pdf...ioneer_lab.pdf If you have the money, in my opinion, Denon 5803 is the superior unit. Automatic audio cailbration is a nice novel feature that Pioneer offers, however that unit is not hardware upgradable and my advice is to not by a flagship receiver is not hardware upgradable. Mark

 

[Roy-BE]

I know that I'm about to be 'flamed', but the MCACC feature of the 49TX takes the sound to a higher level compared with the 5803.


Both the manual and the Pioneer web site say that the 49TX IS upgradable. It is still a question if it will eventually be upgraded. The rumor is that the new receivers from Pioneer will have firewire inputs, and that the 49TX will not be upgraded for firewire. It does not bother me...


To me the 49TX sounds superior, it is easier to use, and it is more pleasing to the eye. The 5803 is probably built a little better and enjoys better manufacturer's reputation. Since you can get the 49TX for about 60% of the price of a new 5803, my choice was easy. If they would have cost the same, I would have had a tougher decision to make.


Roy

 

[blane]

Review Snip-it:


The Uroshi finish, prominent on all Elite pieces, shines like a new car. The finish alone will satisfy your wife in ways you haven't since college.


----


So there ya go - get the Pioneer!


-Brian

 

[Mark Hinton]

Denon has always been know for using top shelf subcomponents on its high end gear. Any ideal on the quality of the 49TX subcomponents?


Mark

 

[adamf]

Any updated estimate on the timing of the new Pioneer receiver?


Thanks,

Adam

 

[Joshua]

There is a hardware upgrade announced for the 49TX (September?): unofficial as of yet but apparently from reliables sources.

http://pub106.ezboard.com/faussiedvd...icID=303.topic

 

[Mark Hinton]

Another data point for anyone considering the 49TX and the 5803 as I am.

http://pub106.ezboard.com/faussiedvd...icID=307.topic

 

[Ron1507]

Quote:

Originally posted by Auditor55 If you have the money, in my opinion, Denon 5803 is the superior unit. Automatic audio cailbration is a nice novel feature that Pioneer offers, however that unit is not hardware upgradable and my advice is to not by a flagship receiver is not hardware upgradable.

If the Denon had some type of automatic calibration feature would you still consider it to be novel? And also, before upgradable became the new buzzword these days, what were you buying? BTW: The Pioneer is upgradable.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Roy-BE I know that I'm about to be 'flamed', but the MCACC feature of the 49TX takes the sound to a higher level compared with the 5803. Both the manual and the Pioneer web site say that the 49TX IS upgradable. It is still a question if it will eventually be upgraded. The rumor is that the new receivers from Pioneer will have firewire inputs, and that the 49TX will not be upgraded for firewire. It does not bother me... To me the 49TX sounds superior, it is easier to use, and it is more pleasing to the eye. The 5803 is probably built a little better and enjoys better manufacturer's reputation. Since you can get the 49TX for about 60% of the price of a new 5803, my choice was easy. If they would have cost the same, I would have had a tougher decision to make. Roy

If the 49TX is truly hardware upgradeable, and if it had better amps, it would be second best receiver next to the 5803. I have the B&K, but if I was in the market for a new receiver, I would go with the 5803 and next would be the 49TX, that is if its truly upgradeable. I don't care about MCACC, I can adjust the sound myself, many high end pre/pros don't have MCACC, but many of you would choose a Theta pre/pro over a Pioneer 49TX.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron1507 If the Denon had some type of automatic calibration feature would you still consider it to be novel? And also, before upgradable became the new buzzword these days, what were you buying? BTW: The Pioneer is upgradable.

Yes, MCACC is a novel feature, but hardware upgradeability is a must for an expensive flagship receiver, I don't want to buy a new receiver every year to get the latest feature, not after spending close to $3,000.

 

[Rob_Z]

The 5803 might have better amps, but I think the 49TX MCACC feature brings it in line with the 5803. This is to say I probably couldn't calibrate the 5803 as well as the MCACC can calibrate the 49TX, so any gain in the 5803 amps would be lost to bad calibration, for me, and any difference in the 49TX amp would be made up for with near perfect calibration.

 

[Ron1507]

Quote:

Originally posted by Auditor55 If the 49TX is truly hardware upgradeable, and if it had better amps, it would be second best receiver next to the 5803. I have the B&K, but if I was in the market for a new receiver, I would go with the 5803 and next would be the 49TX, that is if its truly upgradeable. I don't care about MCACC, I can adjust the sound myself, many high end pre/pros don't have MCACC, but many of you would choose a Theta pre/pro over a Pioneer 49TX.

What do you mean if it had better amps? According to Sound & Vision's test report, the Pioneer's amp section test results were tied and in some cases tested better than the Denon, even though I doubt one could hear the difference. The only area where it lost was in the one-channel driven results, Denon's 200w to Pioneer's 154w. Again not a major difference. But then again you might be one of those who hate Sound & Vision and will think they don't know what the hell they're talking about.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron1507 What do you mean if it had better amps? According to Sound & Vision's test report, the Pioneer's amp section test results were tied and in some cases tested better than the Denon, even though I doubt one could hear the difference. The only area where it lost was in the one-channel driven results, Denon's 200w to Pioneer's 154w. Again not a major difference. But then again you might be one of those who hate Sound & Vision and will think they don't know what the hell they're talking about.

According to some owners of the 49tx, the amps failed when trying to drive low impedance speakers, which caused a desire in them to go out and purchase separate amps and use the 49tx as a pre/pro. BTW, I don't hate Sound & Vision, I enjoy their magazine. I'm basing my opinion on owners of the 49tx who have posted in this forum that they had problems with the 49tx shutting down.

 

[Ricky]

Auditor55,


Just how do you intend to calibrate your speakers like or better than the MCACC?


Even if the denon amps are say....20 watts better, you wouldn't hear a difference in 20 watts (ie, 120 vs 140) in a strong majority of speaker systems.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Ricky Auditor55, Just how do you intend to calibrate your speakers like or better than the MCACC? Even if the denon amps are say....20 watts better, you wouldn't hear a difference in 20 watts (ie, 120 vs 140) in a strong majority of speaker systems.

I would use Avia or Video essentials set-up disc, a little room tuning and take from there, I'm not saying doing that would guarantee better results than what the Pioneer unit can do automatically, but the Pioneer can't guarantee me that I would be pleased with its results, its man vs. machine. I say again, if you had a choice between a Lexicon or Theta pre/pro (both without MCACC) supplied with AVIA or a 49TX, to be used as a pre/pro, all would be supplied with a Krell 5 channel amp, which would you choose?


I'm not talking about specs, I'm talking about real world performance and from consumers who own the 49TX report that the amps are not strongest point of that fine receiver.

 

[Ricky]

Auditor55,


You don't understand what MCACC does. You can't replicate room correction over wide frequency bands with AVIA or Video essentials. It's not man vs machine, it's equalizer vs no equalizer. I don't own an Elite 49tx, so hopefully owners will chime in with examples on how much correction (ie, +/- x.x dBs) at different frequencies their speakers/rooms need.


I currently use a Lexicon MC1 because I love Logic7 on 2.0 and 5.1 sources, and I have a tube preamp for my 2 channel music. IF I had to live with just one processor for music and movies, I would definitely buy the Elite and compare it over my Lexicon.


Let me ask you a similiar question: would you take the Denon 5803 as a prepro over a Theta or Lexicon?

 

[catapult]

There is more to MCACC than the time and level alignment you can do with Avia. It's also a 9 octave-band equalizer. While most good-quality mains probably don't need much EQ, MCACC can timbre match the center and surrounds to the mains for a more seamless soundfield. Depending on your room and speakers, that feature may be worthless to you or it may be the one to take your sound to the next level. TacT has built a whole product line around a more sophisticated version of "room correction" so some people consider it more than a worthless frill.

 

[Auditor55]

Quote:

Originally posted by Ricky Auditor55, You don't understand what MCACC does. You can't replicate room correction over wide frequency bands with AVIA or Video essentials. It's not man vs machine, it's equalizer vs no equalizer. I don't own an Elite 49tx, so hopefully owners will chime in with examples on how much correction (ie, +/- x.x dBs) at different frequencies their speakers/rooms need. I currently use a Lexicon MC1 because I love Logic7 on 2.0 and 5.1 sources, and I have a tube preamp for my 2 channel music. IF I had to live with just one processor for music and movies, I would definitely buy the Elite and compare it over my Lexicon. Let me ask you a similiar question: would you take the Denon 5803 as a prepro over a Theta or Lexicon?

You didn't answer my question. I don't think its fair to ask me the question because I'm not trying to advocate for MCACC, some of you whi own the 49TX claim that MCACC its then "in all in" that feature sets it on a higher plane than all receivers. Many people will tell you that most flaship receivers prepro section compares favorably in sound quality to high-end pre/pros, in view of that, if MCACC is greatest feature since multi-channel digital sound, one would definately purchase the 49TX over any receiver or high-end pre/pro.