[polyghan]


Hi all,

 

I've been playing around with subwoofer build ideas for when I have the cash to build one, and was wondering if the current build I'm looking at would suit my needs.

 

I'm looking to make a subwoofer that is relatively inexpensive ($500 or so), reasonably good looking, and as good sounding as my budget will allow. I'm looking at using the 15" Dayton Audio Ultimax woofer, the 3 cu. ft. Dayton knock down cabinet, and a 500w Bash amp.

 

http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-15-ultimax-subwoofer-and-cabinet-package--300-7097

 

http://www.parts-express.com/bash-500s-digital-subwoofer-plate-amplifier-500w-rms--300-752

 

My current setup is an Emotiva XDA-2, XPA-200, and a pair of Thiel CS 1.6 speakers. I was wondering if this subwoofer would be quick and detailed enough to keep up with/integrate well with the Thiels. I am looking for a subwoofer that has very good transient response and a punchy sound primarily for music with the occasional video game and movie. I'd like it to go as deep as possible, but I understand that at this price I won't be touching the lower limits of my hearing range. I don't need high volume.

 

I'm also wondering whether how it would perform against other non-DIY subwoofers in a similar price range such as the SVS PB-1000 and the Rythmik LV12R.

 

I'm also open to other woofers and amps, compatibility with a knock down cabinet I can purchase is a huge plus as I do not have the tools to make a cabinet myself. 

 

I was looking to have the amp be an external amp in a custom wooden enclosure similar to Bottlehead amps. I was planning on this because I wouldn't have to cut a hole for it, and I think it would look more interesting. I slapped together a quick render of what I was thinking about to give you guys a better idea of what I'm talking about. Are there any issues with a setup like this, or would it work well enough?

 



 

Also, a somewhat unrelated subwoofer question. When hooking up a subwoofer via RCA (the XDA-2 does not have subwoofer out, so I would be using the RCA out) should I plug it into one channel only, or both? I've heard I should only plug in one channel, but I fear that I may miss some bass information on the other channel.

 

Thanks!

 

[polyghan]


No thoughts on this build?

 

[MuaySteve]

This thread is relevant to my interests and budget. I'm hoping to do a build this summer and have been considering the 18" CSS cube with sdx 12" and dual PR's. ( about $550 not including enclosure)

 

[CudaNet]

I can't really comment on the selection of drivers (preference and all) but I will say that I too have contemplated externalizing the plate amp. I might have to troll through more threads but there's an advantage and potential disadvantage to this concept. Plate amps vary in size and eventually it's inevitable that they'll malfunction. With that said, constructing a new external box is easier than retrofitting a new plate to a box you spent considerable time and money constructing. The flip side is the orientation of the plate amp, these plates were designed to dissipate heat through the heat sinks. I know in car audio, the manufacturers always recommended placement. So it's possible having the amp oriented in a horizontal manner might be a detriment to it cooling capability.


So here's a bump for this thread and good luck on the build.

Quote:
Originally Posted by polyghan  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24561142


No thoughts on this build?

 

[Bill Fitzmaurice]



Quote:
Originally Posted by CudaNet  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24564298


I too have contemplated externalizing the plate amp. I might have to troll through more threads but there's an advantage and potential disadvantage to this concept.

Controlling ground loop noise. The level of that noise is proportional to the square of the length of wire connecting the sub to the AVR and the AC grounds in the sub amp and AVR to each other, so with each doubling of the distance between the AVR and sub amp the noise level quadruples. With a short enough distance transformer isolation and other measures to eliminate hum may not be necessary.

 

[FOH]

I understand the desire to have the plate amp/external enclosure, however a full size pro amp would offer higher performance, greater flexibility, and if purchasing one with dsp, much greater post build satisfaction and results.

 

[schmidtwi]

I built 2 of these in 4 cu.ft. DIY enclosures. Fortunately, they sound much better than this pic looks.... These are awesome subs for music and movies - tight, deep and loud (if you so wish...).


I agree with FOH, go with a professional amp, like the iNuke3000DSP . A 3000 will drive two Ultimax15-22 subs wired for 4 ohms at ~800 W per channel - for not much more than the 500W plate you linked to. Run just one channel of the 3000 for now, then you'll have the amp when you decide to build second sub...

 

[polyghan]



Quote:
Originally Posted by CudaNet  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24564298


I can't really comment on the selection of drivers (preference and all) but I will say that I too have contemplated externalizing the plate amp. I might have to troll through more threads but there's an advantage and potential disadvantage to this concept. Plate amps vary in size and eventually it's inevitable that they'll malfunction. With that said, constructing a new external box is easier than retrofitting a new plate to a box you spent considerable time and money constructing. The flip side is the orientation of the plate amp, these plates were designed to dissipate heat through the heat sinks. I know in car audio, the manufacturers always recommended placement. So it's possible having the amp oriented in a horizontal manner might be a detriment to it cooling capability.


So here's a bump for this thread and good luck on the build.

 

That's something I didn't think about, heat. I'll have to take a look at whether the orientation and reduced internal volume of the box over the sub enclosure would cause issues. I guess I could leave the bottom of the box open to help with airflow, but I would still have to take the differing orientation into account. I do know that a small time amp manufacturer made full range speaker monoblocks out of plate amps and oriented them in the way I did in my render.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24564433



Controlling ground loop noise. The level of that noise is proportional to the square of the length of wire connecting the sub to the AVR and the AC grounds in the sub amp and AVR to each other, so with each doubling of the distance between the AVR and sub amp the noise level quadruples. With a short enough distance transformer isolation and other measures to eliminate hum may not be necessary.
 
If I understand this correctly, that would mean that an external amp closer to my preamp would be the best solution and that an external amp on top of the sub would cause a minimal difference when compared to an internal amp?
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by FOH  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24564546


I understand the desire to have the plate amp/external enclosure, however a full size pro amp would offer higher performance, greater flexibility, and if purchasing one with dsp, much greater post build satisfaction and results.
 

I had thought of that, but wasn't sure if there were pro amps with sub features. See below.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by schmidtwi  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24565846


I built 2 of these in 4 cu.ft. DIY enclosures. Fortunately, they sound much better than this pic looks.... These are awesome subs for music and movies - tight, deep and loud (if you so wish...).


I agree with FOH, go with a professional amp, like the  iNuke3000DSP . A 3000 will drive two Ultimax15-22 subs wired for 4 ohms at ~800 W per channel - for not much more than the 500W plate you linked to. Run just one channel of the 3000 for now, then you'll have the amp when you decide to build second sub... 

 

Wow! I looked at that iNuke before and it was $600. At that price it looks like a steal! (and a reason to upgrade to 2 subs!) Is that the usual price for that amp, or is there a major sale going on? Is there any reason you went with a 4 cu ft enclosure as opposed to the recommended 3? What speakers do you use with them?

 

The iNuke looks like a great option, though it does have a fan. How loud is the fan? Also, does it have things like low pass filters for subs? Is there a guide anywhere on how to use it with DSP for a sub? I've heard the documentation is minimal.

 

Also, is there a reason to get the higher powered 3000? Do I benefit from the extra watts? Does it output what it says it outputs? I know Behringer likes to be very liberal with their power ratings.

 

[schmidtwi]



Quote:
Originally Posted by polyghan  /t/1525250/potential-subwoofer-build-will-this-work#post_24569838



Wow! I looked at that iNuke before and it was $600. At that price it looks like a steal! (and a reason to upgrade to 2 subs!) Is that the usual price for that amp, or is there a major sale going on? Is there any reason you went with a 4 cu ft enclosure as opposed to the recommended 3? What speakers do you use with them?


The iNuke looks like a great option, though it does have a fan. How loud is the fan? Also, does it have things like low pass filters for subs? Is there a guide anywhere on how to use it with DSP for a sub? I've heard the documentation is minimal.


Also, is there a reason to get the higher powered 3000? Do I benefit from the extra watts? Does it output what it says it outputs? I know Behringer likes to be very liberal with their power ratings.

The iNukes are on an extended sale - and that is a steal for the performance. Fan is somewhat loud, but plenty of fan replacements available (search threads). You want to use your LP via AVR, but does have HPF @20Hz. chalugadp has a great thread on using REW for iNukes if you buy a mic. The 3000 has ~800W per channel @ 4 ohms - perfect for the UM15-22.


4cu.ft. is optimal sealed size for the UM15-22 (3 cu.ft. is recommended so you buy PE flat pack) - you can DIY a 21x21x21 birch ply box for $50. PM me and I'll send pics of my DIY construction (which, of course I stole, umm, I mean borrowed, from someone on this site...)

 

[polyghan]


I don't have an AVR, I have separates and my preamp doesn't have an LPF.

 

[schmidtwi]

iNuke has LPF and HPF - and a good PC interface.

 

[polyghan]


Awesome, sounds perfect. Hopefully it's on sale for awhile.