Power Conditioning - How Important - Do You Use it?
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I got a Chang Lightspeed power conditioner and am very impressed at what it did for my system. It eliminated various turn-on pops , really lowered the noise floor on music sources and, on the video side, gave my monitor deeper blacks and more saturated color. I highly recommend getting a higher end power conditioner (Im not so sure the Monster and Panamax units are as effective)
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Quote:
In my opinion power conditioning is already a mandatory requirement for mid and hi-end A/V systems.
The external noise and interference attack is only expected to get worse, and by no small margin:
http://money.cnn.com/2004/10/15/tech...tlet/index.htm
| Originally posted by PeterS Setting up a fairly robust system. Interested in everyone's thoughts on Power Conditioning. Thanks |
The external noise and interference attack is only expected to get worse, and by no small margin:
http://money.cnn.com/2004/10/15/tech...tlet/index.htm
Oh no.
Not another thread about power conditioning. A few new posters have said that if there is nothing wrong with your power to begin with it won't cure anything.
With that said I have all of my equipment, except for the AVR, plugged into a power/line conditioner (tripplite LCR2400) fed by a dedicated 15 amp circuit.
It may be "snake oil" but I think it does help.
Just my .02 and YMMV.
Not another thread about power conditioning. A few new posters have said that if there is nothing wrong with your power to begin with it won't cure anything.
With that said I have all of my equipment, except for the AVR, plugged into a power/line conditioner (tripplite LCR2400) fed by a dedicated 15 amp circuit.
It may be "snake oil" but I think it does help.
Just my .02 and YMMV.
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I use an Equitech 2Q. It "balances" the AC from the wall, using common mode noise rejection which is one of the best ways to filter garbage from the AC line. Uses the same principal behind balanced interconnects. Here is a slightly more cost effective solution:
http://www.b-p-t.com/
http://www.b-p-t.com/
Kevin,
I just had installed 4 2Q Isolation Transformers from Equi=Tech. They currently have a special: $499 each and $449 for each thereafter!
The cooling unit next to it is for the equipment room (part of a mini-split system).
http://www.winglake.com/images/compo...t/100_0044.jpg
I just had installed 4 2Q Isolation Transformers from Equi=Tech. They currently have a special: $499 each and $449 for each thereafter!
The cooling unit next to it is for the equipment room (part of a mini-split system).
http://www.winglake.com/images/compo...t/100_0044.jpg
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Quote:
Single phase 120V AC from the wall is an unbalanced or single ended signal. The common mode noise will still exist even after it is converted to a balanced power signal. This noise can only be filtered out, which is exactly what Equi=Tech advertises:
"Separate EMI/RFI filtering of incoming standard/unbalanced AC and outgoing/balanced AC".
| Originally posted by Kevin C Brown I use an Equitech 2Q. It "balances" the AC from the wall, using common mode noise rejection which is one of the best ways to filter garbage from the AC line. http://www.b-p-t.com/ |
"Separate EMI/RFI filtering of incoming standard/unbalanced AC and outgoing/balanced AC".
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I also use the Monster HTPS 7000 Signature Series. I used to use the 3500, and found the 7000 to offer a slight increase in image quality, but quite a large difference in sound quality. A decent drop in the soundfloor, which for me was a crucial step in my system. Just this imporvment justifies the price in my mind. I would definitly recomend this unit, just don't hook up high power amps to it!
Down the road I hope to get the AVS 2000 SS, anyone have and opinions on this unit? Kevin, you have the AVS 2000, what effects would you say it had on your system?
Jared
Down the road I hope to get the AVS 2000 SS, anyone have and opinions on this unit? Kevin, you have the AVS 2000, what effects would you say it had on your system?
Jared
I got a deal on a MOnster HTPS whatever (it's MSRP for around $300) and thought it'd be nice just for looks and an easier way to plug everything in. But now my TV doesn't get messed up when I use an appliance like my microwave. The lights will flicker a bit when it turns off, but the TV stays the same- Not the most high-tech way to measure performance, but it works for me!
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Jeff- You rock. 
reincarnate- You are wrong, as usual. The "separate EMI/RFI filtering" is for the garbage the digital components hooked up to the 2Q throw back onto the AC line. Digital components are inherently dirty. Even if you look at most of the Monster boxes, there is extra EMI/RF filtering for the outlets designated as "digital" outlets vs analog outlets (for example, power amps, turntables, etc). That is to prevent that "hash" from getting back into the analog components through the AC box itself. Balancing the AC line is the most effective way to reduce noise. Period.
reincarnate- You are wrong, as usual. The "separate EMI/RFI filtering" is for the garbage the digital components hooked up to the 2Q throw back onto the AC line. Digital components are inherently dirty. Even if you look at most of the Monster boxes, there is extra EMI/RF filtering for the outlets designated as "digital" outlets vs analog outlets (for example, power amps, turntables, etc). That is to prevent that "hash" from getting back into the analog components through the AC box itself. Balancing the AC line is the most effective way to reduce noise. Period.
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Quote:
Does ignorance have to be spiteful? Has anyone else noticed that AVS Forum used to have better technical discussions? Instead we now substitute arrogance.
Kevin you took the simple Equitech quote out of context: Again, the complete quote from Equitech:
Separate EMI/RFI filtering of incoming standard/unbalanced AC and outgoing/balanced AC".
The sentence discusses filtering of both
1) incoming and
2) outgoing power signals
RFI generators sources are both internal (other components) and external (from the AC line). Both require filtering. Got it?
Monster Power essentially states the same points as Equitech. From my Monster 7000 power conditioner manual:
"Distortion that typically runs right through other surge protectors is attenuated. It simply isn't enough to only filter the noise on the incoming power line. That is why your PowerSource also features revolutionary separate isolation for digital, analog, and computer. If any internally-generated noise from an electronic product plugged into an outlet gets through our Clean Power noise filters, it still has to run through yet another filter! The result is high quality tone and sound that is free from performance-damaging interference.
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The important point (not stated in this thread) is that just using a transformer alone is not adequate enough, as my first post hinted at. The faraday shield helps to filter out frequencies up to about 100Khz but capacitive coupling between the primary and secondary windings allows RFI to pass largely unimpeded.
The balanced or isolation transformers in the Monster are triple shielded. Why? BTW, I find them to be just wonderful sonically. But I only use them for low power components.
Since Plitron transformers are under discussion, I will state my experience with them. I own their 2400 watt unit. It buzzes loudly. It causes the overall sound to darken and (especially the bass to) become softer. It even steps up the voltage to outside of the safe operating ranges. This causes my Monster 7000 to rightly generate an alarm. Needless to say the unit now sits in a corner upstairs unused. At least I only lost $350 thanks to the article from the experts at Secrets:
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...isclaimer.html
Coincidentally, now over a year later, the same author still complains of RFI induced symptoms:
"The sound has a smooth feel to it, rather than the sometimes edgy feel that 16/44 CDs have" in
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...r-10-2004.html
| Originally posted by Kevin C Brown reincarnate- You are wrong, as usual. Period. |
Kevin you took the simple Equitech quote out of context: Again, the complete quote from Equitech:
Separate EMI/RFI filtering of incoming standard/unbalanced AC and outgoing/balanced AC".
The sentence discusses filtering of both
1) incoming and
2) outgoing power signals
RFI generators sources are both internal (other components) and external (from the AC line). Both require filtering. Got it?
Monster Power essentially states the same points as Equitech. From my Monster 7000 power conditioner manual:
"Distortion that typically runs right through other surge protectors is attenuated. It simply isn't enough to only filter the noise on the incoming power line. That is why your PowerSource also features revolutionary separate isolation for digital, analog, and computer. If any internally-generated noise from an electronic product plugged into an outlet gets through our Clean Power noise filters, it still has to run through yet another filter! The result is high quality tone and sound that is free from performance-damaging interference.
-------------
The important point (not stated in this thread) is that just using a transformer alone is not adequate enough, as my first post hinted at. The faraday shield helps to filter out frequencies up to about 100Khz but capacitive coupling between the primary and secondary windings allows RFI to pass largely unimpeded.
The balanced or isolation transformers in the Monster are triple shielded. Why? BTW, I find them to be just wonderful sonically. But I only use them for low power components.
Since Plitron transformers are under discussion, I will state my experience with them. I own their 2400 watt unit. It buzzes loudly. It causes the overall sound to darken and (especially the bass to) become softer. It even steps up the voltage to outside of the safe operating ranges. This causes my Monster 7000 to rightly generate an alarm. Needless to say the unit now sits in a corner upstairs unused. At least I only lost $350 thanks to the article from the experts at Secrets:
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...isclaimer.html
Coincidentally, now over a year later, the same author still complains of RFI induced symptoms:
"The sound has a smooth feel to it, rather than the sometimes edgy feel that 16/44 CDs have" in
http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...r-10-2004.html
Jake,
Last time I checked the monster units say they don't, but they really do. Of course my example is extreme, my amp is pushing 600w/channel into 4ohm speakers. If I do plug my cinenova into a surge protector of any sorts it voids the 10y warranty.
I have my halo a23 hooked into my HTPS 7000, and cannot hear much of a difference betwen this, and hooking it in straight to the wall outlet. As for the cinenova, everything sounded constrained when hooked through the 7000, and it was messing with my tv, the tv was dimming slightly at peaks in movies. Now I have it hooked into it's own dedicated 20 amp line, and no longer have any of the problems I had when it was hooked through the 7000, or even when it was on the same line as the rest of the system.
I believe that all of the monster units that are clean power stage 2 v2 and above have a high current section, which is not supposed to restrict current flow.
So with that said, the unit is not supposed to restrict current flow, but from my experience, it will with high powered amps.
Jared
Last time I checked the monster units say they don't, but they really do. Of course my example is extreme, my amp is pushing 600w/channel into 4ohm speakers. If I do plug my cinenova into a surge protector of any sorts it voids the 10y warranty.
I have my halo a23 hooked into my HTPS 7000, and cannot hear much of a difference betwen this, and hooking it in straight to the wall outlet. As for the cinenova, everything sounded constrained when hooked through the 7000, and it was messing with my tv, the tv was dimming slightly at peaks in movies. Now I have it hooked into it's own dedicated 20 amp line, and no longer have any of the problems I had when it was hooked through the 7000, or even when it was on the same line as the rest of the system.
I believe that all of the monster units that are clean power stage 2 v2 and above have a high current section, which is not supposed to restrict current flow.
So with that said, the unit is not supposed to restrict current flow, but from my experience, it will with high powered amps.
Jared
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