[KrisRoberts]

I noticed something tonight that kind of freaked me out. I was watching a movie while my wife started the dish washer in the other room (no the pj isnt in the kitchen). I noticed that in some dark scenes the detail was kind of flickering. Bright scenes seemed solid, but when it got dim you could really see a fluctuation. I found that turning off the dish washer restored stability to the image. Obviously I'm experiencing some power fluctuations when big appliances are running in my house.


So I guess I'm in the market for a power conditioner for my projector. Do people have any recommendations? Do the modern UPS units intended for computers have reasonable voltage stabilizers?


Thanks!


Kris

 

[SunTECH]

They sure do. You want to make sure you get a good quality, pure sine wave output UPS. 1400va is the smallest I would suggest. Check out the APC SmartUPS series, you can find them all over, including Ebay. If you get it from Ebay, get one with new batteries...


Thanks,


Nick

 

[BizarroTerl]

It's also a good idea to run your projector on it's own circuit.

 

[Energeezer]

Has anyone compared these UPS units with some of the power conditioners, regenerators currently associated with audio.


For example

Why would I spend 4700 USD (a good deal actually) on a used Monster Power HT7000 when I could get a good UPS at a fraction of that cost?

Posting this on the audio forum as well.

 

[BizarroTerl]

Why, because the Monster has magical properties that make a digital equivalent to a G90 and a 1031 better than being there.

 

[SunTECH]

Energeezer,


I think that if you compare specs of the these products, you will see that the voltage correction they offer is very much the same. If I recall, the Monster conditioner has a higher joule rating, however, the pass-through voltage is higher too. Basically what that means is, the surge part of the Monster conditioner will let more surge voltage pass before it "clamps" or shunts the surge to ground to dissipate it.


Not to mention, you get no UPS protection with the Monster unit. With a good quality UPS, you may have enough run-time to finish that movie before the batteries run out :>)


Regards,


Nick

 

[mbartok]

You may wish to look into the products from Equitec that produce balanced power outputs capable of running a projector. As mentioned earlier, a dedicated circuit is always preferred for projectors due to the current draw.

 

[filecat13]

At the risk of being considered a dupe to techno mumbo jumbo, I'll comment on the difference a Monster Power HTS 5000 made in my system.


When I finally got the MOSFET power amps I wanted, I had an annoying ground loop problem that wouldn't go away. I tried a couple of relatively inexpensive solutions, tried a couple of moderately expensive solutions, and even went to cheater plugs with no discernible benefit.


Of course, removing the cable system's co-ax reduced the hum quite a bit, but then I had no source material for my sports and entertainment viewing. I had the electrical circuits checked and the cable system checked, including the grounds. Everything was "OK" according to the techs.


In the kind of drive that desperation brings, I did something I thought I'd never do, and I auditioned a Monster Power unit. The effect was immediate, profound, and far reaching. Not only did every vestige of ground loop disappear, but the images produced by both my LCD projector and my CRT were dramatically better.


I returned the unit and purchased the more expensive HTS 5000 since I was connecting so much stuff to it. There could be better solutions that cost less, but after a month of trying, I was grateful and happy to have the problem solved. The Monster units are over priced, and collecting on the connected equipment guarantee might be like having an IRS audit, but it works for me in this situation, so I am looking at the positives, not the negatives.

 

[KrisRoberts]

Poking around in the piles of 'surplus' stuff we have at work, I found a Trip Lite Line Conditioner model LC-2400.


Input: 87V-140V 60Hz, 20 Amps Max

Output: Within ANSI-C84.1 Voltage Limits, Max load 2400 Watts


It has three pairs of outlets, banks 1-3.

Bank 1 says Standard @ 40db

Bank 2 says Intermediate @ 75db

Bank 3 says Maximum @ 90db

Isolated filter banks: noise suppression @ 1MHz


And then on the other side it says:

Line Conditioner - Low & high voltage regulator with spike & noise suppression.

And it has a set of LEDs to indicate the line input voltage as:

Very High, High, Normal, Low, Very Low


What do you guys think?!? I don't find much on the web about this model in particular, but there is a lower power more contemporary version at the trip lite website. I am wondering about the sine-wave this thing puts out, and there doesn't seem to be any information about that...

 

[BizarroTerl]

Make sure it has sine wave output.

 

[WanMan]

As opposed to Cosine wave ouput?

 

[SunTECH]

Nope (kind of funny though)! You want to stay away from a stepped or square wave output UPS. These types of outputs are OK for PCs, but not for sensitive electronics like our prized projectors!!!!!


Regards,


Nick

 

[bblue]

Kris, a standard type of UPS like the APC and many others will do little or nothing in your circumstance. They are designed to take over producing their own power whenever certain conditions exist on the line, such as undervoltage, spikes upward or downward, etc. As soon as the disturbance clears they will turn off and route standard power as if they weren't there. The do very little conditioning otherwise.


It sounds more like you're on an end run along with the dishwasher and it's just too much load on that particular circuit. You'd be better off powering from a circuit on a different breaker altogether.


If they're already on different breakers but those two breakers are on the same AC Leg (phase), you might try moving the breaker to be on the opposing leg. I only recommend this if you know about the phase relationships between legs and understand what I am suggesting.


You might try monitoring several different outlets in your house with an AC volt meter to see how they fluctuate when the dishwasher is on. If it's an overloaded Leg problem, you'll find that outlets on the same leg will drop in voltage, while those on the opposing leg will raise in voltage. The latter is preferable to connect the pj if a choice is possible.


If both legs drop with the dishwasher powered on, it may be time to get your local utility involved and replace the transformer that feeds yours and your neighbors houses. It's not keeping up with demand.


--Bill

 

[WanMan]

So, for the individual on the cheap (no, I am not the Son of Sultan), where do the pure sine wave conditioners start at in pricing? Any examples?

 

[bblue]

Quote:

So, for the individual on the cheap (no, I am not the Son of Sultan), where do the pure sine wave conditioners start at in pricing? Any examples?

No examples, sorry. You'd be looking for one of two types, the first is a UPS that is designed to run always. There are some but they are usually not on the low cost side.


In the non-UPS category most conditioners are really just what's known as constant-voltage transformers which will take a 90 to 120volt AC range and adjust it to some voltage, typically 110 or 115 volts.


What these two have in common is that they are noisy and produce a fair amount of heat. Additionally the constant voltage transformer puts out a pretty healthy magnetic field around it. But, you can find them of pretty reasonable size at electronics surplus places.


I wouldn't use either of them except as a last resort when no other reasonable solution seems to exist.


--Bill

 

[SunTECH]

Liebert makes a small double conversion UPS ( AC to DC then DC to AC) which will work, and not to argue with bblue, but the APC SmartUPS will work well too. It offers SmarT Trim and Smart Boost to compensate for voltage ups and downs. Once the voltage goes above or below a preset point, then it will transfer to battery and it will remain there until the voltage returns to an acceptable level.


This type of UPS is called line interactive, which means the APC units react to voltage changes within 2-4 miliseconds, more than fast enough to protect the attached equipment.


But Bblue does have a valid point too, make sure that your equipment is on its own circuit as a first step...


Regards,


Nick

 

[WanMan]

And what are we talking here, in US$?

 

[SunTECH]

You can find an APC SmartUPS 1400 or larger on flea bay for $300. Try and get one with new batteries (they typically last 3-5 years)...


The Lieberts are a bit more, and harder to find...


Thanks,


Nick

 

[spearce]

 www.refurbups.com seems to have decent deals on the larger APC's. They claim they put new batteries in every unit (hence the higher prices than most fleabay units). I personally haven't bought from them, but I often window shop there, and then find some other HTey thing to sink the money into.


I've got a ton of computers that would just die to have a good APC between them and our crappy power. They reboot far too much for my taste from low voltage drops.


I wouldn't use an APC in my theater though, my power isn't that bad. Yet.

 

[BizarroTerl]

I was able to pick up a couple of the APC Smart UPS 1400 rack mount in Black refurbished for $250 each. THose are gone. If you want a non rack mount version they still have those for $175. This is the link