[snidely]

The following is from a post at the www.kusat.com forum: (The thread is about 7 messages long and mainly dealt with someone complaining about station logos.) I am posting this because i don't recall anyone here having such serious burn-in problems - and having a unit replaced.

I wonder if the subject set had settings that were adjusted wrong - like brightness and contrast cranked up too high?


Link to thread: http://www.canadian-tv.com/forums/sh...b=5&o=&fpart=2


...mike



Well, I talked to Pioneer Canada today, I couldn't wait. Their going to replace my Plasma with a new one at no cost, not even shipping charges. I just have to return this one to Best-Buy when the other one comes in next week, Friday the soonest.


The Pioneer Rep agreed with the problems with the station bugs, but she said that all their "newer models" will fix this problem. I guess the PDP-4340HD is an older model (jeeze, the Best-Buy sales Rep lied to me).


So I'm going to be very cautious about the station bugs from now on, that is, I will not watch Network TV on the plasma at all.


As for the lawsuit thing, myself as one person, it's a waste of time and money, I'd loose more in lawyer and court fees. Besides, this set cost me $8944.59 with the extended warranty. We need at least 40 people just to come up with any case at all.


This was a learning experience that I rather not go thru again.


Joe


Pioneer PDP-4340HD

Bell Expressvu 6000 + 8PSK HDTV upgrade module

 

[Gx35]

Can you post the link for the mentioned thread ???

 

[ed2day]

That's the second example I've seen outside this forum of plasma burn-in. The other one involved a local FOX black&white logo that he claimed was on no more than half-hour a day. Seemed almost unbelieveable, but I don't know why someone would make it up--lot of goofballs out there though.


There seems to be some misconceptions out there, at least as I understand it. I keep reading that as long as you occasionally change from the static image for a minute or two periodically, then no problemo. I don't believe this is true. As I understand it there are two burn-in mechanisms at work. One is a short-term memory and is reversible once you remove the static image. The other is long-term and is irreversible (ignore inverted image remedies for now). It is caused by uneven "wear" of the phosphor. For instance, if you watch a large percentage of the time with black bars on the sides, the phosphor in the bars wont age at the same rate and will appear brighter than the remaining screen when a full screen image is shown. This does not go away, and switching off the black bars periodically wont prevent it either. It is simply a matter of the time you watch w/ bars relative to the time you watch full screen. That is why they recommend that you watch with bars no more than 20% of the time. A similar argument can be made for logos. Just make sure the same logo isn't in the same spot more than 20% of your viewing time, esp. if its a high-contrast logo.

 

[franz-man]

20% of the time sounds reasonable. I just got the Akai from Costco and I think the manual talks about burn-in...but puts a 5% limit on 4:3 watching, etc. I will have to check that page out again...I assume they are just being very cautious.

 

[Bill Ball]

My Pio 43" has a settings menu that is SUPER high contrast white. If I spend more than 5-10 minutes doing adjustments, the lower static part of the menu persists. The first time I saw this I freaked thinking it had burned in ht screen. However, it did disappear after 10 minutes or so. I've seen no other problems with regular content, 4:3 black or gray bars, lgos, whatever. I do have "orbit" mode set. Pio should tone down the settings and service menus.


Bill

 

[rogo]

"As I understand it there are two burn-in mechanisms at work. One is a short-term memory and is reversible once you remove the static image. The other is long-term and is irreversible (ignore inverted image remedies for now). It is caused by uneven "wear" of the phosphor. For instance, if you watch a large percentage of the time with black bars on the sides, the phosphor in the bars wont age at the same rate and will appear brighter than the remaining screen when a full screen image is shown. This does not go away, and switching off the black bars periodically wont prevent it either. It is simply a matter of the time you watch w/ bars relative to the time you watch full screen. That is why they recommend that you watch with bars no more than 20% of the time. A similar argument can be made for logos. Just make sure the same logo isn't in the same spot more than 20% of your viewing time, esp. if its a high-contrast logo."


Right, and your numbers show why this is not a big deal for most people.


Consider the CNBC fan who watches 90 minutes per day with a properly calibrated display (perhaps even running a lower settings pair or the muted power mode that a Pioneer, e.g., has for such low-value content)... That same display is on anothe 5-6 hours per day. The CNBC watching comprises perhaps 20% of total viewing... In that viewing, there are ads (although CNBC does run the ticker during market hours below the ads, IIRC)... Some of the static graphics disappear. Ads are typically run 20-25% of the time, reducing the CNBC percentage to perhaps 15-17% overall.


This ought to be a non-issue assuming a halfway decent brightness/contrast calibration.


So long as the types of "abuse" oriented viewing are different... 15% Xbox, 15% ticker news, 15% 4:3, 15% 2.35:1 widescreen movies with bars above and below... you have not overused the phosphors for any one type of viewing and therefore should not experience any noticeable burn in -- in fact, you ought to experience none at all.


The truly paranoid -- and I say that with affection for the truly paranoid -- could contemplate the first 200 hours of a plasma as fullscreen-only, no bars, no gaming, limited "ticker" channels.... Why? Because the phosphor wear is logarithmic and if you managed to burn anything in early, it would take several times longer to "even out". I'm not all that convinced the 200-hour thing is needed, but I'm reasonably convinced it can't hurt much to do it that way.


I choose 200 hours because we used to hear 20,000 hours to half brightness, so that was the first 1%. These days we hear 60,000 hours to half brightness, so it would take 600 hours to achieve the same 1%. But the longer phosphor life means the curve is effectively "flatter" in my opinion because the sets are not dramatically brighter out of the box. This additional flatness means the curve is less logarithmic, if you will, and 200-300 hours should still do about the same good it used to. That is to say, it probably makes no difference, but if you wish to be super sure....


Please someone remember how to link to this post when the question comes up again. Thanks in advance.


Mark

 

[assJack1]

rogo: An interesting question - are there cycling DVD's that do what you suggest? Basically DVD's that just cycle colors over and over again - specifically made for plasma's that are brand spanking new. I can see someone purchasing this then waiting until the first 1% of hours have gone by.

 

[R Harkness]

I've have the Panasonic ED plasma for about 1 1/2 years. Our TV viewing picture settings have the contrast and brightness well down and it generally looks best that way (still has excellent punch, even in our bright, heavily windowed family room).


The thing is playing (all too much) children's shows in the morning and late afternoon. My kids tend to watch the same two channels (with logos). We are talking much more logo time than many other posters are talking about in this thread. After a year and a half there isn't a hint of burn in anywhere.


My wife also tends to leave the display on a local news channel that is is divided up into windows and text scroll screens; it's essentially a static graphic - burn in nightmare. Still, no burn in from that either.

 

[rmcgirr83]

Quote:

Originally posted by rogo The truly paranoid -- and I say that with affection for the truly paranoid -- Mark

Mark, thanks I think you're ok also.


This burn-in thing is hyperbole. After almost one year, actually 1015 hours, no burn-in, no ghosting. We do use the unit with various sources, xbox, cable, sat, dvd, HD. "Justify" for the 4:3 stuff and "normal" for everything else.


Couldn't be happier (although TNT SD via Sat looked like total crap the other night watching "Deep Rising"). FWIW, this is with brightness down to -25 on the 5uy series of panasonic plasma.


Rich H, nice to "hear" from you again. Been busy?