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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok guys. All in all, Im pretty satisfied with my subs. I think the issue Im having is basically because of the sheer size of the room. (30x15 450sq ft) I currently have my subs pointing out into the room like in the picture below:









Outside the mains:







After running Audyssey XT 32, my system sounds good overall except that the subs seem to be lacking. This shouldnt be the case. When I get close to them, I can hear the bass and feel the bass alot. I usually bump them up multiple dbs to where I like them. (preference vs reference) I have tried placing them in multiple spots in the room that I found by sub crawling. Outside the mains, inside the mains, seems to yield the same output and sound in the MLP. I have even placed them behind the listening posistion on the right and left walls. The sound wonderful there. lot of output no doubt, but obviously, this is not really an option because it looks bad one, and two they are so massive, it is hard to walk around them. But then again, this is not totally out.



The other spot I found that yielded the most output is when I put them behind the mains with the woofers and ports facing into the wall and corner. Of course this would do that, due to the fact im corner loading them. This way by far yields the most output and I can actually feel the pressure in my ears. Here is a pic of them facing the wall/corner.








Now the only downside to this is making them look like they are supoosed to be there. I am very particular about my room and arrangement. This is the reason Im writing this post. I know there are a ton of guys on here that know a great deal more about subs, room placement, aesthetics etc.. than me. Basically if I can find a happy medium so I can have the output I need and the "look" I need, then Im all for it.


I have even thought of hiding the subs behind possibly a false wall etc.. Any help, advice, anyone can give would be greatly appreciated.


thanks in advance.
 

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That last set up with your subs turned in looks fine to me. I understand what you're saying about having the aesthetics of the subs, but if it was me and that produced the best sound I would leave them that way for at least a couple weeks and see how you feel about it then. It's nothing permanent and it may grow on you.


I just had to go through about the same thing as you with my sub placement in my new finished basement. The best sound I have been able to achieve is with the sub all by itself on a side wall. I would prefer it up by the mains, but that placement yields some nasty nulls in my room.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljaycanuck  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23191857


I can't offer any help - sorry 'bout that - but I really wanted to comment on the awesomeness of your set-up!

thanks man. means alot. I try to make it look the best I can, with what I have.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sickboy013  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23191886


That last set up with your subs turned in looks fine to me. I understand what you're saying about having the aesthetics of the subs, but if it was me and that produced the best sound I would leave them that way for at least a couple weeks and see how you feel about it then. It's nothing permanent and it may grow on you.


I just had to go through about the same thing as you with my sub placement in my new finished basement. The best sound I have been able to achieve is with the sub all by itself on a side wall. I would prefer it up by the mains, but that placement yields some nasty nulls in my room.

I understand completely. Im actually thinking of trying to hide them so to speak maybe with a false wall made out of fabric or some sort.
 

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Very nice looking room my man!


I actually prefer the last pic with the subs facing the wall...doesn't look so much like a wall of speakers and less over-bearing, IMO. They kinda just look like more treatments stuck in the corners like that.



Anyways, you would usually be watching with the room dark, so you wouldn't see them either way.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by eljaycanuck  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s#post_23191857


I can't offer any help - sorry 'bout that - but I really wanted to comment on the awesomeness of your set-up!

am with you here on this one ...well built room very nice and clean ..hats off ...
 

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nezff... Awesome room, I am jealous. Actually some day I hope to have a room like yours. We just built a home and there is an unfinished bonus room above the garage and it has the angled ceilings just like yours and a window at the same spot.


Anyway when I had front firing subs or subs with front or rear firing ports: I found that the best sound was when both subs were up front 1 in each corner. With the sub and/or ports facing into the corner at a 45 degree angle. So place the sub at a 45 degree angle firing into the corner and have the corners of the sub like 3 to 6" from the walls this will give it plenty of room to breath cuz the corner of the wall is like a foot away from the driver and ports. Only down side is, is if your amp is on the back of the sub then its pointing directly out into the room.
 

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As a hopeless adorer of symmetry and cleanliness I've always loved your setup and think the "best sound" arrangement you've discovered is absolutely fine. The "blankness" of the driver-less exposed sides simply replicates that of the panels.


Look on the bright side, you could be stuck with THIS, it's the absolute worst position for my subs, but the only way they'll even fit into my current, temporary arrangement.

http://s1210.photobucket.com/user/m...D9-4000-000002ECF61F0397_zps553ccd35.jpg.html


Really, it's ok brother.


James
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by pioneertop  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23192253


am with you here on this one ...well built room very nice and clean ..hats off ...

thanks bud!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23192049


Very nice looking room my man!


I actually prefer the last pic with the subs facing the wall...doesn't look so much like a wall of speakers and less over-bearing, IMO. They kinda just look like more treatments stuck in the corners like that.



Anyways, you would usually be watching with the room dark, so you wouldn't see them either way.

right. I think the only issue for me is not necessarily the absence of the woofer being in sight, its the amp showing with the wiring going to it.
If I could come up with a way to somehow hide it, this might be a winner. Also, let today, Im going to try moving the subs on the outside of the mains again to see how that goes.


Im also wondering how the subs will sound with them facing each other on opposite sides with the amps facing the wall.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermaybe  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23192359


As a hopeless adorer of symmetry and cleanliness I've always loved your setup and think the "best sound" arrangement you've discovered is absolutely fine. The "blankness" of the driver-less exposed sides simply replicates that of the panels.


Look on the bright side, you could be stuck with THIS, it's the absolute worst position for my subs, but the only way they'll even fit into my current, temporary arrangement.




Really, it's ok brother.


James

thanks man. Yeah, you are kinda tight arent you. If if sounds good, I definately wouldn worry about that. They look good where they are at.


I would love to have a false wall to just hide it all except components, tv, and speakers. hmmmm
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nezff  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s#post_23191919


I understand completely. Im actually thinking of trying to hide them so to speak maybe with a false wall made out of fabric or some sort.

You should just leave it like that. I still think it looks sweet, even with them turned in! In my opinion a false wall or fabric will take away the clean cut lines and aesthetic of what you have going on. It looks good man! I wish I had that set up!
My vote is leave it! End of discussion... thread can be closed. LOL just kidding.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermaybe  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s#post_23192359


As a hopeless adorer of symmetry and cleanliness ...
Where mains are concerned symmetry is fine. Where subs are concerned not really. Good response from subs means controlling room modes, and symmetry doesn't smooth room modes, it exacerbates them.

OP, you've discovered the benefit of corner loading. I'd move one of the subs to the diagonally opposite corner and see how that works out. And by 'see' I'm being literal, you need measuring gear to see what the results are on a chart, your ears alone aren't up to the job.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23192702


Where mains are concerned symmetry is fine. Where subs are concerned not really. Good response from subs means controlling room modes, and symmetry doesn't smooth room modes, it exacerbates them.

OP, you've discovered the benefit of corner loading. I'd move one of the subs to the diagonally opposite corner and see how that works out. And by 'see' I'm being literal, you need measuring gear to see what the results are on a chart, your ears alone aren't up to the job.
I have tried that, but like I said in the initial post, these subs are huge and are almost impossible to leave in that posistion. I dont have anything other than a Galaxy CM140 calibrated spl meter currently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sickboy013  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23192711


nezff, have you ever used REW to measure your room's response?
Havent used REW. I had a guy helping me the other day via PM to get it up and running. So far I know what USB mic to get, but havent every used the software.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nezff  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s#post_23193061


I have tried that, but like I said in the initial post, these subs are huge and are almost impossible to leave in that posistion. I dont have anything other than a Galaxy CM140 calibrated spl meter currently.

Havent used REW. I had a guy helping me the other day via PM to get it up and running. So far I know what USB mic to get, but havent every used the software.

There are walkthrough guides for REW:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1449924/simplified-rew-setup-and-use-usb-mic-hdmi-connection-including-measurement-techniques-and-how-to-interpret-graphs



The only way to really get the most out of your subs is to measure response. I would measure pre and post Audyssey. If you don't want to mess with REW, there is Omnimic. It costs more, but is uber simple to setup and use.


Like Bill said, moving one of the subs to the opposite corner is worth trying out for sure.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23193199


There are walkthrough guides for REW:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1449924/simplified-rew-setup-and-use-usb-mic-hdmi-connection-including-measurement-techniques-and-how-to-interpret-graphs



The only way to really get the most out of your subs is to measure response. I would measure pre and post Audyssey. If you don't want to mess with REW, there is Omnimic. It costs more, but is uber simple to setup and use.


Like Bill said, moving one of the subs to the opposite corner is worth trying out for sure.


moving the sub to that opposite corner will work, but I just cant keep it there. imagine a sub in the middle of a hall where you walk. lol


I dont mind trying REW out. One guy told me to get the CMM-6 usb mic from Cross Spectrum Labs. Same place I got my Cm140 spl meter. Im assuming the rest isnt very hard?
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nezff  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s#post_23193355


moving the sub to that opposite corner will work, but I just cant keep it there. imagine a sub in the middle of a hall where you walk. lol


I dont mind trying REW out. One guy told me to get the CMM-6 usb mic from Cross Spectrum Labs. Same place I got my Cm140 spl meter. Im assuming the rest isnt very hard?

It isn't hard if you follow the step by step guide in the thread I linked to



Otherwise, it would be a little tough. That said, if your placement is really limited then I am not sure how much measuring will really get you.
 

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I like the look of your subs in the last picture with the ports and driver facing the side walls. The issue is, those ED subs are just so huge....
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23193368


It isn't hard if you follow the step by step guide in the thread I linked to



Otherwise, it would be a little tough. That said, if your placement is really limited then I am not sure how much measuring will really get you.

I just read the step by step from austin jerry. seems fairly easy. Not saying that moving the subs around is out of the quesiton, I just have certain spots that will work and not work. Of course everyone has those.

Quote:
Originally Posted by capricorn kid  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23193455


I like the look of your subs in the last picture with the ports and driver facing the side walls. The issue is, those ED subs are just so huge....

they are big no doubt. I honestly wish I would have kept my original A5350s and turned those into the walls.



I would sell these, but I have no idea how I would ship them. LOL
 

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I would need to disagree with you on that one. Those A7-450s are monsters but I bet they sound fantastic. There is no way I would ever sell those beasts....
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by capricorn kid  /t/1467820/placement-of-dual-18s/0_100#post_23193497


I would need to disagree with you on that one. Those A7-450s are monsters but I bet they sound fantastic. There is no way I would ever sell those beasts....

they are monsters no doubt. I just meant something with a smaller footprint, like a 15 or even 18 incher.


I moved my subs to outside the mains tonight. Im gonna play with that for a couple days. gotta work tomorrow for 24 hours, so now playtime. This weekend hopefully.
 
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